3 ms·

There will be follow-on effects, too. Like "wellness" ending up on the same tier as "medicine". Without the research, who's to say? This will also compound the

There will be follow-on effects, too. Like "wellness" ending up on the same tier as "medicine". Without the research, who's to say? This will also compound the Qanon fascination with "medical freedom", where the patient gets to dictate to the doctor what to do (i.e. use ivermectin against COVID, or whatever other superstition rises to the top of the Qanon imagination cauldron).

lentoutcry 1y ago
yep. I don't wanna be in the shoes of the doctors who'll have to deal with this. although I suspect a part of them will resign, leading to even more "fun" downstream effects
sorokod 1y ago
A TIL, Medical freedom. Very likely those opinions will be shaped by social media and LLMs steering in turn public health policies, plugging into politics and back to start. A neat vertically integrated system.
mystraline 1y ago
> This will also compound the Qanon fascination with "medical freedom", where the patient gets to dictate to the doctor what to do (i.e. use ivermectin against COVID, or whatever other superstition rises to the top of the Qanon imagination cauldron). That's very double-edged. The open question is should humans have the right to take substances individually? Sure, you get Ivermectin/covid deniers. But you also get homemade Solvaldi (cure for Hepatitis C). I can make it for $300 for the 12 week course, and it retail costs $84000 Of course, even making and taking this drug you manufacture is illegal, even aside patent bullshit. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42538903 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42538903 But why shouldn't I be able to treat myself? Why do we accept really shitty gatekeepers (medical establishment, doctors) gatekeep treatments and cures from us? And more currently, now that der fuhrer quit the emergency use allocation for Covid shots, now you need a doctors scrip for 'allowing to get a vaccine'. I should be able to get this if I pay for it. But nope, now need to pay for needless doctor payment and more barriers. So at least in that side, I'm on Qanon's view that I should be able to personally treat myself with whatever substance I deem. Of course, I'll definitely heed a doctor's suggestion as an expert. But fuck.. My body, my choice.
- sorokod 1y ago
  > But why shouldn't I be able to treat myself? Consider this analogy: you should be allowed to put a gun to your own head and pull the trigger. You should not be allowed to put on a suicide vest and blow yourself up in a group of people.
  - mystraline 1y ago
    To the first, yes, I do believe that we humans SHOULD have a right to commit suicide. It should be a right to end your own life. We have a 'right' drink a handle of whiskey a day, up to the point we get liver disease. Same with smoking 3 packs a day of cigarettes. Same with horrendous diet. But those ways of killing yourself are "acceptable" and also legal. But they're slower. The second, you're harming other people. That example is blatantly ridiculous, and appears just to gain an emotional response by invoking terrorism.
    - sorokod 1y ago
      "you're harming other people", yes as in the case where you are contagious.
      - bigbadfeline 1y ago
        > "you're harming other people", yes as in the case where you are contagious. Have you watched a movie lately? Talk about contagious violence. I can tell you this, your fate is just a blip on the back side of other people's large screen TV where the movies are shown.
- Spivak 1y ago
  I go further and say that you should be able to buy any drug from the pharmacy without a prescription*. As well as testing kits. Having to have an ongoing relationship with a doctor just to refill your medication or get antibiotics when you get strep is a huge waste of everyone's time and money. And there are countries where you can already do this and they haven't collapsed. It makes the job of pharmacist actually matter as someone other than a pill counter. It ends so many stupid discussions we have in the US. Can this medication be prescribed for an off-label use? Who cares because you can just buy it. Do you meet some arbitrary federal weight guideline for Ozempic? Who cares you can just buy it. * every rule has exceptions, don't get bogged down with them.

lentoutcry 1y ago

yep. I don't wanna be in the shoes of the doctors who'll have to deal with this. although I suspect a part of them will resign, leading to even more "fun" downstream effects

sorokod 1y ago

A TIL, Medical freedom. Very likely those opinions will be shaped by social media and LLMs steering in turn public health policies, plugging into politics and back to start. A neat vertically integrated system.

mystraline 1y ago

> This will also compound the Qanon fascination with "medical freedom", where the patient gets to dictate to the doctor what to do (i.e. use ivermectin against COVID, or whatever other superstition rises to the top of the Qanon imagination cauldron). That's very double-edged. The open question is should humans have the right to take substances individually? Sure, you get Ivermectin/covid deniers. But you also get homemade Solvaldi (cure for Hepatitis C). I can make it for $300 for the 12 week course, and it retail costs $84000 Of course, even making and taking this drug you manufacture is illegal, even aside patent bullshit. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42538903 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42538903 But why shouldn't I be able to treat myself? Why do we accept really shitty gatekeepers (medical establishment, doctors) gatekeep treatments and cures from us? And more currently, now that der fuhrer quit the emergency use allocation for Covid shots, now you need a doctors scrip for 'allowing to get a vaccine'. I should be able to get this if I pay for it. But nope, now need to pay for needless doctor payment and more barriers. So at least in that side, I'm on Qanon's view that I should be able to personally treat myself with whatever substance I deem. Of course, I'll definitely heed a doctor's suggestion as an expert. But fuck.. My body, my choice.

sorokod 1y ago
> But why shouldn't I be able to treat myself? Consider this analogy: you should be allowed to put a gun to your own head and pull the trigger. You should not be allowed to put on a suicide vest and blow yourself up in a group of people.
- mystraline 1y ago
  To the first, yes, I do believe that we humans SHOULD have a right to commit suicide. It should be a right to end your own life. We have a 'right' drink a handle of whiskey a day, up to the point we get liver disease. Same with smoking 3 packs a day of cigarettes. Same with horrendous diet. But those ways of killing yourself are "acceptable" and also legal. But they're slower. The second, you're harming other people. That example is blatantly ridiculous, and appears just to gain an emotional response by invoking terrorism.
  - sorokod 1y ago
    "you're harming other people", yes as in the case where you are contagious.
    - bigbadfeline 1y ago
      > "you're harming other people", yes as in the case where you are contagious. Have you watched a movie lately? Talk about contagious violence. I can tell you this, your fate is just a blip on the back side of other people's large screen TV where the movies are shown.
Spivak 1y ago
I go further and say that you should be able to buy any drug from the pharmacy without a prescription*. As well as testing kits. Having to have an ongoing relationship with a doctor just to refill your medication or get antibiotics when you get strep is a huge waste of everyone's time and money. And there are countries where you can already do this and they haven't collapsed. It makes the job of pharmacist actually matter as someone other than a pill counter. It ends so many stupid discussions we have in the US. Can this medication be prescribed for an off-label use? Who cares because you can just buy it. Do you meet some arbitrary federal weight guideline for Ozempic? Who cares you can just buy it. * every rule has exceptions, don't get bogged down with them.