4 ms·

The hamburger menu would be fine, even great, if it was a standard menu that every mobile app had in the same place with the same look [0]. But its purpose, pos

by layer8 1y ago

The hamburger menu would be fine, even great, if it was a standard menu that every mobile app had in the same place with the same look [0]. But its purpose, positioning, and look is different in every app, so it’s just one more thing to click on to see what it does. It also doesn’t make sense as soon as you have more than one menu [1], or on the desktop — mostly because a single menu rarely makes sense on the desktop, and because an icon tends to be a much smaller pointer target compared to a regular labeled menu, for such a main entry point. [0] like in Windows 1.0, I guess: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/4e/Windows1.0.png https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/4e/Windows1.0.pn... [1] unless it’s a secondary but universal menu like the Windows system menu in [0]

xg15 1y ago
On that matter, I don't get Android's design trajectory: They used to have exactly that: A standard button in the OS for the app context menu, on some devices even a physical button. For some reason, they got rid of it in newer versions, so every interested app has to implement it itself, which of course causes to UI to become wildly inconsistent between apps. I don't understand why.
- izacus 1y ago
  That was 15 years ago.
- fidotron 1y ago
  They had enough fun getting app developers to support the back button properly, let alone the context menu! In truth Android has suffered from the fact everyone starts on iOS first and then ports to Android, screen by screen in many cases, meaning accommodation of Android specific UI flows simply doesn't happen. The removal of physical buttons was largely motivated by OEMs wanting to eliminate moving parts which make things far more expensive to build/test than simply one slightly bigger capacitive touchscreen.
  - skrtskrt 1y ago
    physical buttons are also a pain for waterproofing
  - tdeck 1y ago
    I'm pretty sure on most phones those buttons were just an extension of the digitizer / touchscreen backlight.
- Kwpolska 1y ago
  The problem with the old Android menu button was that you never knew whether or not there was a menu, and what would be in the menu. Some apps had navigation, some had actions. Some apps had different things on different screens. The usual pattern on Android nowadays is that hamburgers go on the left, actions go on the right. And an on-screen button is much more obvious than a hardware key, or something on the never changing bottom bar.
DidYaWipe 1y ago
I recently had to resume using Windows extensively after a long hiatus, and the regressions I had already noticed in occasional use remain an infuriating PITA every damned day. It's not a matter of adjustment to something different. It's a matter of incompetent UI. The elimination of the standard menu bar in one application after another is a huge one. Look at Edge: I wanted to save a PDF I was viewing. Fat chance. There's no menu. In the toolbar past the URL box there's a jagged Pac-Man that I guess is supposed to be yet another "gear" icon. Then there's a star with lines in it for "favorites" and then your own avatar and then three dots with a tiny upward pink arrow overlapping part of one of them. In the upper-left corner of the window there are more boxy icons... let's see what those are... "Workspaces" and "Tab actions menu." So is "save file" under Gear-Man, the three dots, or somewhere else? And BTW, WHAT APPLICATION IS THIS? You have no idea which window belongs to which one, because the title bars are missing. What a truly incredible, pathetic mess. The Mac's single menu bar is a UI blunder, but NO menu bar is monumentally stupid.
- pigeons 1y ago
  Somewhere along the way I have lost title bars to know the title of each tab in my browser, whether firefox or brave. I don't know if I need to set it in the browser, or kde, or kwin, i also tried microsoft windows and the same behavior.
  - nyanpasu64 1y ago
    In Firefox if you right-click the title bar and "Customize Toolbar..." you can check Title Bar.
- jimjimjim 1y ago
  Thank you for putting in words what has been subconsciously annoying me about modernized windows applications. It seems like they are consistently worse with no recognizable improvements. Who is to blame? Is it the UI people wanting a "clean" look or is it misguided UX people?
  - DidYaWipe 1y ago
mystified5016 1y ago
I've seen apps with a hambuger, gear, and ellipsis button all on the front page. Why? For what possible reason? I truly don't understand why we do this to ourselves.

by layer8 1y ago

xg15 1y ago

On that matter, I don't get Android's design trajectory: They used to have exactly that: A standard button in the OS for the app context menu, on some devices even a physical button. For some reason, they got rid of it in newer versions, so every interested app has to implement it itself, which of course causes to UI to become wildly inconsistent between apps. I don't understand why.

izacus 1y ago
That was 15 years ago.
fidotron 1y ago
They had enough fun getting app developers to support the back button properly, let alone the context menu! In truth Android has suffered from the fact everyone starts on iOS first and then ports to Android, screen by screen in many cases, meaning accommodation of Android specific UI flows simply doesn't happen. The removal of physical buttons was largely motivated by OEMs wanting to eliminate moving parts which make things far more expensive to build/test than simply one slightly bigger capacitive touchscreen.
- skrtskrt 1y ago
  physical buttons are also a pain for waterproofing
- tdeck 1y ago
  I'm pretty sure on most phones those buttons were just an extension of the digitizer / touchscreen backlight.
Kwpolska 1y ago
The problem with the old Android menu button was that you never knew whether or not there was a menu, and what would be in the menu. Some apps had navigation, some had actions. Some apps had different things on different screens. The usual pattern on Android nowadays is that hamburgers go on the left, actions go on the right. And an on-screen button is much more obvious than a hardware key, or something on the never changing bottom bar.

DidYaWipe 1y ago

I recently had to resume using Windows extensively after a long hiatus, and the regressions I had already noticed in occasional use remain an infuriating PITA every damned day. It's not a matter of adjustment to something different. It's a matter of incompetent UI. The elimination of the standard menu bar in one application after another is a huge one. Look at Edge: I wanted to save a PDF I was viewing. Fat chance. There's no menu. In the toolbar past the URL box there's a jagged Pac-Man that I guess is supposed to be yet another "gear" icon. Then there's a star with lines in it for "favorites" and then your own avatar and then three dots with a tiny upward pink arrow overlapping part of one of them. In the upper-left corner of the window there are more boxy icons... let's see what those are... "Workspaces" and "Tab actions menu." So is "save file" under Gear-Man, the three dots, or somewhere else? And BTW, WHAT APPLICATION IS THIS? You have no idea which window belongs to which one, because the title bars are missing. What a truly incredible, pathetic mess. The Mac's single menu bar is a UI blunder, but NO menu bar is monumentally stupid.

pigeons 1y ago
Somewhere along the way I have lost title bars to know the title of each tab in my browser, whether firefox or brave. I don't know if I need to set it in the browser, or kde, or kwin, i also tried microsoft windows and the same behavior.
- nyanpasu64 1y ago
  In Firefox if you right-click the title bar and "Customize Toolbar..." you can check Title Bar.
jimjimjim 1y ago
Thank you for putting in words what has been subconsciously annoying me about modernized windows applications. It seems like they are consistently worse with no recognizable improvements. Who is to blame? Is it the UI people wanting a "clean" look or is it misguided UX people?
- DidYaWipe 1y ago

mystified5016 1y ago

I've seen apps with a hambuger, gear, and ellipsis button all on the front page. Why? For what possible reason? I truly don't understand why we do this to ourselves.