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And yet they all have to work like idiots until they're 70, whether they like it or not. I feel they could do better than that with all this wealth.
by joelthelion 1y ago
And yet they all have to work like idiots until they're 70, whether they like it or not.
I feel they could do better than that with all this wealth.
- droopyEyelids 1y agoThey’re not working like idiots, they have universal unionization and lots of time off.
- joelthelion 1y agoYou can have the best working conditions in the world, it still sucks to have to work if you don't want to.
- jhickok 1y agoWell yeah but then your problem is the fact you have to work at all. I doubt any modern societies have solved the issue of needing people to work.
- joelthelion 1y agoI get it but then we should be moving towards less mandatory work, not a 70 years old retirement age.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- codethief 1y agoShould we? As life expectancy increases, wouldn't it make more sense for people to work a bit longer, so as to keep the costs of retirement the same?
- nradov 1y agoWork isn't mandatory. You're free to stop any time, and accept the consequences of that choice. What we should be doing is aggressively cutting the cost of living so that people who want to can afford to retire while still maintaining some reasonable quality of life. The number one thing that would help is to set policies that make it easier to build more housing because that's the largest expense for most people.
- tikhonj 1y agoSure, but modern societies have solved the problem of needing to work until you're 70. Working until 65 or whatever still sucks, but 5 years is 5 years is not nothing.
- jspdown 1y agoIt's the 5 best years that you have left to live. It's not nothing indeed.
- nradov 1y agoSome of us are fortunate to have jobs that we enjoy but the majority of people don't really want to work. They work to survive. That's just life.
- codethief 1y agoWell, yeah, life is largely about work. Retirement and living very comfortably off of one's savings/pension is a rather new phenomenon, and I'm not even sure it's a good one (in terms of health impact).
- MattPalmer1086 1y agoPeople are living longer. Demographically there are fewer younger people to support them. Something has to give.
- pydry 1y agoFunny how AI will take your job when you're 35 but when you reach the age of 65 it loses the ability to do so.
- joelthelion 1y agoOn the other hand, productivity has improved tremendously. It's not clear that we actually need everyone working.
- nradov 1y agoProductivity improvements have been partially eaten up by cost of living increases. We don't need everyone working, but how do we decide who has to work and who gets stuff for free? Should workers pay higher taxes to support more retirees?
- Spivak 1y agoYes? Old age, and to an extent disability, are great systems for deciding this because unless you die young everyone becomes both.
- nradov 1y agoSo how much lower should the retirement age be, and how much should taxes increase to enable that? Have you done the math on that?
- slater 1y ago> Should workers pay higher taxes to support more retirees? With what money? The poor folk don't have any by definition, the middle class is being squeezed out of existence, which leaves... who...?
- stevesimmons 1y agoThey don't all have to work to age 70. Anyone can stop working earlier, and fund their own retirement.
- joelthelion 1y agoThat's true. But I'd argue that everyone is better off when most people can chose to retire early, rather than the select few who are smart and disciplined enough to plan an early retirement.
- nradov 1y agoEveryone is better off except the workers who have to pay higher taxes to support more retirees. That might still be a net positive for society but people are going to have a wide range of opinions on where to draw the line.
- bluGill 1y agoNo everyone is worse off if their retirement date doesn't match when they want to retire. the later you retire the less money you need. So if you are not personally ready why did you fund that much while if you sant to go sooner you need to save anyway.
- prawn 1y agoThere are multiple pension-related plans to supplement or replace the government pension, and most work in ways so that it's not just "smart and disciplined" people. Retirement age in Australia is 67. A report from 2024 going on the 2022/23 FY said the average age at retirement (of all retirees) was 56.9 years. People typically plan for 65. Couldn't find Danish data, but 43% in AU rely on a government pension. 27% on superannuation or similar (I assume this will grow a bit). Those reporting no personal income is down from 24% to 12% over the last 10 years. Here, companies compulsorily pay 11.5% into super funds for staff. All that said, I'd rather see more support for people living in their prime rather than being tied to a desk. I don't see the point in purely waiting until retirement.
- hoseja 1y agoOr they could build their own wealth/have children to provide for them in old age and retire earlier not rely on what should be government backstop for the most incompetent.