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They have kind of abandoned diesel engines, which the whole scandal was based around. It became clear that it would be impossible to create diesel engines which

They have kind of abandoned diesel engines, which the whole scandal was based around. It became clear that it would be impossible to create diesel engines which would comply with enviromental standards, which is a shame since they are more efficient and it is consumers who are losing out. They are still one of the main automotive conglomerations today. If anything American car companies are losing the market in Europe, Ford for example have abandoned their best selling model - the Focus, and in the UK at least they are the only US brand besides for Tesla.

lucianbr 1y ago
I could be wrong but I think BMW and Mercedes still make diesel engines. So maybe it's only impossible at a lower price point? Although the difference isn't that large.
- FridayoLeary 1y ago
  Even VW never stopped selling diesel cars, but they are certainly being phased out everywhere and it's not as popular as it once was.
- lhoff 1y ago
  VW still builds and sells Diesel engines in its Cars. For Volkswagen and Skoda the share of diesel cars was about 30% in Germany. Source (only in German and behind paywall, sorry) https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/468422/umfrage/pkw-neuzulassungen-diesel-anteil-der-automarken/ https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/468422/umfrag...
- Symbiote 1y ago
  Using [1], BMW have 87 models, of which 13 can be electric, 13 plug-in hybrid, 47 petrol and just 6 diesel. The six are all SUVs. Mercedes don't have an easy filter, but they do have some cars available with diesel engines, e.g. C-Class. Diesel is now down to 9.5% of new cars sold in Europe (Q1 2025), less than full EVs ([2]). [1] https://www.bmw.co.uk/en/all-models.html https://www.bmw.co.uk/en/all-models.html [2] https://www.acea.auto/pc-registrations/new-car-registrations-1-9-in-q1-2025-battery-electric-15-2-market-share/ https://www.acea.auto/pc-registrations/new-car-registrations...
  - lucianbr 1y ago
    There are several 3 series diesel variants sold right now in my country, so maybe we need a bit more data gathering before drawing conclusions. It does seem like diesel is trending lower, but it's not gone yet, regardless whether you think that is a good thing or not. In any case, my point was this: > it would be impossible to create diesel engines which would comply with enviromental standards is false. Which it is. Or multiple car manufacturers are still cheating, I guess we must consider the possibility.
- SoftTalker 1y ago
  They do make them, but they don't sell them in the USA any more. Nobody does.
tonyedgecombe 1y ago
The funny thing is their emissions weren’t that bad, several other European manufacturers were worse.
DocTomoe 1y ago
In all fairness, in the general European perception, with the Cougar, the Puma, and the Focus, Ford is not really seen as an "American" brand. Especially the Focus has virtually nothing to do with what Europeans would consider 'an American car'. It is the quintessential low-to-mid-tier Eurocar: small, cheap, does what it is supposed to do. Compare that to e.g. Chevrolet, which tried - and failed - to get a foothold in Europe. The failure was mostly them not understanding the local market.
- darkwater 1y ago
  Didn't Chevrolet just bought and rebranded some Korean automaker?
  - pqtyw 1y ago
    AFAIK they were selling rebadged Daewoo models which were built on platforms developed by Opel. I suppose they wanted a budget brand and manufacturing and importing from Korea was cheaper back in those days than just using Opel's factories..
- pqtyw 1y ago
  > e.g. Chevrolet Also it overlapped a lot with Opel which a much more successful brand in Europe. Basically it was an off-brand/cheap Opel, which wasn't exactly doing that great itself...
- SoftTalker 1y ago
  Ford sold the Focus in the USA also, I had one and loved it. It was one of their few "world" cars.
amanaplanacanal 1y ago
Consumers still have to breathe though. I'd be totally fine if diesel engines were completely phased out. In the US we somehow can't even get rid of those idiots that retune their engines for "rolling coal".
- linksnapzz 1y ago
  Everything you purchase over the course of a day was transported by a diesel truck at some point.
  - mikestew 1y ago
    It wasn’t transported with the neighbor’s truck down the street that has a “defeat device”.
    - nickff 1y ago
      Parent was talking about commercial diesel trucks which do not comply with the same regulations as passenger vehicles, and the article talks about stock non-compliance. Why are you changing the subject?
  - KennyBlanken 1y ago
    Which likely was very polluting, because thanks to bitching by the trucking industry, they get a pass on emissions via "gliders." They can buy a brand new truck sans engine and drop some terribly polluting piece of crap from several decades ago and bypass all modern emissions regulations.
    - linksnapzz 1y ago
      Tomayto, tohmahto. The SCR/EGR/DPF regime that's been forced upon truck mfrs is at the ragged edge of reliability and maintainability, not to mention its effects on fuel use. So that regulators who've never heard of Pareto optimization can pursue cutting the final 1% of the emissions that a truck from the 1960s would have. One badly-tuned mid-80s F700 can produce more particulates in a day than a brand-new diesel truck will in its lifetime, but somehow, the priority is not making it easier for the owners of forty-year-old equipment to update to the standard of...2004, but rather to decrease the number of milligrams per tank (at $infinity cost) of soot that a brand-new engine is producing.
Gibbon1 1y ago
EV's and Hybrids get better mileage and pollute less. It's funny how the Clinton admin forced a golden egg into GM's hands (the EV1) and GM tossed it away in disgust when Bush was elected.
mrguyorama 1y ago
>It became clear that it would be impossible to create diesel engines which would comply with enviromental standards Absolutely not "impossible" FFS, VW was cheating to avoid using a proper adblue system, which would have been perfectly sufficient. They could also have used a particulate filter and burn off scheme like some trucks but that would require significant engineering and probably doesn't work as well with a small diesel engine. Orrrrrr they could have just done what the "cheat" mapping did: Run less lean. The entire point of cheating was to run very lean to make artificially high fuel efficiency figures. The cheat map for emissions would then run richer to kill off nox emissions. I genuinely believe they still "cheat" somewhat. My 2018 GTI has a 2L turbo engine. The MK7 GTIs were the first to be EPA emissions rated at 89 octane gas, even though the power figures are still recorded using 91 octane gas. Previous GTI engines were EPA rated with 91 octane gas. My tinfoil hat theory is that they run EPA tests on 89 octane so that it runs rich and reduces combustion temp, reducing nox emissions. Using higher octane fuel runs much leaner, and demonstrably produces better miles per gallon. They purposely chose to advertise a lower miles per gallon figure because, IMO, they couldn't pass emissions with the leaner burning 91 octane. Notably, low RPM (and emissions testing RPM) performance is utter garbage with 89 octane fuel, and the car becomes very stall happy, when at 91 octane it is very difficult to stall.

lucianbr 1y ago

I could be wrong but I think BMW and Mercedes still make diesel engines. So maybe it's only impossible at a lower price point? Although the difference isn't that large.

FridayoLeary 1y ago
Even VW never stopped selling diesel cars, but they are certainly being phased out everywhere and it's not as popular as it once was.
lhoff 1y ago
VW still builds and sells Diesel engines in its Cars. For Volkswagen and Skoda the share of diesel cars was about 30% in Germany. Source (only in German and behind paywall, sorry) https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/468422/umfrage/pkw-neuzulassungen-diesel-anteil-der-automarken/ https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/468422/umfrag...
Symbiote 1y ago
Using [1], BMW have 87 models, of which 13 can be electric, 13 plug-in hybrid, 47 petrol and just 6 diesel. The six are all SUVs. Mercedes don't have an easy filter, but they do have some cars available with diesel engines, e.g. C-Class. Diesel is now down to 9.5% of new cars sold in Europe (Q1 2025), less than full EVs ([2]). [1] https://www.bmw.co.uk/en/all-models.html https://www.bmw.co.uk/en/all-models.html [2] https://www.acea.auto/pc-registrations/new-car-registrations-1-9-in-q1-2025-battery-electric-15-2-market-share/ https://www.acea.auto/pc-registrations/new-car-registrations...
- lucianbr 1y ago
  There are several 3 series diesel variants sold right now in my country, so maybe we need a bit more data gathering before drawing conclusions. It does seem like diesel is trending lower, but it's not gone yet, regardless whether you think that is a good thing or not. In any case, my point was this: > it would be impossible to create diesel engines which would comply with enviromental standards is false. Which it is. Or multiple car manufacturers are still cheating, I guess we must consider the possibility.
SoftTalker 1y ago
They do make them, but they don't sell them in the USA any more. Nobody does.

tonyedgecombe 1y ago

The funny thing is their emissions weren’t that bad, several other European manufacturers were worse.

DocTomoe 1y ago

In all fairness, in the general European perception, with the Cougar, the Puma, and the Focus, Ford is not really seen as an "American" brand. Especially the Focus has virtually nothing to do with what Europeans would consider 'an American car'. It is the quintessential low-to-mid-tier Eurocar: small, cheap, does what it is supposed to do. Compare that to e.g. Chevrolet, which tried - and failed - to get a foothold in Europe. The failure was mostly them not understanding the local market.

darkwater 1y ago
Didn't Chevrolet just bought and rebranded some Korean automaker?
- pqtyw 1y ago
  AFAIK they were selling rebadged Daewoo models which were built on platforms developed by Opel. I suppose they wanted a budget brand and manufacturing and importing from Korea was cheaper back in those days than just using Opel's factories..
pqtyw 1y ago
> e.g. Chevrolet Also it overlapped a lot with Opel which a much more successful brand in Europe. Basically it was an off-brand/cheap Opel, which wasn't exactly doing that great itself...
SoftTalker 1y ago
Ford sold the Focus in the USA also, I had one and loved it. It was one of their few "world" cars.

amanaplanacanal 1y ago

Consumers still have to breathe though. I'd be totally fine if diesel engines were completely phased out. In the US we somehow can't even get rid of those idiots that retune their engines for "rolling coal".

linksnapzz 1y ago
Everything you purchase over the course of a day was transported by a diesel truck at some point.
- mikestew 1y ago
  It wasn’t transported with the neighbor’s truck down the street that has a “defeat device”.
  - nickff 1y ago
    Parent was talking about commercial diesel trucks which do not comply with the same regulations as passenger vehicles, and the article talks about stock non-compliance. Why are you changing the subject?
- KennyBlanken 1y ago
  Which likely was very polluting, because thanks to bitching by the trucking industry, they get a pass on emissions via "gliders." They can buy a brand new truck sans engine and drop some terribly polluting piece of crap from several decades ago and bypass all modern emissions regulations.
  - linksnapzz 1y ago
    Tomayto, tohmahto. The SCR/EGR/DPF regime that's been forced upon truck mfrs is at the ragged edge of reliability and maintainability, not to mention its effects on fuel use. So that regulators who've never heard of Pareto optimization can pursue cutting the final 1% of the emissions that a truck from the 1960s would have. One badly-tuned mid-80s F700 can produce more particulates in a day than a brand-new diesel truck will in its lifetime, but somehow, the priority is not making it easier for the owners of forty-year-old equipment to update to the standard of...2004, but rather to decrease the number of milligrams per tank (at $infinity cost) of soot that a brand-new engine is producing.

Gibbon1 1y ago

EV's and Hybrids get better mileage and pollute less. It's funny how the Clinton admin forced a golden egg into GM's hands (the EV1) and GM tossed it away in disgust when Bush was elected.

mrguyorama 1y ago

>It became clear that it would be impossible to create diesel engines which would comply with enviromental standards Absolutely not "impossible" FFS, VW was cheating to avoid using a proper adblue system, which would have been perfectly sufficient. They could also have used a particulate filter and burn off scheme like some trucks but that would require significant engineering and probably doesn't work as well with a small diesel engine. Orrrrrr they could have just done what the "cheat" mapping did: Run less lean. The entire point of cheating was to run very lean to make artificially high fuel efficiency figures. The cheat map for emissions would then run richer to kill off nox emissions. I genuinely believe they still "cheat" somewhat. My 2018 GTI has a 2L turbo engine. The MK7 GTIs were the first to be EPA emissions rated at 89 octane gas, even though the power figures are still recorded using 91 octane gas. Previous GTI engines were EPA rated with 91 octane gas. My tinfoil hat theory is that they run EPA tests on 89 octane so that it runs rich and reduces combustion temp, reducing nox emissions. Using higher octane fuel runs much leaner, and demonstrably produces better miles per gallon. They purposely chose to advertise a lower miles per gallon figure because, IMO, they couldn't pass emissions with the leaner burning 91 octane. Notably, low RPM (and emissions testing RPM) performance is utter garbage with 89 octane fuel, and the car becomes very stall happy, when at 91 octane it is very difficult to stall.