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I preferred WSL to running linux directly even though I had no need for any windows only software. Not having to spend time configuring my computer to make bas

I preferred WSL to running linux directly even though I had no need for any windows only software. Not having to spend time configuring my computer to make basic things work like suspend/wake on lid down/up, battery life, hardware acceleration for video playback on the browser, display scaling on external monitor and so on was reason enough.

jraph 1y ago
All this usually works out of the box now, especially if you pick your hardware accordingly.
- alex_smart 1y ago
  That was certainly not the case ~2 years ago, the last time I installed linux on a laptop. It also doesn't appear to be the case even now. I searched for laptops available in my country that fit my budget and for each laptop searched "<laptop name> linux reddit" on google and filtered for results <1 year old. Each laptop's reports included some or other bug. https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1hfqptw/linux_experience_with_hp_envy_x360_2024/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1hfqptw/linu... https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1esntt3/lenovo_ideapad_slim_5_gen_9_amd_8845hs_16_inch/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1esntt3/leno... https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1j3983j/hp_omnibook_ultra_14_ryzen_ai_9_365_a_short_review/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1j3983j/hp_o... https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1k1nsm8/audio_not_working_lenovo_yoga_7_pro_intel_ultra_7/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1k1nsm8/audi... The laptop with the best reported linux support seemed to be Thinkpad P14s but even there users reported tweaking some config to get fans to run silently and to make the speakers sound acceptable. https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comments/1c81rw4/thinkpad_p14s_first_impressions_and_linux_configs/ https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comments/1c81rw4/thinkpad_...
  - jraph 1y ago
    You are going to find issues for any computer for any OS by looking things up like this. And yeah, it's best to wait a bit for new models, as support is sorted out, if the manufacturer doesn't support Linux itself. Or pick a manufacturer that sells laptops with Linux preinstalled. That makes the comparison with a laptop with Windows preinstalled fair.
    - alex_smart 1y ago
      > You are going to find issues for any computer for any OS by looking things up like this I wasn't cherry-picking things. I literally searched for laptops available in my budget in my country and looked up what was the linux support like for those laptops as reported by people on reddit. > Or pick a manufacturer that sells laptops with Linux preinstalled I suppose you are talking about System76, Tuxedo etc. These manufacturers don't ship to my country. Even if I am able to get it shipped, how am I supposed to get warranty?
      - jraph 1y ago
        You weren't cherry picking but the search query you used would lead to issue reports. HP, Dell and Lenovo also sell Linux laptops on which Linux runs well. I sympathize with the more limited availability and budget restrictions, but comparisons must be fair: compare a preinstalled Windows and a preinstalled linux, or at least a linux installed on hardware whose manufacturer bothered to work on Linux support. When the manufacturer did their homework, Linux doesn't have the issues listed earlier. I've seen several laptops of these three brands work flawlessly on Linux and it's been like this for a decade. I certainly choose my laptops with Linux on mind and I know just picking random models would probably lead me to little issues here and there, and I don't want to deal with this. Although I have installed Linux on random laptops for other people and fortunately haven't run into issues.
        alex_smart 1y ago
        As a buyer, how am I supposed to know which manufacturer did their homework and on which laptops? > it's been like this for a decade Again, depends on the definition of "flawlessly". Afaik, support for hardware accelerated videoplayback on browsers was broken across the board only three years ago.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
- davrosthedalek 1y ago
  On Windows, I don't have to pick my hardware accordingly. I have to onboard a lot of students to work on our research. The software is all linux (of course), and mostly distribution-agnostic. Can't be too old, that's it. If a student comes with a random laptop, I install WSL on it, mostly ubuntu. apt install <curated list of packets>. Done. Linux laptops are OK too, I think, but so far only had one student with that. Mac OS used to be easy, but gets harder with every release, and every new OS version breaks something (mainly, CERN root) and people have to wait until it's fixed.
  - jraph 1y ago
    > On Windows, I don't have to pick my hardware accordingly. Fair enough. I think the best way to run Linux if you want to be sure you won't have tweak to stuff is to buy hardware with linux preinstalled. That your choice is more limited is another matter than "linux can't suspend". Comparing a preinstalled Windows with a linux installed on random laptop whose manufacturer can't be bothered to support is a bit unfair. Linux on a laptop where the manufacturer did their work runs well.
    - davrosthedalek 1y ago
      Yes, machines with Linux preinstalled normally work quite well. But it's still a downside of choosing Linux that the choice of laptops is so much smaller. Similar to the downside of Mac OS that you are locked in to pricey-but-well-built laptops, or the downside of Windows that "it runs Windows" doesn't mean the hardware is not bottom-of-the-barrel crap with a vendor who doesn't care about Linux compatibility. WSL allows to run a sane development environment even then :)
      - jraph 1y ago
        100% agree
coderenegade 1y ago
I use Windows with wsl for work, and Linux and MacOS at home. Windows is a mess, it blows my mind that people pay for it. Sleep has worked less reliably on my work machine than my Fedora Thinkpad, and my Fedora machine is more responsive in pretty much every way despite having modest specs in comparison. Things just randomly stop working on Windows in a way that just doesn't happen on other OSes. It's garbage.

jraph 1y ago

All this usually works out of the box now, especially if you pick your hardware accordingly.

alex_smart 1y ago
That was certainly not the case ~2 years ago, the last time I installed linux on a laptop. It also doesn't appear to be the case even now. I searched for laptops available in my country that fit my budget and for each laptop searched "<laptop name> linux reddit" on google and filtered for results <1 year old. Each laptop's reports included some or other bug. https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1hfqptw/linux_experience_with_hp_envy_x360_2024/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1hfqptw/linu... https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1esntt3/lenovo_ideapad_slim_5_gen_9_amd_8845hs_16_inch/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1esntt3/leno... https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1j3983j/hp_omnibook_ultra_14_ryzen_ai_9_365_a_short_review/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1j3983j/hp_o... https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1k1nsm8/audio_not_working_lenovo_yoga_7_pro_intel_ultra_7/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1k1nsm8/audi... The laptop with the best reported linux support seemed to be Thinkpad P14s but even there users reported tweaking some config to get fans to run silently and to make the speakers sound acceptable. https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comments/1c81rw4/thinkpad_p14s_first_impressions_and_linux_configs/ https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comments/1c81rw4/thinkpad_...
- jraph 1y ago
  You are going to find issues for any computer for any OS by looking things up like this. And yeah, it's best to wait a bit for new models, as support is sorted out, if the manufacturer doesn't support Linux itself. Or pick a manufacturer that sells laptops with Linux preinstalled. That makes the comparison with a laptop with Windows preinstalled fair.
  - alex_smart 1y ago
    > You are going to find issues for any computer for any OS by looking things up like this I wasn't cherry-picking things. I literally searched for laptops available in my budget in my country and looked up what was the linux support like for those laptops as reported by people on reddit. > Or pick a manufacturer that sells laptops with Linux preinstalled I suppose you are talking about System76, Tuxedo etc. These manufacturers don't ship to my country. Even if I am able to get it shipped, how am I supposed to get warranty?
    - jraph 1y ago
      You weren't cherry picking but the search query you used would lead to issue reports. HP, Dell and Lenovo also sell Linux laptops on which Linux runs well. I sympathize with the more limited availability and budget restrictions, but comparisons must be fair: compare a preinstalled Windows and a preinstalled linux, or at least a linux installed on hardware whose manufacturer bothered to work on Linux support. When the manufacturer did their homework, Linux doesn't have the issues listed earlier. I've seen several laptops of these three brands work flawlessly on Linux and it's been like this for a decade. I certainly choose my laptops with Linux on mind and I know just picking random models would probably lead me to little issues here and there, and I don't want to deal with this. Although I have installed Linux on random laptops for other people and fortunately haven't run into issues.
      - alex_smart 1y ago
        As a buyer, how am I supposed to know which manufacturer did their homework and on which laptops? > it's been like this for a decade Again, depends on the definition of "flawlessly". Afaik, support for hardware accelerated videoplayback on browsers was broken across the board only three years ago.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
davrosthedalek 1y ago
On Windows, I don't have to pick my hardware accordingly. I have to onboard a lot of students to work on our research. The software is all linux (of course), and mostly distribution-agnostic. Can't be too old, that's it. If a student comes with a random laptop, I install WSL on it, mostly ubuntu. apt install <curated list of packets>. Done. Linux laptops are OK too, I think, but so far only had one student with that. Mac OS used to be easy, but gets harder with every release, and every new OS version breaks something (mainly, CERN root) and people have to wait until it's fixed.
- jraph 1y ago
  > On Windows, I don't have to pick my hardware accordingly. Fair enough. I think the best way to run Linux if you want to be sure you won't have tweak to stuff is to buy hardware with linux preinstalled. That your choice is more limited is another matter than "linux can't suspend". Comparing a preinstalled Windows with a linux installed on random laptop whose manufacturer can't be bothered to support is a bit unfair. Linux on a laptop where the manufacturer did their work runs well.
  - davrosthedalek 1y ago
    Yes, machines with Linux preinstalled normally work quite well. But it's still a downside of choosing Linux that the choice of laptops is so much smaller. Similar to the downside of Mac OS that you are locked in to pricey-but-well-built laptops, or the downside of Windows that "it runs Windows" doesn't mean the hardware is not bottom-of-the-barrel crap with a vendor who doesn't care about Linux compatibility. WSL allows to run a sane development environment even then :)
    - jraph 1y ago
      100% agree

coderenegade 1y ago

I use Windows with wsl for work, and Linux and MacOS at home. Windows is a mess, it blows my mind that people pay for it. Sleep has worked less reliably on my work machine than my Fedora Thinkpad, and my Fedora machine is more responsive in pretty much every way despite having modest specs in comparison. Things just randomly stop working on Windows in a way that just doesn't happen on other OSes. It's garbage.