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My first thought about reading this was how the Chinese whaling fleets would use this to their advantage. Not something I would be cool with and with any "good"

My first thought about reading this was how the Chinese whaling fleets would use this to their advantage. Not something I would be cool with and with any "good" technology, you have nefarious parties always looking to exploit it for their own ends.

jamescrowley 1y ago
Iceland, Japan and Norway are the culprits still supporting whaling, not China - just fyi :)
- repeekad 1y ago
  Did China stop whaling or did they just add it to the list of things they have to be quiet about? like how drugs are heavily controlled on the mainland and yet fentanyl precursors almost all come from China before being smuggled into US?
  - missedthecue 1y ago
    China joined the IWC over 40 years ago and banned whaling. They do not engage in commercial whaling.
    - samplatt 1y ago
      China consumes roughly a third of seafood caught globally and is the world's leading exporter. If you think China isn't whole-ass into illegal commercial whaling, then I have a bridge to sell you.
      - lostlogin 1y ago
        Have you got any links or sources on this? I have had a quick look and can’t find anything that agrees.
        _t9ow 1y ago
        > can’t find anything that agrees That's because many people allow their (completely warranted) distrust of the CCP to justify all sorts of other spurious, baseless accusations of the CCP. The CCP has done many things that deserve criticism; let's not invent new ones.
      - blitzar 1y ago
        I think you are confusing China and Japan. The latter of which conduct the hunt openly.
- BowBun 1y ago
  Perhaps use a better word than culprit, since fishing whale is legal in all three of those places!
  - jamiek88 1y ago
    Human morality is above any nations petty laws. Culprit is the right word for those monsters still slaughtering these magnificent creatures. Evil would be a better one.
    - djrj477dhsnv 1y ago
      As long as populations are managed to avoid loss of biodiversity, I think it's hard to argue hunting is evil. Animals hunting other animals is a natural part of life.
      - rl3 1y ago
        >... I think it's hard to argue hunting is evil. Very few if any clean kills, infliction of immense suffering on creatures that have a cognitive capacity rivaling that of humans prior to robbing them of life, clear lack of necessity in the first place. I dunno, seems kind of evil to me. This makes a good argument that the cruelty involved is undue: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8e1kb4D4nY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8e1kb4D4nY
      - andrewflnr 1y ago
        The only responsible way to "manage" whale populations is to let them repopulate for at least a hundred years, probably more. IIRC their populations are still way below pre-whaling levels, with some weird knock-on effects.
        kjkjadksj 1y ago
        Is it even realistic to expect similar population counts when the context of the ocean is so different today? What of the distribution of nutrients between now and then? Do these nutrients even make it to the right level in the food web at sufficient levels to support such a whale population today?
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alephnan 1y ago
I dislike the CCP and their recent wave of propaganda as much as the next person But I find it inconsistent to call China out for this instead of Japan. HackerNews has a tendency to jump through mental gymnastics to justify that Japan is perfect and can do no wrong. I say this after just leaving a Japanese museum 30 minutes ago that had blackface figures on exhibit Either don’t call any country out for whaling or start by calling the countries typically deemed as more developed, advanced and progressive first. In other words, be moral relativist or if you should to be a moral absolutist then don’t pick and choose countries to exempt
- blitzar 1y ago
  People are simply mistaking Japan and China. HackerNews has a heavy US skew. From public statments of holders of the highest offices of their country - "they are all pesants" is the extent of US knowledge about Asia and if they knew what a map was they would point to the region inhabited by only pengins and suggest they should bomb them back into the stone age.
  - _t9ow 1y ago
    > point to the region inhabited by only pengins and suggest they should bomb them back into the stone age Or levy tariffs on the penguins.
- doodlebugging 1y ago
  >HackerNews has a tendency to jump through mental gymnastics to justify that Japan is perfect and can do no wrong. I say this after just leaving a Japanese museum 30 minutes ago that had blackface figures on exhibit This is an interesting comment that seems to suggest that exhibiting blackface figures in a museum context is inappropriate or bad. I have never been to Japan and have not seen this display so I can't comment on the contextual layout. I am left wondering how future generations can ever benefit from the mistakes of their ancestors if those mistakes are not documented and available to serve as teaching moments. Maybe this is why it is called a cycle of life - we erase or bury all the uncomfortable stuff so that our kids and their kids have no idea that we (our societies) already suffered the consequences of crossing that bridge long before they came around. I would argue instead that museums are the best context for displays like blackface where they can put everything into context for future generations and perhaps as a people we can concentrate on solving new sets of problems with each successive generation. That would sound a lot more like progress to me.
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jamescrowley 1y ago

Iceland, Japan and Norway are the culprits still supporting whaling, not China - just fyi :)

repeekad 1y ago
Did China stop whaling or did they just add it to the list of things they have to be quiet about? like how drugs are heavily controlled on the mainland and yet fentanyl precursors almost all come from China before being smuggled into US?
- missedthecue 1y ago
  China joined the IWC over 40 years ago and banned whaling. They do not engage in commercial whaling.
  - samplatt 1y ago
    China consumes roughly a third of seafood caught globally and is the world's leading exporter. If you think China isn't whole-ass into illegal commercial whaling, then I have a bridge to sell you.
    - lostlogin 1y ago
      Have you got any links or sources on this? I have had a quick look and can’t find anything that agrees.
      - _t9ow 1y ago
        > can’t find anything that agrees That's because many people allow their (completely warranted) distrust of the CCP to justify all sorts of other spurious, baseless accusations of the CCP. The CCP has done many things that deserve criticism; let's not invent new ones.
    - blitzar 1y ago
      I think you are confusing China and Japan. The latter of which conduct the hunt openly.
BowBun 1y ago
Perhaps use a better word than culprit, since fishing whale is legal in all three of those places!
- jamiek88 1y ago
  Human morality is above any nations petty laws. Culprit is the right word for those monsters still slaughtering these magnificent creatures. Evil would be a better one.
  - djrj477dhsnv 1y ago
    As long as populations are managed to avoid loss of biodiversity, I think it's hard to argue hunting is evil. Animals hunting other animals is a natural part of life.
    - rl3 1y ago
      >... I think it's hard to argue hunting is evil. Very few if any clean kills, infliction of immense suffering on creatures that have a cognitive capacity rivaling that of humans prior to robbing them of life, clear lack of necessity in the first place. I dunno, seems kind of evil to me. This makes a good argument that the cruelty involved is undue: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8e1kb4D4nY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8e1kb4D4nY
    - andrewflnr 1y ago
      The only responsible way to "manage" whale populations is to let them repopulate for at least a hundred years, probably more. IIRC their populations are still way below pre-whaling levels, with some weird knock-on effects.
      - kjkjadksj 1y ago
        Is it even realistic to expect similar population counts when the context of the ocean is so different today? What of the distribution of nutrients between now and then? Do these nutrients even make it to the right level in the food web at sufficient levels to support such a whale population today?

deleted 1y ago

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alephnan 1y ago

I dislike the CCP and their recent wave of propaganda as much as the next person But I find it inconsistent to call China out for this instead of Japan. HackerNews has a tendency to jump through mental gymnastics to justify that Japan is perfect and can do no wrong. I say this after just leaving a Japanese museum 30 minutes ago that had blackface figures on exhibit Either don’t call any country out for whaling or start by calling the countries typically deemed as more developed, advanced and progressive first. In other words, be moral relativist or if you should to be a moral absolutist then don’t pick and choose countries to exempt

blitzar 1y ago
People are simply mistaking Japan and China. HackerNews has a heavy US skew. From public statments of holders of the highest offices of their country - "they are all pesants" is the extent of US knowledge about Asia and if they knew what a map was they would point to the region inhabited by only pengins and suggest they should bomb them back into the stone age.
- _t9ow 1y ago
  > point to the region inhabited by only pengins and suggest they should bomb them back into the stone age Or levy tariffs on the penguins.
doodlebugging 1y ago
>HackerNews has a tendency to jump through mental gymnastics to justify that Japan is perfect and can do no wrong. I say this after just leaving a Japanese museum 30 minutes ago that had blackface figures on exhibit This is an interesting comment that seems to suggest that exhibiting blackface figures in a museum context is inappropriate or bad. I have never been to Japan and have not seen this display so I can't comment on the contextual layout. I am left wondering how future generations can ever benefit from the mistakes of their ancestors if those mistakes are not documented and available to serve as teaching moments. Maybe this is why it is called a cycle of life - we erase or bury all the uncomfortable stuff so that our kids and their kids have no idea that we (our societies) already suffered the consequences of crossing that bridge long before they came around. I would argue instead that museums are the best context for displays like blackface where they can put everything into context for future generations and perhaps as a people we can concentrate on solving new sets of problems with each successive generation. That would sound a lot more like progress to me.

deleted 1y ago

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