5 ms·

Semi-rant: I’m very disappointed to see such wide adoption of pets, especially dogs, as “replacements” of children in adult lives. I do not think it’s healthy

Semi-rant: I’m very disappointed to see such wide adoption of pets, especially dogs, as “replacements” of children in adult lives. I do not think it’s healthy for adults to do this because it infantilizes the adult. It is actually very sad, almost pitiful to see it happen. I think pets are wonderful for children because it helps them to develop a connection with living beings that aren’t humans, to see emotions are a universal trait. More frequently I see now grown people wheeling their dogs in baby carriages. If this is some cosmic-scale humor by nature because we have overpopulated the planet and it’s intentionally sabotaging the environment, then I’m afraid the joke is on us.

creata 1y ago
Can you elaborate on how it "infantilizes the adult"?
- nkrisc 1y ago
  That confused me a bit too, but what I suspect is that owning a pet is kind of like having a permanent baby, but without many of the real challenges a human child presents. Your dog can be cute and child-like and playful for its entire life, but is also far more self-sufficient than a human child is in the first year or two of its life. It’s kind of like you get to be a make-believe parent without any of the difficult parts.
  - NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago
    >That confused me a bit too, but what I suspect is that owning a pet is kind of like having a permanent baby, No, he's saying that having a puppy is something a child does, something that's normal for children. If you're doing things that only children should be doing, you are infantilizing yourself (changing your brain in ways that prevents you from growing up properly).
nkrisc 1y ago
Advertising to pet owners is reaching absurd levels. Pet owners are now “pet parents” and the marketing is basically identical to marketing directed at new (real) parents. While there are some surface level similarities to owning a pet and having children, it’s absurd to conflate the two as if they are equivalent.
- creata 1y ago
  I don't think most people using silly terms like "pet parents" are actually conflating parenthood with caring for a pet.
  - nkrisc 1y ago
    I don’t know what percentage are sincere about it, but I have absolutely heard it used in advertising in ways that seemed completely straight-faced.
  - afavour 1y ago
    Not most but there definitely is a weird subculture out there. The /r/petfree subreddit is hysterical in the opposite direction at times but there is some fascinating content on there sometimes. An example: a social media post of someone mourning their child's death, folks commenting about the death of their pets as if it were comparable: https://www.reddit.com/r/petfree/comments/1kzlt3o/people_arguing_about_animals_being_better_than/ https://www.reddit.com/r/petfree/comments/1kzlt3o/people_arg... > My three year old killed by a drunk driver. A lady said I know how you feel, my dog died last year > Idk about you but I loved my dogs more than anything. I felt guilty for a long time bc I sobbed for days after each was put down but didn't cry at my cousin or grandfather's funeral > I loved my dog and mom exactly the same, and their deaths both felt the same > It's been scientifically proven that a dog death can effect you more than a human one
    - absurdo 1y ago
      Why would someone go out of their way to make r/petfree to demonize pet owners is beyond me. But hey, that’s the internet nowadays I guess. Rage fueled machine.
guywithahat 1y ago
I have the same thought; it messes with peoples value systems and just isn't healthy for a lot of people. I wouldn't say it ruins lives but people will do nothing but work and tend to their 3 dogs, which inhibits personal development or meaningful progress in life. Plus nobody enforces a lot of health and safety laws anymore, it's not uncommon to see dogs in grocery stores for example, despite it being illegal and gross.
- XorNot 1y ago
  Personal development and progress of ... what? What are people not building too that you think they should? What have you built that's so great?
- technothrasher 1y ago
  > people will do nothing but work and tend to their 3 dogs, which inhibits personal development or meaningful progress in life. If that connection with their dogs is what brings them personal fulfillment, why is that not meaningful? And can they not personally develop within that chosen life path?
- I-M-S 1y ago
  Dunno, if the alternative is actively destructive behaviour, it might be good for society for people to find meaning in pets. It's also good for those individuals and animals in question as well. I'm not sure we're missing out on many Requiems, Anna Kareninas, and Space Odysseys because of it.
- __turbobrew__ 1y ago
  > personal development or meaningful progress in life What exactly are people not achieving when they have a dog? I bought my first home in my twenties, have a very high paying job, I have good friends, I play music sometimes, I grow my own food, I can cook better than most restaurants, I am happy most of the time, I am reasonably physically fit and can climb a mountain (literally). What meaningful progress is my dog holding me back from?
  - guywithahat 1y ago
TheBigSalad 1y ago
That's an interesting perspective. As an adult who has both human children and many pets, I disagree that your premise that pets are only valuable for children. We come from cave people who live in big family groups. Modern humans are more isolated and live in relatively small houses, without their extended families. I think it's only natural for us to want to care for animals. And just because a dog isn't as smart, and can't talk doesn't mean it can't be a real friend.
- absurdo 1y ago
  > I disagree that your premise that pets are only valuable for children. Where did you get this premise from?
  - yoyohello13 1y ago
    > I do not think it’s healthy for adults to do this because it infantilizes the adult. ... I think pets are wonderful for children because it helps them to develop a connection with living beings that aren’t humans This quote heavily implies pets are bad for adults. Maybe it wasn't your intent.
  - kirtakat 1y ago
    Not who you were responding to, but in your original statement you wrote "I do not think it’s healthy for adults to do this [sic] I think pets are wonderful for children" By explicitly calling out that "[they] are wonderful for children" you are implicitly calling into question their value for adults. Whether that was your intention or not, it's certainly how I read your statement.
- NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago
  >I disagree that your premise that pets are only valuable for children. On r/poveryfinance and similar subreddits, one can always find someone complaining that they're about to become homeless because they can't afford rent, begging others to please tell them what line item can be cut from their budget to make it work, the conceit being that they consider every item essential. Mixed in among the electrical and water and costs of commuting to work will be $100/month for dog food or cat litter or whatever. Not only is there no value there, there is, quite often, anti-value. And this is just the quantifiable stuff, these people follow their dogs around picking up their feces with their hands.
ecshafer 1y ago
Dogs shouldnt be in grocery stores, bars or restaurants.
- amanaplanacanal 1y ago
  Have you seen the other people in there? How are the dogs worse?
bloomingeek 1y ago
Almost anything, humane, to lower the earth's population, is fine by me. Do some people go a little overboard? Certainly. Are they having fun and not hurting anyone else at the same time? Excellent! I think the only entity sabotaging the environment is we humans. Nature deals with what it's given by adapting. I do think the baby carriages are hilarious, unless it's a geriatric pet.
tcoff91 1y ago
Most of the time a dog is in a stroller it’s because the dog is old or injured. I don’t think many people do it just to make the dog seem more like a child.
- theonething 1y ago
  Not in my observations. Where I am, people put their little dogs in strollers, dress them up with hair clips, etc and stroll them around while they're shopping at Macy's etc.
  - absurdo 1y ago
    This is predominantly what I have also seen.
- eloisius 1y ago
  You should see east Asia. There are more dog strollers than baby strollers.
NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago
>If this is some cosmic-scale humor by nature I would not blame nature for this. I'm not particularly conspiracy-minded (humans are generally too stupid for supervillain-style conspiracies), but people did this. The only question at all is whether they did it deliberately, or if it was accidental. >then I’m afraid the joke is on us. It's definitely on us.
iugtmkbdfil834 1y ago
I am sympathetic to this view even if I think it understates the value pets may bring. I do agree that people, as they tend to do, push the limits on what is socially acceptable to some silly degree, but, I also accept, that as long they don't hurt anyone in the process, it might be ok. The issue is.. pets are still pets. And to your point, unbehaved dog can be dangerous to its immediate surrounding. I won't go into details, but our dog is very protective of our kid, so there are places I will not take it ( or at least not without precautions ).. and this is what I see less and less: responsible behavior. But I will say this, dog was a great training for a kid, when it came for us, because we saw some very similar issues repeat themselves. The issue is what it has always been: people.
- absurdo 1y ago
  I avoided going into all the myriad of things that pets are good for because it’s not the point. I grew up with a small backyard graveyard of all the pets I’ve had over the years, some given some adopted some stray, so I’m very far from anti-pet. What I’m really poking at here in the joke behind the rant sort of way is a suspicion, a conspiracy by nature to suppress our reproduction capabilities by slowly not only making us infertile in greater numbers, but steering us towards adopting pets instead of humans as a prank, to make us see the animals we are in an animal kingdom.
  - iugtmkbdfil834 1y ago
    Interesting, I will admit that I missed that interpretation, but the coffee still didn't kick in yet. In that sense, it would be an interesting expansion on the jokes of Carlin ( how would planet deal with such unhealthy surface nuissance? ). I did internally chuckle so thank you for this morning smile.
notesinthefield 1y ago
I wonder what you think people who dont have children and opt for pets thought about or went through prior to making that decision? I personally dont care for children and cannot think of a universe in which I would want to be a parent - why would I want the stress and strain of coddling a child for two decades?

creata 1y ago

Can you elaborate on how it "infantilizes the adult"?

nkrisc 1y ago
That confused me a bit too, but what I suspect is that owning a pet is kind of like having a permanent baby, but without many of the real challenges a human child presents. Your dog can be cute and child-like and playful for its entire life, but is also far more self-sufficient than a human child is in the first year or two of its life. It’s kind of like you get to be a make-believe parent without any of the difficult parts.
- NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago
  >That confused me a bit too, but what I suspect is that owning a pet is kind of like having a permanent baby, No, he's saying that having a puppy is something a child does, something that's normal for children. If you're doing things that only children should be doing, you are infantilizing yourself (changing your brain in ways that prevents you from growing up properly).

nkrisc 1y ago

Advertising to pet owners is reaching absurd levels. Pet owners are now “pet parents” and the marketing is basically identical to marketing directed at new (real) parents. While there are some surface level similarities to owning a pet and having children, it’s absurd to conflate the two as if they are equivalent.

creata 1y ago
I don't think most people using silly terms like "pet parents" are actually conflating parenthood with caring for a pet.
- nkrisc 1y ago
  I don’t know what percentage are sincere about it, but I have absolutely heard it used in advertising in ways that seemed completely straight-faced.
- afavour 1y ago
  Not most but there definitely is a weird subculture out there. The /r/petfree subreddit is hysterical in the opposite direction at times but there is some fascinating content on there sometimes. An example: a social media post of someone mourning their child's death, folks commenting about the death of their pets as if it were comparable: https://www.reddit.com/r/petfree/comments/1kzlt3o/people_arguing_about_animals_being_better_than/ https://www.reddit.com/r/petfree/comments/1kzlt3o/people_arg... > My three year old killed by a drunk driver. A lady said I know how you feel, my dog died last year > Idk about you but I loved my dogs more than anything. I felt guilty for a long time bc I sobbed for days after each was put down but didn't cry at my cousin or grandfather's funeral > I loved my dog and mom exactly the same, and their deaths both felt the same > It's been scientifically proven that a dog death can effect you more than a human one
  - absurdo 1y ago
    Why would someone go out of their way to make r/petfree to demonize pet owners is beyond me. But hey, that’s the internet nowadays I guess. Rage fueled machine.

guywithahat 1y ago

I have the same thought; it messes with peoples value systems and just isn't healthy for a lot of people. I wouldn't say it ruins lives but people will do nothing but work and tend to their 3 dogs, which inhibits personal development or meaningful progress in life. Plus nobody enforces a lot of health and safety laws anymore, it's not uncommon to see dogs in grocery stores for example, despite it being illegal and gross.

XorNot 1y ago
Personal development and progress of ... what? What are people not building too that you think they should? What have you built that's so great?
technothrasher 1y ago
> people will do nothing but work and tend to their 3 dogs, which inhibits personal development or meaningful progress in life. If that connection with their dogs is what brings them personal fulfillment, why is that not meaningful? And can they not personally develop within that chosen life path?
I-M-S 1y ago
Dunno, if the alternative is actively destructive behaviour, it might be good for society for people to find meaning in pets. It's also good for those individuals and animals in question as well. I'm not sure we're missing out on many Requiems, Anna Kareninas, and Space Odysseys because of it.
__turbobrew__ 1y ago
> personal development or meaningful progress in life What exactly are people not achieving when they have a dog? I bought my first home in my twenties, have a very high paying job, I have good friends, I play music sometimes, I grow my own food, I can cook better than most restaurants, I am happy most of the time, I am reasonably physically fit and can climb a mountain (literally). What meaningful progress is my dog holding me back from?
- guywithahat 1y ago

TheBigSalad 1y ago

That's an interesting perspective. As an adult who has both human children and many pets, I disagree that your premise that pets are only valuable for children. We come from cave people who live in big family groups. Modern humans are more isolated and live in relatively small houses, without their extended families. I think it's only natural for us to want to care for animals. And just because a dog isn't as smart, and can't talk doesn't mean it can't be a real friend.

absurdo 1y ago
> I disagree that your premise that pets are only valuable for children. Where did you get this premise from?
- yoyohello13 1y ago
  > I do not think it’s healthy for adults to do this because it infantilizes the adult. ... I think pets are wonderful for children because it helps them to develop a connection with living beings that aren’t humans This quote heavily implies pets are bad for adults. Maybe it wasn't your intent.
- kirtakat 1y ago
  Not who you were responding to, but in your original statement you wrote "I do not think it’s healthy for adults to do this [sic] I think pets are wonderful for children" By explicitly calling out that "[they] are wonderful for children" you are implicitly calling into question their value for adults. Whether that was your intention or not, it's certainly how I read your statement.
NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago
>I disagree that your premise that pets are only valuable for children. On r/poveryfinance and similar subreddits, one can always find someone complaining that they're about to become homeless because they can't afford rent, begging others to please tell them what line item can be cut from their budget to make it work, the conceit being that they consider every item essential. Mixed in among the electrical and water and costs of commuting to work will be $100/month for dog food or cat litter or whatever. Not only is there no value there, there is, quite often, anti-value. And this is just the quantifiable stuff, these people follow their dogs around picking up their feces with their hands.

ecshafer 1y ago

Dogs shouldnt be in grocery stores, bars or restaurants.

amanaplanacanal 1y ago
Have you seen the other people in there? How are the dogs worse?

bloomingeek 1y ago

Almost anything, humane, to lower the earth's population, is fine by me. Do some people go a little overboard? Certainly. Are they having fun and not hurting anyone else at the same time? Excellent! I think the only entity sabotaging the environment is we humans. Nature deals with what it's given by adapting. I do think the baby carriages are hilarious, unless it's a geriatric pet.

tcoff91 1y ago

Most of the time a dog is in a stroller it’s because the dog is old or injured. I don’t think many people do it just to make the dog seem more like a child.

theonething 1y ago
Not in my observations. Where I am, people put their little dogs in strollers, dress them up with hair clips, etc and stroll them around while they're shopping at Macy's etc.
- absurdo 1y ago
  This is predominantly what I have also seen.
eloisius 1y ago
You should see east Asia. There are more dog strollers than baby strollers.

NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago

>If this is some cosmic-scale humor by nature I would not blame nature for this. I'm not particularly conspiracy-minded (humans are generally too stupid for supervillain-style conspiracies), but people did this. The only question at all is whether they did it deliberately, or if it was accidental. >then I’m afraid the joke is on us. It's definitely on us.

iugtmkbdfil834 1y ago

I am sympathetic to this view even if I think it understates the value pets may bring. I do agree that people, as they tend to do, push the limits on what is socially acceptable to some silly degree, but, I also accept, that as long they don't hurt anyone in the process, it might be ok. The issue is.. pets are still pets. And to your point, unbehaved dog can be dangerous to its immediate surrounding. I won't go into details, but our dog is very protective of our kid, so there are places I will not take it ( or at least not without precautions ).. and this is what I see less and less: responsible behavior. But I will say this, dog was a great training for a kid, when it came for us, because we saw some very similar issues repeat themselves. The issue is what it has always been: people.

absurdo 1y ago
I avoided going into all the myriad of things that pets are good for because it’s not the point. I grew up with a small backyard graveyard of all the pets I’ve had over the years, some given some adopted some stray, so I’m very far from anti-pet. What I’m really poking at here in the joke behind the rant sort of way is a suspicion, a conspiracy by nature to suppress our reproduction capabilities by slowly not only making us infertile in greater numbers, but steering us towards adopting pets instead of humans as a prank, to make us see the animals we are in an animal kingdom.
- iugtmkbdfil834 1y ago
  Interesting, I will admit that I missed that interpretation, but the coffee still didn't kick in yet. In that sense, it would be an interesting expansion on the jokes of Carlin ( how would planet deal with such unhealthy surface nuissance? ). I did internally chuckle so thank you for this morning smile.

notesinthefield 1y ago

I wonder what you think people who dont have children and opt for pets thought about or went through prior to making that decision? I personally dont care for children and cannot think of a universe in which I would want to be a parent - why would I want the stress and strain of coddling a child for two decades?