5 ms·

I have always been useful not valued, worked at 8 or more places. Only people who value me are family. Businesses don't. You find out pretty quick: suddenly on

I have always been useful not valued, worked at 8 or more places. Only people who value me are family. Businesses don't. You find out pretty quick: suddenly on PIP, or get bullied thereafter because you phrased something slightly off in a Jira comment. If I can get paid and treated OK, I see that as good. Don't put stock in business relationships. Try to have good ones but put stock in ... assets, family, health, etc. Now I have seen valued people but they are rare. And if push come to shove I'm sure that bond could break.

havefunbesafe 1y ago
If you ever own a company, you'll find this concept flipped upside down.
ktallett 1y ago
This is key. Such nuances and changes can be seen as a real negative behaviour by some when of course they are not.
msgodel 1y ago
The only way to have a pleasant relationship with a corporation is to approach it with as much apathy is they do.
- apwell23 1y ago
  thats what they want too if you bring even a tiny bit of your spunk, enthusiasm and passion to work you;d be labeled a problem immediately. They want apathetic mindless drones.
  - zwnow 1y ago
    Which is the correct approach for enterprises with tons of employees. Humans are never happy once they reach groups of certain sizes. Can only handle projects with certain sizes with apathy. Initiative may be looked for in smaller environments.
    - pixl97 1y ago
      Ah the joys of the MonkeySphere.
shubhamk11 1y ago
[flagged]
- 0xEF 1y ago
  return TEST_SUCCESS
  - fc417fc802 1y ago
    The domain of the email in your profile seems to be dead at the DNS level FYI.
    - 0xEF 1y ago
      Thanks. It was the domain for an old blog that I took down awhile ago. If you were trying to contact me privately for some reason, I can provide a working email if you give me a brief idea of what you wanted to discuss in a comment.
      - fc417fc802 1y ago
        I wasn't. It was just a clever domain so I tried to pull it up out of curiosity. HN profiles often link to some interesting stuff.
0xEF 1y ago
I've heard what you're describing phrase as follows: "If you want to know who truly values you, look for the people who would not be able to replace you with someone else." That usually has us pointing to friends and family, with the odd exception.
- JadeNB 1y ago
  I'm not sure this is a reliable guide. I'm in academia, and the people who really can't be replaced are the administrative staff with hard-won institutional knowledge and connections--but they're valued far less than splashy big-name faculty with no institutional loyalty.
  - light_hue_1 1y ago
    Yet the admin staff is the first to get fired and treated badly any time something changes. While faculty basically no matter how useless can never be fired. "can't be replaced" has two opposing meanings in your post.
    - directevolve 1y ago
      They can’t be fired, but if they stop bringing in grants, they can face steep pay cuts and lab closure.
      - JadeNB 1y ago
        > They can’t be fired, but if they stop bringing in grants, they can face steep pay cuts and lab closure. This describes the situation of tenured faculty (who are definitely who I had in mind when I referred to splashy big names), but universities have long been moving to a model with as few tenured or tenurable faculty as possible, where some instructors are full time but non-tenure-track, and others are part time (and so, for example, don't have to be paid benefits). At my university these are called lecturers and adjuncts, but other names exist. Both jobs involve renewable contracts (of different lengths), so they need not even be fired, just not have their contracts renewed.
Disposal8433 1y ago
I have the same experience. Multiple companies with a crazy manager that bullied and insulted employees. The bosses never do anything because the manager is always right. At my last job I was the only developer who knew bash and Linux. I handled everything until a new CTO came and destroyed the servers with his lack of technical knowledge. I was critically useful to the company until I broke down due to the daily harassment. I became valued the instant I gave my two weeks notice, but I still told them to go to hell.
- dakiol 1y ago
  > At my last job I was the only developer who knew bash and Linux. Where or how so you find such jobs/companies? Whenever I interview for non faang companies I’ve been asked things like the cap theorem, concurrency issues, microservice patterns, ddd, and of course on top of that the live coding and systems design interviews. For once, I’d like to join a company in which I seem to bring something only I know.
  - coldpie 1y ago
    Sounds like you want systems programming? Some areas to look in could be open source companies and embedded software.
  - deadbabe 1y ago
    Those are mostly incompetent companies. You might be the only one who knows something critical, but it’s not as fun as it seems.
- rokhayakebe 1y ago
  They still did not value you in the end. That was just manipulation to get you to stay.
itsoktocry 1y ago
>Don't put stock in business relationships. If this is your mentality, is it any wonder you aren't valued? People post things like this and I'm not sure they have any emotional intelligence whatsoever. Sure, your work/job doesn't have to be your entire life. But what about a little pride in what you're doing? Working with smart people towards a goal to do something useful? If your mentality is "just show up for work, do what they ask and go home" then it should be no surprise you're at the top of the list to get laid off. I wouldn't want to work with a person who "puts no stock in business relationships".
- munchler 1y ago
  > If your mentality is "just show up for work, do what they ask and go home" then it should be no surprise you're at the top of the list to get laid off. Conversely, if you think that devoting yourself to work will put you at the bottom of the list to get laid off, you are in for a big surprise eventually.
  - geodel 1y ago
    Huh, eventually everyone living is gonna die. But more likely people who do bare minimum at work and always wait for someone else to ask else they just leave for home are first one to go. And it is happening to "minimal interest in work" folks in my team as I type this. It is not even about having them do work beyond normal hours. But just checking in normal hours if something need be done while they have spare cycle. I guess it is all fine, employee made their choice and management theirs.
  - munificent 1y ago
    Consider that your point and the parent are opposite ends of a continuum and that healthy relationships lie somewhere in the middle. Any transaction becomes increasingly zero-sum as you get to either end of the value proposition difference between the two parties. The non-zero area is in the middle.
- 77pt77 1y ago
  Has it ever occurred to you that you have it backwards? He has this mentality because he has never been valued, not the other way around.
77pt77 1y ago
If you're called by your family you are better off than the majority of humans.

havefunbesafe 1y ago

If you ever own a company, you'll find this concept flipped upside down.

ktallett 1y ago

This is key. Such nuances and changes can be seen as a real negative behaviour by some when of course they are not.

msgodel 1y ago

The only way to have a pleasant relationship with a corporation is to approach it with as much apathy is they do.

apwell23 1y ago
thats what they want too if you bring even a tiny bit of your spunk, enthusiasm and passion to work you;d be labeled a problem immediately. They want apathetic mindless drones.
- zwnow 1y ago
  Which is the correct approach for enterprises with tons of employees. Humans are never happy once they reach groups of certain sizes. Can only handle projects with certain sizes with apathy. Initiative may be looked for in smaller environments.
  - pixl97 1y ago
    Ah the joys of the MonkeySphere.

shubhamk11 1y ago

[flagged]

0xEF 1y ago
return TEST_SUCCESS
- fc417fc802 1y ago
  The domain of the email in your profile seems to be dead at the DNS level FYI.
  - 0xEF 1y ago
    Thanks. It was the domain for an old blog that I took down awhile ago. If you were trying to contact me privately for some reason, I can provide a working email if you give me a brief idea of what you wanted to discuss in a comment.
    - fc417fc802 1y ago
      I wasn't. It was just a clever domain so I tried to pull it up out of curiosity. HN profiles often link to some interesting stuff.

0xEF 1y ago

I've heard what you're describing phrase as follows: "If you want to know who truly values you, look for the people who would not be able to replace you with someone else." That usually has us pointing to friends and family, with the odd exception.

JadeNB 1y ago
I'm not sure this is a reliable guide. I'm in academia, and the people who really can't be replaced are the administrative staff with hard-won institutional knowledge and connections--but they're valued far less than splashy big-name faculty with no institutional loyalty.
- light_hue_1 1y ago
  Yet the admin staff is the first to get fired and treated badly any time something changes. While faculty basically no matter how useless can never be fired. "can't be replaced" has two opposing meanings in your post.
  - directevolve 1y ago
    They can’t be fired, but if they stop bringing in grants, they can face steep pay cuts and lab closure.
    - JadeNB 1y ago
      > They can’t be fired, but if they stop bringing in grants, they can face steep pay cuts and lab closure. This describes the situation of tenured faculty (who are definitely who I had in mind when I referred to splashy big names), but universities have long been moving to a model with as few tenured or tenurable faculty as possible, where some instructors are full time but non-tenure-track, and others are part time (and so, for example, don't have to be paid benefits). At my university these are called lecturers and adjuncts, but other names exist. Both jobs involve renewable contracts (of different lengths), so they need not even be fired, just not have their contracts renewed.

Disposal8433 1y ago

I have the same experience. Multiple companies with a crazy manager that bullied and insulted employees. The bosses never do anything because the manager is always right. At my last job I was the only developer who knew bash and Linux. I handled everything until a new CTO came and destroyed the servers with his lack of technical knowledge. I was critically useful to the company until I broke down due to the daily harassment. I became valued the instant I gave my two weeks notice, but I still told them to go to hell.

dakiol 1y ago
> At my last job I was the only developer who knew bash and Linux. Where or how so you find such jobs/companies? Whenever I interview for non faang companies I’ve been asked things like the cap theorem, concurrency issues, microservice patterns, ddd, and of course on top of that the live coding and systems design interviews. For once, I’d like to join a company in which I seem to bring something only I know.
- coldpie 1y ago
  Sounds like you want systems programming? Some areas to look in could be open source companies and embedded software.
- deadbabe 1y ago
  Those are mostly incompetent companies. You might be the only one who knows something critical, but it’s not as fun as it seems.
rokhayakebe 1y ago
They still did not value you in the end. That was just manipulation to get you to stay.

itsoktocry 1y ago

>Don't put stock in business relationships. If this is your mentality, is it any wonder you aren't valued? People post things like this and I'm not sure they have any emotional intelligence whatsoever. Sure, your work/job doesn't have to be your entire life. But what about a little pride in what you're doing? Working with smart people towards a goal to do something useful? If your mentality is "just show up for work, do what they ask and go home" then it should be no surprise you're at the top of the list to get laid off. I wouldn't want to work with a person who "puts no stock in business relationships".

munchler 1y ago
> If your mentality is "just show up for work, do what they ask and go home" then it should be no surprise you're at the top of the list to get laid off. Conversely, if you think that devoting yourself to work will put you at the bottom of the list to get laid off, you are in for a big surprise eventually.
- geodel 1y ago
  Huh, eventually everyone living is gonna die. But more likely people who do bare minimum at work and always wait for someone else to ask else they just leave for home are first one to go. And it is happening to "minimal interest in work" folks in my team as I type this. It is not even about having them do work beyond normal hours. But just checking in normal hours if something need be done while they have spare cycle. I guess it is all fine, employee made their choice and management theirs.
- munificent 1y ago
  Consider that your point and the parent are opposite ends of a continuum and that healthy relationships lie somewhere in the middle. Any transaction becomes increasingly zero-sum as you get to either end of the value proposition difference between the two parties. The non-zero area is in the middle.
77pt77 1y ago
Has it ever occurred to you that you have it backwards? He has this mentality because he has never been valued, not the other way around.

77pt77 1y ago

If you're called by your family you are better off than the majority of humans.