4 ms·

I feel something is missing at the moment with our ability to choose on the device how I want it to charge. Would be nice to plug the phone in and unless I say

I feel something is missing at the moment with our ability to choose on the device how I want it to charge. Would be nice to plug the phone in and unless I say otherwise it does a nice slow charge even if the cable and charger is capable of more. But if I press a button on the front after I plug it in then I can select fast and it goes as quickly as the combination allows. Its irritating to have to have different chargers for this to preserve the battery. Its pretty bad that only recent phones have started to add the ability to charge to only 80% to keep the battery in the optimal zone to extend the life given how long we have known that 80% was the optimal maximum. There are also a few phones now able to power themselves from USB without using the battery which if you leave them in chargers a lot throughout the day and night seems like a good feature to have to preserve the battery further. Maybe all the complexity around this is too much and people just want to plug it in and quick 100% as quick as possible and will change their phone regularly but its pretty wasteful. We ended up going through lots of special chargers that all do very similar things and now you get a device and it often doesn't even come with a cable let alone a charger and you are digging through the specs of your charger, cable and device to work out if its all going to mesh correctly together or you'll be stuck on slow mode. We have ended up with so many standards for getting quicker than the basic charge its going to take a while for all these devices to age out and in the meantime chargers are going to be doing QC and PD and a host of other things besides for a while.

LeifCarrotson 1y ago
> Maybe all the complexity around this is too much and people just want to plug it in and quick 100% as quick as possible and will change their phone regularly It's this, 100%. The nerds that care about charge temperature and battery degradation and proliferation of incompatible charging standards are a rounding error, most people just want to know it can charge fast in case they forget and need to leave soon. I am happy with my Chargie [1], an interposing dongle which provides a Bluetooth receiver and app that lets you set arbitrary preferences on your phone and fast charge, slow charge, or turn off the charger at configurable state of charge setpoints or times. [1] https://chargie.org/product/chargie-c-basic/ https://chargie.org/product/chargie-c-basic/
- catlikesshrimp 1y ago
  I had never thought such thing existed commercially. Mainly because I had looked for it myself in addition to asking about it without results. It needs an app but doesn't mention interoperability. There, I said it. It is not perfect. At least they allow you to set-up-in-app-and-use-without-app which is more than many products.
  - hnuser123456 1y ago
    There is a built-in charge limiting feature in Android now, so that doesn't need any apps, but the only options are limit to 80% or 100%. But for something like this, how else are you going to get your phone to tell a charger when to turn off? Apparently, making an API that allows devs to reliably stop charging in software is too risky, so IoT devices with companion apps are the solution, of course. Not to mention the device manufacturers are probably quite happy to have batteries degrade significantly after warranty ends.
- Funes- 1y ago
  >needs an app Now imagine the same product but with different physical toggles or buttons on it for all the different charging modes. No apps. That'd be great.
  - baby_souffle 1y ago
    Or even a way to communicate this to the charger from the phone using the vendor extension to PD protocol negotiations…
  - LeifCarrotson 1y ago
    Switching between 500 mA, 2.1A, and USB-PD or QC is technically simple, but again you're making consumer electronics for a very, very small group of people. How would it determine when the attached device reaches 80% state of charge? Or what the time of day is? How could you program a schedule for weekdays and weekends? There are good reasons for Chargie to have an app, it's not just there to siphon up analytics.
Saris 1y ago
My Galaxy S21 lets me pick between normal, fast, or super-fast charging in the settings. Not quite one tap, but it does let you do it. That said "super-fast" charging on it is like 18W and still about an hour from 20%, so it doesn't really qualify as fast charging IMO, and at an hour is certainly not going to be causing any excess battery wear. It's just normal speed.
- catlikesshrimp 1y ago
  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quick_Charge https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quick_Charge Quick charge started at 7.5W My charge "Standard" was set in the time 500mA was supplied by most phone chargers. Just saying I am old.
  - Saris 1y ago
    For sure, but for terms of battery wear all that really matters is the time to charge. Under 1 hour is getting into the realm of 'really fast' and heat inside the cell starts to become an issue.
dpifke 1y ago
Adaptive Charging on Pixel devices gets most of the way there: it will learn how long it's typically on the charger each day, and automatically slow the rate of charge to match, so that it finishes approximately an hour before you usually unplug it. There's a manual option to turn it off (charge at full rate this time only), but not to manually turn it on (such as giving it a target time to be fully charged). Older Pixels used what time the alarm was set as the target time to finish charging, which I preferred as someone who doesn't wake up at the same time every day; I'm not sure why they took that away.
- mcny 1y ago
  Another problem is the constant charging and discharging of battery while connected to external power. I believe the latest pixels got or will soon get the ability to run directly off the wall when connected to certain chargers. I would love to see this technology come to all phones. 80% cap might be controversial but I don't think what I am asking for is controversial in the least.
  - vladvasiliu 1y ago
    > Another problem is the constant charging and discharging of battery while connected to external power. Is that actually the case? Anecdotally, all my devices which spend 99% of their time connected to external power show the least degradation in reported capacity and the best preservation of their original battery life. I'm talking about iPhones, macbooks and hp laptops. For the latter, I have two basically identical ones, one for work and the other for home (same model number, same generation, same battery p/n). The home one rarely if ever runs on battery, it has something like 50 cycles in 4 years. The battery lasts pretty much as when it was new. The other runs often on battery and it only lasts half as much. I doubt it's a lemon, because it's the standard issue laptop at work, and my colleagues' are in the same boat. My iphone 14 pro's reported battery health has also degraded much faster than my iphone 7's. I use it much more often on battery than the old one which spent 90% of its time plugged in. But since the devices are different, the comparison isn't as meaningful as with the laptops.
    - 1y ago
Panzer04 1y ago
It is absolutely too much work. It's incredibly easy to get bogged into the weeds of config stuff like this and almost no one will care. if they did, I bet it's turn into a cluster of hearsay about magic settings that make almost no practical difference. Also, I'd argue it's not obvious that 80% charging is better for most people. You're taking an immediate 20% cut to battery life, and chances are it will take years for it to actually be better than charging to 100%. I guess it's good to have the option, but only if you almost never need that last bit of capacity.
- shpx 1y ago
  I don't like the 80% option because every time I'm leaving the house for extended periods, going hiking or traveling I think "is it worth it to go through 3 settings screens to take an extra 15% charge with me?" 15% is a micro optimization and it was easier when there was no option and I never thought about it. I want to think about other things, not my phone's battery capacity.
  - beeflet 1y ago
    Yeah but in android or something this would be just another "quick settings tile" like the "flashlight" or "night light" or "battery saving mode". You could call it "overcharge mode" or "extra battery mode", and like the "night light" mode it would get disabled once you reach a full charge, so you don't have to dig into settings to turn it off again.
    - vladvasiliu 1y ago
      I think that's the case on my mom's Android. And it's a basic Samsung galaxy something-or-other, nothing customized.
jallmann 1y ago
Charge it up to 80% in the firmware but show 100% in the UI. Wear leveling algorithms probably do something similar already.
- Scoundreller 1y ago
  Don’t forget a “defeat” mode where the system detects you’re a reviewer and really truly does charge to 100%.
- LiamPowell 1y ago
  100% is always just an arbitrary value chosen by the device or battery manufacturer, there's no 100% level inherent to a battery. Unfortunately there's very few manufacturers that will tell you their estimated number of cycles and none (as far as I know) that will give you the number of cycles as a function of charge percentage.
  - homebrewer 1y ago
    It's not arbitrary. Lithium batteries charging uses voltage termination, and the usual cutoff for 100% on lithium-cobalt batteries (so not LiFePO which is not yet widely used on phones) is 4.2 volts. It's the same for all batteries I've ever used or heard about. You can charge it to higher voltages, but basically nobody sane does that as it quickly becomes dangerous, and 4.2 is pretty much the standard voltage.
    - LiamPowell 1y ago
      Pouch batteries straight from distributors might all recommend 4.2V, but what's actually used in phones varies a lot. The Samsung Galaxy S21 for example charges all the way to 4.4V. I don't have a huge sample size to work with, but I have seen a number of recent Samsung batteries degrade alarmingly fast, likely because of this. According to [1], the S24 has gone all the way up to 4.45V. [1]: https://old.reddit.com/r/techsupport/comments/1ayqveg/samsung_s24_ultra_battery_voltage_too_high_while/ https://old.reddit.com/r/techsupport/comments/1ayqveg/samsun...
xiphias2 1y ago
Most multichargers solve it by having faster and slower charging ports. This may be not an app, but a nice / simple hardware based solution
Gigachad 1y ago
Feel like all of this would be a bit irrelevant if we just had easily replaceable batteries. Phone batteries don’t cost that much. Rather than worrying about charge speeds and charge %, I’d rather just slap a new battery in after 4 years.
- sans_souse 1y ago
  Totally agree. Tbh I never needed the phones to become as thin as cardboard. At the cost of sacraficing the ability to easily remove/replace the battery I certainly never wanted it.
  - 542354234235 1y ago
    >I never needed the phones to become as thin as cardboard And it is only thin until you put on the bulky case. If phones put a real battery and intigrated basic protection, it would still be thinner than the current small battery/outer case situation. Most people don't need tank-like Otterbox protection, they just need something that keeps bumps and small drops from shattering something.
- dingnuts 1y ago
  give me a battery door and a charging cradle so I can have two batteries, one that charges on the cradle and one in the phone to use and I'll swap them whenever I need, and never have to wait. The same way my Game Boy worked in the nineties with NiMH batteries. Why did we abandon that pattern?
  - vbezhenar 1y ago
    Replaceable batteries require thick case and also it's not easy to make the case waterproof. Consumers prefer thin waterproof cases.
    - satanfirst 1y ago
      I think most people prefer an older phone style. The difficulty is that the screen implies a large surface which then requires thinness to not have a problem of large volume as well as general awkwardness.
rconti 1y ago
My hack is to only use fast charging bricks, but at home I charge my phone wirelessly. So that means in practice I rarely fast charge it. Yes, it does heat up due to energy losses, but I suspect that's way less hard on the battery than the same amount of heat from actual high current charging (please correct me if I'm wrong). This means the only drawback is that my phone charging is cost-inefficient.
- mcny 1y ago
  There has been some noise about wireless charging causing faster battery degradation because the batteries are usually warmer with wireless charging. Could be a specific hardware or firmware defect only on the iPhone 14 line, I am not sure.
- hnuser123456 1y ago
  There are some wireless chargers with builtin fans. At least the pixel stand gen2 does.
Zak 1y ago
I use ACCA[0] to select my charge rate and limit. This can also set battery idle mode (power from USB without using the battery) when the charge limit is reached if the hardware supports it. I usually limit it to 60%, and charge at 500mA when I'm not in a hurry. Maybe that's too much fuss for most people, but I'm still using a five year old Pixel 4A on the original battery and its showing no signs of reduced battery performance. I probably wouldn't put in the effort if it was easy to replace the battery, but it is not. I might be a little less aggressive about it if I liked any current phones, but I do not. [0] https://f-droid.org/packages/mattecarra.accapp/ https://f-droid.org/packages/mattecarra.accapp/
kevin_thibedeau 1y ago
PD was never deployed for USB-A and was removed from the most recent standard. The grandfathered nonstandard charging protocols will linger around so long as type-A ports are the default.
dfxm12 1y ago
will change their phone regularly Yeah, I need my phone to just last until the end of the day. The charger is on the night stand. To Android's credit, if I have an alarm set, it'll time the charge to reach 100% as the alarm goes off. With these habits, I've never had to replace my phone due to the battery, so going the extra mile to preserve the battery seems like an exercise in futility...
monkemonke 1y ago
I actually built this for myself on my previous phone using Tasker. If you have root you can just set the charge voltage (basically redefining 100% as 4.1V or something to limit charge %) and current to whatever you want. It was especially nice to be able to limit the current to like 500mA while using Android Auto because GPS and data use gets the phone hot enough already. That phone's barely aged in the two years or so I had it. On my current phone I use wireless charging overnight and the 80% limit and I think that gets me most of the benefits of that hacky solution without requiring root.
mystified5016 1y ago
Google and Samsung phones have options to disable fast charging, though it's hidden in the system menus. Google phones have a feature that 'intelligently' (linear regression) scale down charge current at night so it reaches full just before your set morning time. The Samsung phone I had was pretty good, you had separate options to disable fast charging on either wired or wireless. But really my solution is quite simple: none of my habitual charging spots have a fast charger, they're all 5V 2A adapters. I do have a couple of fast chargers around the house, I just don't use them unless I really need to. It's a deliberate decision to fast charge. That and where applicable I limit my devices to 80-90% full charge. My Linux thinkpad has firmware level support for this, it's very nice.
wkat4242 1y ago
Samsung should at least make a quick settings toggle for fast charging. I constantly have to dig into that menu which is hidden deep down in settings. There's one for battery protection (the 80% thing) but not for fast charging.
hulitu 1y ago
> Would be nice to plug the phone in and unless I say otherwise it does a nice slow charge even if the cable and charger is capable of more. But if I press a button on the front after I plug it in then I can select fast and it goes as quickly as the combination allows This is Windows 95 style UI. We don't do that anymore. We are "smart" now. With blockchain security. And you can choose any colour you like, as long as it is a shade of grey. /s

LeifCarrotson 1y ago

> Maybe all the complexity around this is too much and people just want to plug it in and quick 100% as quick as possible and will change their phone regularly It's this, 100%. The nerds that care about charge temperature and battery degradation and proliferation of incompatible charging standards are a rounding error, most people just want to know it can charge fast in case they forget and need to leave soon. I am happy with my Chargie [1], an interposing dongle which provides a Bluetooth receiver and app that lets you set arbitrary preferences on your phone and fast charge, slow charge, or turn off the charger at configurable state of charge setpoints or times. [1] https://chargie.org/product/chargie-c-basic/ https://chargie.org/product/chargie-c-basic/

catlikesshrimp 1y ago
I had never thought such thing existed commercially. Mainly because I had looked for it myself in addition to asking about it without results. It needs an app but doesn't mention interoperability. There, I said it. It is not perfect. At least they allow you to set-up-in-app-and-use-without-app which is more than many products.
- hnuser123456 1y ago
  There is a built-in charge limiting feature in Android now, so that doesn't need any apps, but the only options are limit to 80% or 100%. But for something like this, how else are you going to get your phone to tell a charger when to turn off? Apparently, making an API that allows devs to reliably stop charging in software is too risky, so IoT devices with companion apps are the solution, of course. Not to mention the device manufacturers are probably quite happy to have batteries degrade significantly after warranty ends.
Funes- 1y ago
>needs an app Now imagine the same product but with different physical toggles or buttons on it for all the different charging modes. No apps. That'd be great.
- baby_souffle 1y ago
  Or even a way to communicate this to the charger from the phone using the vendor extension to PD protocol negotiations…
- LeifCarrotson 1y ago
  Switching between 500 mA, 2.1A, and USB-PD or QC is technically simple, but again you're making consumer electronics for a very, very small group of people. How would it determine when the attached device reaches 80% state of charge? Or what the time of day is? How could you program a schedule for weekdays and weekends? There are good reasons for Chargie to have an app, it's not just there to siphon up analytics.

Saris 1y ago

My Galaxy S21 lets me pick between normal, fast, or super-fast charging in the settings. Not quite one tap, but it does let you do it. That said "super-fast" charging on it is like 18W and still about an hour from 20%, so it doesn't really qualify as fast charging IMO, and at an hour is certainly not going to be causing any excess battery wear. It's just normal speed.

catlikesshrimp 1y ago
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quick_Charge https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quick_Charge Quick charge started at 7.5W My charge "Standard" was set in the time 500mA was supplied by most phone chargers. Just saying I am old.
- Saris 1y ago
  For sure, but for terms of battery wear all that really matters is the time to charge. Under 1 hour is getting into the realm of 'really fast' and heat inside the cell starts to become an issue.

dpifke 1y ago

Adaptive Charging on Pixel devices gets most of the way there: it will learn how long it's typically on the charger each day, and automatically slow the rate of charge to match, so that it finishes approximately an hour before you usually unplug it. There's a manual option to turn it off (charge at full rate this time only), but not to manually turn it on (such as giving it a target time to be fully charged). Older Pixels used what time the alarm was set as the target time to finish charging, which I preferred as someone who doesn't wake up at the same time every day; I'm not sure why they took that away.

mcny 1y ago
Another problem is the constant charging and discharging of battery while connected to external power. I believe the latest pixels got or will soon get the ability to run directly off the wall when connected to certain chargers. I would love to see this technology come to all phones. 80% cap might be controversial but I don't think what I am asking for is controversial in the least.
- vladvasiliu 1y ago
  > Another problem is the constant charging and discharging of battery while connected to external power. Is that actually the case? Anecdotally, all my devices which spend 99% of their time connected to external power show the least degradation in reported capacity and the best preservation of their original battery life. I'm talking about iPhones, macbooks and hp laptops. For the latter, I have two basically identical ones, one for work and the other for home (same model number, same generation, same battery p/n). The home one rarely if ever runs on battery, it has something like 50 cycles in 4 years. The battery lasts pretty much as when it was new. The other runs often on battery and it only lasts half as much. I doubt it's a lemon, because it's the standard issue laptop at work, and my colleagues' are in the same boat. My iphone 14 pro's reported battery health has also degraded much faster than my iphone 7's. I use it much more often on battery than the old one which spent 90% of its time plugged in. But since the devices are different, the comparison isn't as meaningful as with the laptops.
  - 1y ago

Panzer04 1y ago

It is absolutely too much work. It's incredibly easy to get bogged into the weeds of config stuff like this and almost no one will care. if they did, I bet it's turn into a cluster of hearsay about magic settings that make almost no practical difference. Also, I'd argue it's not obvious that 80% charging is better for most people. You're taking an immediate 20% cut to battery life, and chances are it will take years for it to actually be better than charging to 100%. I guess it's good to have the option, but only if you almost never need that last bit of capacity.

shpx 1y ago
I don't like the 80% option because every time I'm leaving the house for extended periods, going hiking or traveling I think "is it worth it to go through 3 settings screens to take an extra 15% charge with me?" 15% is a micro optimization and it was easier when there was no option and I never thought about it. I want to think about other things, not my phone's battery capacity.
- beeflet 1y ago
  Yeah but in android or something this would be just another "quick settings tile" like the "flashlight" or "night light" or "battery saving mode". You could call it "overcharge mode" or "extra battery mode", and like the "night light" mode it would get disabled once you reach a full charge, so you don't have to dig into settings to turn it off again.
  - vladvasiliu 1y ago
    I think that's the case on my mom's Android. And it's a basic Samsung galaxy something-or-other, nothing customized.

jallmann 1y ago

Charge it up to 80% in the firmware but show 100% in the UI. Wear leveling algorithms probably do something similar already.

Scoundreller 1y ago
Don’t forget a “defeat” mode where the system detects you’re a reviewer and really truly does charge to 100%.
LiamPowell 1y ago
100% is always just an arbitrary value chosen by the device or battery manufacturer, there's no 100% level inherent to a battery. Unfortunately there's very few manufacturers that will tell you their estimated number of cycles and none (as far as I know) that will give you the number of cycles as a function of charge percentage.
- homebrewer 1y ago
  It's not arbitrary. Lithium batteries charging uses voltage termination, and the usual cutoff for 100% on lithium-cobalt batteries (so not LiFePO which is not yet widely used on phones) is 4.2 volts. It's the same for all batteries I've ever used or heard about. You can charge it to higher voltages, but basically nobody sane does that as it quickly becomes dangerous, and 4.2 is pretty much the standard voltage.
  - LiamPowell 1y ago
    Pouch batteries straight from distributors might all recommend 4.2V, but what's actually used in phones varies a lot. The Samsung Galaxy S21 for example charges all the way to 4.4V. I don't have a huge sample size to work with, but I have seen a number of recent Samsung batteries degrade alarmingly fast, likely because of this. According to [1], the S24 has gone all the way up to 4.45V. [1]: https://old.reddit.com/r/techsupport/comments/1ayqveg/samsung_s24_ultra_battery_voltage_too_high_while/ https://old.reddit.com/r/techsupport/comments/1ayqveg/samsun...

xiphias2 1y ago

Most multichargers solve it by having faster and slower charging ports. This may be not an app, but a nice / simple hardware based solution

Gigachad 1y ago

Feel like all of this would be a bit irrelevant if we just had easily replaceable batteries. Phone batteries don’t cost that much. Rather than worrying about charge speeds and charge %, I’d rather just slap a new battery in after 4 years.

sans_souse 1y ago
Totally agree. Tbh I never needed the phones to become as thin as cardboard. At the cost of sacraficing the ability to easily remove/replace the battery I certainly never wanted it.
- 542354234235 1y ago
  >I never needed the phones to become as thin as cardboard And it is only thin until you put on the bulky case. If phones put a real battery and intigrated basic protection, it would still be thinner than the current small battery/outer case situation. Most people don't need tank-like Otterbox protection, they just need something that keeps bumps and small drops from shattering something.
dingnuts 1y ago
give me a battery door and a charging cradle so I can have two batteries, one that charges on the cradle and one in the phone to use and I'll swap them whenever I need, and never have to wait. The same way my Game Boy worked in the nineties with NiMH batteries. Why did we abandon that pattern?
- vbezhenar 1y ago
  Replaceable batteries require thick case and also it's not easy to make the case waterproof. Consumers prefer thin waterproof cases.
  - satanfirst 1y ago
    I think most people prefer an older phone style. The difficulty is that the screen implies a large surface which then requires thinness to not have a problem of large volume as well as general awkwardness.

rconti 1y ago

My hack is to only use fast charging bricks, but at home I charge my phone wirelessly. So that means in practice I rarely fast charge it. Yes, it does heat up due to energy losses, but I suspect that's way less hard on the battery than the same amount of heat from actual high current charging (please correct me if I'm wrong). This means the only drawback is that my phone charging is cost-inefficient.

mcny 1y ago
There has been some noise about wireless charging causing faster battery degradation because the batteries are usually warmer with wireless charging. Could be a specific hardware or firmware defect only on the iPhone 14 line, I am not sure.
hnuser123456 1y ago
There are some wireless chargers with builtin fans. At least the pixel stand gen2 does.

Zak 1y ago

I use ACCA[0] to select my charge rate and limit. This can also set battery idle mode (power from USB without using the battery) when the charge limit is reached if the hardware supports it. I usually limit it to 60%, and charge at 500mA when I'm not in a hurry. Maybe that's too much fuss for most people, but I'm still using a five year old Pixel 4A on the original battery and its showing no signs of reduced battery performance. I probably wouldn't put in the effort if it was easy to replace the battery, but it is not. I might be a little less aggressive about it if I liked any current phones, but I do not. [0] https://f-droid.org/packages/mattecarra.accapp/ https://f-droid.org/packages/mattecarra.accapp/

kevin_thibedeau 1y ago

PD was never deployed for USB-A and was removed from the most recent standard. The grandfathered nonstandard charging protocols will linger around so long as type-A ports are the default.

dfxm12 1y ago

will change their phone regularly Yeah, I need my phone to just last until the end of the day. The charger is on the night stand. To Android's credit, if I have an alarm set, it'll time the charge to reach 100% as the alarm goes off. With these habits, I've never had to replace my phone due to the battery, so going the extra mile to preserve the battery seems like an exercise in futility...

monkemonke 1y ago

I actually built this for myself on my previous phone using Tasker. If you have root you can just set the charge voltage (basically redefining 100% as 4.1V or something to limit charge %) and current to whatever you want. It was especially nice to be able to limit the current to like 500mA while using Android Auto because GPS and data use gets the phone hot enough already. That phone's barely aged in the two years or so I had it. On my current phone I use wireless charging overnight and the 80% limit and I think that gets me most of the benefits of that hacky solution without requiring root.

mystified5016 1y ago

Google and Samsung phones have options to disable fast charging, though it's hidden in the system menus. Google phones have a feature that 'intelligently' (linear regression) scale down charge current at night so it reaches full just before your set morning time. The Samsung phone I had was pretty good, you had separate options to disable fast charging on either wired or wireless. But really my solution is quite simple: none of my habitual charging spots have a fast charger, they're all 5V 2A adapters. I do have a couple of fast chargers around the house, I just don't use them unless I really need to. It's a deliberate decision to fast charge. That and where applicable I limit my devices to 80-90% full charge. My Linux thinkpad has firmware level support for this, it's very nice.

wkat4242 1y ago

Samsung should at least make a quick settings toggle for fast charging. I constantly have to dig into that menu which is hidden deep down in settings. There's one for battery protection (the 80% thing) but not for fast charging.

hulitu 1y ago

> Would be nice to plug the phone in and unless I say otherwise it does a nice slow charge even if the cable and charger is capable of more. But if I press a button on the front after I plug it in then I can select fast and it goes as quickly as the combination allows This is Windows 95 style UI. We don't do that anymore. We are "smart" now. With blockchain security. And you can choose any colour you like, as long as it is a shade of grey. /s