4 ms·

> Are you a moderate who has a better plan? stop supporting moderate politicians that appeal to no damn person. find someone with charisma like obama. there is

> Are you a moderate who has a better plan? stop supporting moderate politicians that appeal to no damn person. find someone with charisma like obama. there is no magical moderate voter that the dems keep hoping to appeal to. they already have been the center right party for decades now.

nineplay 1y ago
> stop supporting moderate politicians that appeal to no damn person I think you are right but I think half of democratic voters think the party has gone too left ( abortion, gender politics ) while half thinks it has gone too far right. The democratic party is trying to have it both ways and utterly failing, but in their defense I don't think fully embracing either side will be enough for them to win. The problem is largely the voters who absolutely refuse to compromise on their personal hill to die on. Republican voters will unite on anyone as long as they piss of the left. > find someone with charisma like Obama That person does not exist, or if they do they are too smart to support the shambling mess that is the democratic party. I think the party is gambling that Trump makes such a hopeless mess of things that voters will have no choice but vote blue. I'm not sure they will win that gamble.
- orwin 1y ago
  What did the US democratic party ever do that was considered too left wing? Not said or wishcast, what material thing did they implement that was too left wing on abortion? Theoretically, abortion in the US used to be extremely liberal (in the original meaning of the word liberal). Materially? No one wait week 22 for an abortion unless it's an emergency, considering the damage it does. The percentage of childbirth death plus late stage abortion in the US is barely superior to the one in my country where abortions after weeks 18 needs to be argued by two doctors and a social worker in front of a judge. And that percentage is only superior because US have a very, very high childbirth death for a developed country. Materially, Usians do less late stage abortion than other developed countries where those are way more restrictive. Because people love to talk about 'theorically' when they talk about other people body and choices, never about what really happens, and that bothers me greatly.
  - nineplay 1y ago
    > What did the US democratic party ever do that was considered too left wing? Jack shit probably but that doesn't mean right-leaning Democrats are going to vote for Bernie Sanders and cross their fingers that none of his proposals get enacted.
    - fc417fc802 1y ago
      "But they never actually managed to accomplish those things they said they'd do that you don't like" is not a very convincing sales pitch.
chokolad 1y ago
> find someone with charisma like obama. Obama was a moderate politician with massive charisma
- weaksauce 1y ago
  correct. i was somewhat careless with my wording but i meant find someone with the massive charisma that obama has and is also a progressive.
dralley 1y ago
1) Obama was a moderate 2) Moderates do, in fact, have stronger appeal than leftists. It's empirically true. As evidence, see: literally just about every election where a leftist is on the ballot, with the possible exception of AOC who has Obama-tier charisma factor and also not-coincidentally has moderated her image a bit the past few years to the point where the most lefty leftists think she's a sellout. People like Tester and Manchin overperformed in their deep-red states for a long, long time. People like Collins and Don Bacon on the other side overperform for the same reason. The point of moderation for a Democrat is not picking up Republican votes, it's picking up votes from the 30% of the country that doesn't identify with either party, most of which are moderates. Also, the black community is the core of the Democratic coalition, and they are pretty moderate politically, especially on social issues. Latinos are the same and that's part of the reason we've been losing them.
- weaksauce 1y ago
  sorry i thought i was clear but yes obama was definitely a moderate but i meant find a progressive (with charisma like obama) that can inspire

nineplay 1y ago

> stop supporting moderate politicians that appeal to no damn person I think you are right but I think half of democratic voters think the party has gone too left ( abortion, gender politics ) while half thinks it has gone too far right. The democratic party is trying to have it both ways and utterly failing, but in their defense I don't think fully embracing either side will be enough for them to win. The problem is largely the voters who absolutely refuse to compromise on their personal hill to die on. Republican voters will unite on anyone as long as they piss of the left. > find someone with charisma like Obama That person does not exist, or if they do they are too smart to support the shambling mess that is the democratic party. I think the party is gambling that Trump makes such a hopeless mess of things that voters will have no choice but vote blue. I'm not sure they will win that gamble.

orwin 1y ago
What did the US democratic party ever do that was considered too left wing? Not said or wishcast, what material thing did they implement that was too left wing on abortion? Theoretically, abortion in the US used to be extremely liberal (in the original meaning of the word liberal). Materially? No one wait week 22 for an abortion unless it's an emergency, considering the damage it does. The percentage of childbirth death plus late stage abortion in the US is barely superior to the one in my country where abortions after weeks 18 needs to be argued by two doctors and a social worker in front of a judge. And that percentage is only superior because US have a very, very high childbirth death for a developed country. Materially, Usians do less late stage abortion than other developed countries where those are way more restrictive. Because people love to talk about 'theorically' when they talk about other people body and choices, never about what really happens, and that bothers me greatly.
- nineplay 1y ago
  > What did the US democratic party ever do that was considered too left wing? Jack shit probably but that doesn't mean right-leaning Democrats are going to vote for Bernie Sanders and cross their fingers that none of his proposals get enacted.
  - fc417fc802 1y ago
    "But they never actually managed to accomplish those things they said they'd do that you don't like" is not a very convincing sales pitch.

chokolad 1y ago

> find someone with charisma like obama. Obama was a moderate politician with massive charisma

weaksauce 1y ago
correct. i was somewhat careless with my wording but i meant find someone with the massive charisma that obama has and is also a progressive.

dralley 1y ago

1) Obama was a moderate 2) Moderates do, in fact, have stronger appeal than leftists. It's empirically true. As evidence, see: literally just about every election where a leftist is on the ballot, with the possible exception of AOC who has Obama-tier charisma factor and also not-coincidentally has moderated her image a bit the past few years to the point where the most lefty leftists think she's a sellout. People like Tester and Manchin overperformed in their deep-red states for a long, long time. People like Collins and Don Bacon on the other side overperform for the same reason. The point of moderation for a Democrat is not picking up Republican votes, it's picking up votes from the 30% of the country that doesn't identify with either party, most of which are moderates. Also, the black community is the core of the Democratic coalition, and they are pretty moderate politically, especially on social issues. Latinos are the same and that's part of the reason we've been losing them.

weaksauce 1y ago
sorry i thought i was clear but yes obama was definitely a moderate but i meant find a progressive (with charisma like obama) that can inspire