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It is a long-standing policy, not a "bug"[1]. Further it isn't the users complaining, it's a company of a fringe "cloud" product. I'm going to be gentle here an

It is a long-standing policy, not a "bug"[1]. Further it isn't the users complaining, it's a company of a fringe "cloud" product. I'm going to be gentle here and say their app looks incredibly shitty, and I suspect they saw an opportunity to get some free press on the "Google the monopolist" angle. >I suspect people want their entire photo folders mirrored into Nextcloud from the device That isn't remotely the contention, nor do photos even qualify for this as they use a different API. Further, the reason this company gives for refusing to use the obviously more suitable structured storage API is that they don't want their files -- presumably mirrored from the cloud storage -- visible to other apps. Their complaint is technical nonsense and doesn't pass an ounce of scrutiny. The argument by this company is nonsensical, and their argument seems to be "we did it this way before and we don't want to change". Firstly they can have their own app storage without granting access to any other app, and they can go through a system UI process to get access to additional folders (for instance "I want to back up my WhatsApp folder to this cloud provider"). They argue against the latter because they seem to think it somehow reveals the former, but that isn't the case whatsoever. [1] - Well it's a bug in the Nextcloud product where they seem to just ignore that the instance lacks a permission

pjc50 1y ago
It is the users complaining, or rather specifically a user: https://github.com/nextcloud/android/issues/14135 https://github.com/nextcloud/android/issues/14135
- llm_nerd 1y ago
  The user is complaining that the app isn't using the proper APIs. For instance in the case of the "exactly" guy, the app would use structured storage APIs to let the user grant permissions to backup their WhatsApp folder. Instead of fixing their app the company instead whines to the press and gives technically nonsensical rationale for why they can't just do the work necessary because "we did it this way before and they let us for a while, so..."
  - winkeltripel 1y ago
    9 years of the api working, then Google shuts them down. I expect an interface to be consistent after working for 9 years. I think they're trying to keep their story simple, for the sake of clarity. I believe the nextcloud team when they say they need the permission. Part of the issue is that nextcloud has many use cases, including ones where your files don't get synced to your mobile device until you touch the file, replacing them with a reference to a file. It's cool cause you can access and manage a tb of pictures or documents from a 64gb android.
    - deng 1y ago
      > I believe the nextcloud team when they say they need the permission. I don't (and I do use NC). The sentence "SAF cannot be used, as it is for sharing/exposing our files to other apps" is simply wrong and llm_nerd is right that SAF should be able to handle that use case,see https://developer.android.com/training/data-storage/shared/documents-files#grant-access-directory https://developer.android.com/training/data-storage/shared/d... There are some restrictions regarding which directories you can access, but for most use-cases it should be perfectly fine. It's also not that this should come as a surprise to them. In fact, there's an issue about this from the NC team themselves from August '22: https://github.com/nextcloud/android/issues/10123 https://github.com/nextcloud/android/issues/10123 Why they still think SAF cannot be used is a mystery to me.
    - threeseed 1y ago
      > I expect an interface to be consistent after working for 9 years Even if that interface is insecure and harmful to users ? As an industry we've learnt a lot about how apps siphon and sell your data. And I appreciate this probably doesn't apply to NextCloud but it can be difficult to build an API that is flexible and secure so you will get casualties.
      - lenkite 1y ago
        How is this interface "insecure and harmful to users" ?
traverseda 1y ago
I'm a user. I install through fdroid, but I am complaining. This also makes corporate roll-outs more difficult.

pjc50 1y ago

It is the users complaining, or rather specifically a user: https://github.com/nextcloud/android/issues/14135 https://github.com/nextcloud/android/issues/14135

llm_nerd 1y ago
The user is complaining that the app isn't using the proper APIs. For instance in the case of the "exactly" guy, the app would use structured storage APIs to let the user grant permissions to backup their WhatsApp folder. Instead of fixing their app the company instead whines to the press and gives technically nonsensical rationale for why they can't just do the work necessary because "we did it this way before and they let us for a while, so..."
- winkeltripel 1y ago
  9 years of the api working, then Google shuts them down. I expect an interface to be consistent after working for 9 years. I think they're trying to keep their story simple, for the sake of clarity. I believe the nextcloud team when they say they need the permission. Part of the issue is that nextcloud has many use cases, including ones where your files don't get synced to your mobile device until you touch the file, replacing them with a reference to a file. It's cool cause you can access and manage a tb of pictures or documents from a 64gb android.
  - deng 1y ago
    > I believe the nextcloud team when they say they need the permission. I don't (and I do use NC). The sentence "SAF cannot be used, as it is for sharing/exposing our files to other apps" is simply wrong and llm_nerd is right that SAF should be able to handle that use case,see https://developer.android.com/training/data-storage/shared/documents-files#grant-access-directory https://developer.android.com/training/data-storage/shared/d... There are some restrictions regarding which directories you can access, but for most use-cases it should be perfectly fine. It's also not that this should come as a surprise to them. In fact, there's an issue about this from the NC team themselves from August '22: https://github.com/nextcloud/android/issues/10123 https://github.com/nextcloud/android/issues/10123 Why they still think SAF cannot be used is a mystery to me.
  - threeseed 1y ago
    > I expect an interface to be consistent after working for 9 years Even if that interface is insecure and harmful to users ? As an industry we've learnt a lot about how apps siphon and sell your data. And I appreciate this probably doesn't apply to NextCloud but it can be difficult to build an API that is flexible and secure so you will get casualties.
    - lenkite 1y ago
      How is this interface "insecure and harmful to users" ?

traverseda 1y ago

I'm a user. I install through fdroid, but I am complaining. This also makes corporate roll-outs more difficult.