4 ms·

A modern diet is a restrictive diet. We live in a time when half of our produced food is thrown away. That's why veganism makes so much sense nowadays. Nothing

by chneu 1y ago

A modern diet is a restrictive diet. We live in a time when half of our produced food is thrown away. That's why veganism makes so much sense nowadays. Nothing about the modern diet is "natural" for most people. Meat was awesome when calories were sparse/intermittent. Now it's just excess for the sake of a status symbol. Same can be said about a lot of our foods.

gruez 1y ago
>We live in a time when half of our produced food is thrown away. I don't see how this is a relevant fact. If we threw away 10x the food does that make our diet even more unhealthy? Moreover if technological innovations like refrigeration decreases food waste, does that magically make our diet healthy again? >That's why veganism makes so much sense nowadays. Nothing about the modern diet is "natural" for most people. >Meat was awesome when calories were sparse/intermittent. Now it's just excess for the sake of a status symbol. Same can be said about a lot of our foods. If you turn back the clock even more (ie. pre-agriculture), you'd probably see the reverse (ie. more meat consumption).
- sleight42 1y ago
  > If you turn back the clock even more (ie. pre-agriculture), you'd probably see the reverse (ie. more meat consumption). I believe you're agreeing with the comment you're commenting on. Before calories were easily available, meat was the most reliable form of protein and fat in most environments.
- chneu 1y ago
  >If you turn back the clock even more (ie. pre-agriculture), you'd probably see the reverse (ie. more meat consumption). I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. Or really your entire reply doesn't make much sense. Pre-agriculture people starved on a regular basis. Calories were scarce in general which is why meat was important. It was a calorie and nutrient bomb when those were irregular/hard to come by. And even then their diets were primarily plant based, think about 80%. Analysis of human scat remains has repeatedly confirmed that ancient diets were primarily plant based. Most of this research comes from academia in countries not obsessed with beef(not the US). Modern misinformation directly contradicts fact in this area and much of it is driven by cattle/dairy industries and bro-science marketing that the carnivore diet makes ya stronk/patriotic/manly. In reality, the meat heavy western diet is associated with a long list of preventable diseases and ailments. Gotta love heart attacks at 40 yrs old cuz of these beef heavy diets. Which is easier(and burns less calories) to harvest: an animal you have to spend hours tracking/killing/processing or stationary plants you can forage throughout the day? Remember, they didn't have guns, vehicles, etc. This was spears and running in the elements. >I don't see how this is a relevant fact. Meat was great when calories and nutrients were scarce. Nobody is denying that. However, we live in 2025, not 10000BC, which means calories and nutrients are so abundant to the point we throw away half of what we produce. This means the benefit of meat is no longer a benefit.
nradov 1y ago
Meat is awesome when you need an optimal mix of nutrients — not just empty calories. Of course it's certainly possible to get the right proportions of macronutrients and sufficient micronutrients on a vegan diet but it takes a lot more planning and attention to detail.
- aziaziazi 1y ago
  > an optimal mix of nutrients not much: meats lacks A. fibers and B. carbohydrate. Some can argue removing B isn't a bad idea, it certainly is quire restrictive. Removing A. have many short and long terms effects that are not very desirable. Therefore most meat eaters also eat thinks like vegetables, beans, grains etc... which "unbalance" the "right proportions" (if that exist) of meat. It's very hard to achieve near perfect macro and micro nutriments if not with an artificial and perfectly calculated meals taking into account daily physical activity, psychological state, temperature, infections exposure etc... I'm not even sure ISS guys get such a calculation. > sufficient micronutrients This is easily done by eating plenty of plants -which is exactly what non meat eaters do- and a pill of B12. One can count but it's not more necessary than if they want a perfectly balanced meat diet, which also have its "problems" when not perfectly balanced.
swat535 1y ago
How does veganism help in this case? The problem is not meat, the problem is junk food, high sugar and carbs. If by "veganism", you simply mean healthy diet, then I agree.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- chneu 1y ago
  Think of it this way: Meat is a junk food. It's a calorie bomb that lacks essential macronutrients, fiber being a key one. Without managing your intake it leads to health problems. It can be addictive("But meat is soooo delicious I could never give it up"). It's not necessary for your survival; it is optional in 2025. Sure sounds like a junk food. Then there is the long list of benefits of giving up meat. Not just for you but the environment, which means it benefits every living creature on the planet.

by chneu 1y ago

gruez 1y ago

>We live in a time when half of our produced food is thrown away. I don't see how this is a relevant fact. If we threw away 10x the food does that make our diet even more unhealthy? Moreover if technological innovations like refrigeration decreases food waste, does that magically make our diet healthy again? >That's why veganism makes so much sense nowadays. Nothing about the modern diet is "natural" for most people. >Meat was awesome when calories were sparse/intermittent. Now it's just excess for the sake of a status symbol. Same can be said about a lot of our foods. If you turn back the clock even more (ie. pre-agriculture), you'd probably see the reverse (ie. more meat consumption).

sleight42 1y ago
> If you turn back the clock even more (ie. pre-agriculture), you'd probably see the reverse (ie. more meat consumption). I believe you're agreeing with the comment you're commenting on. Before calories were easily available, meat was the most reliable form of protein and fat in most environments.
chneu 1y ago
>If you turn back the clock even more (ie. pre-agriculture), you'd probably see the reverse (ie. more meat consumption). I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. Or really your entire reply doesn't make much sense. Pre-agriculture people starved on a regular basis. Calories were scarce in general which is why meat was important. It was a calorie and nutrient bomb when those were irregular/hard to come by. And even then their diets were primarily plant based, think about 80%. Analysis of human scat remains has repeatedly confirmed that ancient diets were primarily plant based. Most of this research comes from academia in countries not obsessed with beef(not the US). Modern misinformation directly contradicts fact in this area and much of it is driven by cattle/dairy industries and bro-science marketing that the carnivore diet makes ya stronk/patriotic/manly. In reality, the meat heavy western diet is associated with a long list of preventable diseases and ailments. Gotta love heart attacks at 40 yrs old cuz of these beef heavy diets. Which is easier(and burns less calories) to harvest: an animal you have to spend hours tracking/killing/processing or stationary plants you can forage throughout the day? Remember, they didn't have guns, vehicles, etc. This was spears and running in the elements. >I don't see how this is a relevant fact. Meat was great when calories and nutrients were scarce. Nobody is denying that. However, we live in 2025, not 10000BC, which means calories and nutrients are so abundant to the point we throw away half of what we produce. This means the benefit of meat is no longer a benefit.

nradov 1y ago

Meat is awesome when you need an optimal mix of nutrients — not just empty calories. Of course it's certainly possible to get the right proportions of macronutrients and sufficient micronutrients on a vegan diet but it takes a lot more planning and attention to detail.

aziaziazi 1y ago
> an optimal mix of nutrients not much: meats lacks A. fibers and B. carbohydrate. Some can argue removing B isn't a bad idea, it certainly is quire restrictive. Removing A. have many short and long terms effects that are not very desirable. Therefore most meat eaters also eat thinks like vegetables, beans, grains etc... which "unbalance" the "right proportions" (if that exist) of meat. It's very hard to achieve near perfect macro and micro nutriments if not with an artificial and perfectly calculated meals taking into account daily physical activity, psychological state, temperature, infections exposure etc... I'm not even sure ISS guys get such a calculation. > sufficient micronutrients This is easily done by eating plenty of plants -which is exactly what non meat eaters do- and a pill of B12. One can count but it's not more necessary than if they want a perfectly balanced meat diet, which also have its "problems" when not perfectly balanced.

swat535 1y ago

How does veganism help in this case? The problem is not meat, the problem is junk food, high sugar and carbs. If by "veganism", you simply mean healthy diet, then I agree.

deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
chneu 1y ago
Think of it this way: Meat is a junk food. It's a calorie bomb that lacks essential macronutrients, fiber being a key one. Without managing your intake it leads to health problems. It can be addictive("But meat is soooo delicious I could never give it up"). It's not necessary for your survival; it is optional in 2025. Sure sounds like a junk food. Then there is the long list of benefits of giving up meat. Not just for you but the environment, which means it benefits every living creature on the planet.