6 ms·

>In the US, homicide, suicide, and drug overdose are the leading causes of pregnancy-associated death If you kill yourself with recreational drugs or intention

by ty6853 2y ago

>In the US, homicide, suicide, and drug overdose are the leading causes of pregnancy-associated death If you kill yourself with recreational drugs or intentionally that is not pregnancy-related/associated, except by the most disingenuous peddlers who want to go on a semantic crusade about what 'related'/'associated' is in order to push their agenda.

explodes 2y ago
Why do more pregnant Americans commit suicide?
- ty6853 2y ago
  How do you know it's not the other way around -- more suicidal people become pregnant? I would not be surprised if you plan to kill yourself (or too high to care) you might not use protection and fuck freely. What would be the point in preventing pregnancy if you didn't plan on living anyway?
- SpicyLemonZest 2y ago
  That's not how "pregnancy-related" is calculated in the US. As the source link notes, deaths occuring up to 1 year after giving birth can be considered pregnancy-related.
  - EA-3167 2y ago
    That's... incredibly unhelpful, although I suppose it explains why the US has more of these deaths than other countries: accounting practices.
    - ty6853 2y ago
      The US has some of the highest levels of public health research (NIH) and science funding (NSF). And despite not having universal healthcare, we have I think the highest government funded health care spending in the world (~8% of GDP or ~2 Trillion). Part of the way to gain this funding is to label things 'associated' or 'related' in order to trigger a funding grab for your particular field of interest. NIH and NSF funding is mostly adversarial, for the most part the pot is fixed and you can win by making your case more dire than the other guy. Thus you have weird stuff like anything remotely having a connection to COVID or pregnancy getting tagged in to influence the purse strings.
    - mrandish 2y ago
      One would hope any study comparing statistics between countries would normalize for differences in thresholds and time frames. But maybe not?
      - potato3732842 2y ago
        It's a systemic problem. The people crunching the numbers want to leave open the door to future research. If they ask X and crunch numbers and get answer Y but think it could be explained by Z they'll just leave it at Y and make Z it's own follow up so then can get credit for two rather than one. The people summarizing it for mass market consumption have every incentive to go with the most outrageous interpretations of Y because that's what grabs eyeballs and that's how they get paid. And this is before you account for all the bad actors who'll willfully make little "oversights" like not correcting for stats across countries because they or their backers or colleagues they're trying to curry favor with have an axe to grind and want to see a particular result.
  - FireBeyond 2y ago
    No, it doesn't, at all: > within 1 year of the end of pregnancy from any cause related to or aggravated by the pregnancy We have you here saying "If you overdose on recreational drugs a year after giving birth that's considered pregnancy-related" - no it's not. Just as elsewhere someone is claiming "If you die in a car accident six months after giving birth, that's pregnancy-related". Too many people think they have these "gotcha" moments that they think have uncovered some ideological agenda in this data, but in reality, it only uncovers their own agenda. The same was true a few years ago - "if you fall down the stairs and die a year after having COVID, that will be counted as a COVID death". Again, no, it won't.
    - SpicyLemonZest 2y ago
      The source article says that "mental and behavior disorders and drug and alcohol induced death contributed to 21.2% of late maternal deaths". It seems clear that at least some drug overdoses are being counted in the late maternal deaths subcategory. (The article also says "homicide, suicide, and drug overdose are the leading causes of pregnancy-associated death", although they do take care to note that pregnancy-associated is a broader category which statistics don't typically include.)
thunderfork 2y ago
[dead]
mike-the-mikado 2y ago
Post-natal depression affects many mothers who subsequently go on to have happy lives. Suicide among new mothers has a terrible effect on their surviving family and friends. Anything that can be done to reduce this death rate must be worth considering.

by ty6853 2y ago

explodes 2y ago

Why do more pregnant Americans commit suicide?

ty6853 2y ago
How do you know it's not the other way around -- more suicidal people become pregnant? I would not be surprised if you plan to kill yourself (or too high to care) you might not use protection and fuck freely. What would be the point in preventing pregnancy if you didn't plan on living anyway?
SpicyLemonZest 2y ago
That's not how "pregnancy-related" is calculated in the US. As the source link notes, deaths occuring up to 1 year after giving birth can be considered pregnancy-related.
- EA-3167 2y ago
  That's... incredibly unhelpful, although I suppose it explains why the US has more of these deaths than other countries: accounting practices.
  - ty6853 2y ago
    The US has some of the highest levels of public health research (NIH) and science funding (NSF). And despite not having universal healthcare, we have I think the highest government funded health care spending in the world (~8% of GDP or ~2 Trillion). Part of the way to gain this funding is to label things 'associated' or 'related' in order to trigger a funding grab for your particular field of interest. NIH and NSF funding is mostly adversarial, for the most part the pot is fixed and you can win by making your case more dire than the other guy. Thus you have weird stuff like anything remotely having a connection to COVID or pregnancy getting tagged in to influence the purse strings.
  - mrandish 2y ago
    One would hope any study comparing statistics between countries would normalize for differences in thresholds and time frames. But maybe not?
    - potato3732842 2y ago
      It's a systemic problem. The people crunching the numbers want to leave open the door to future research. If they ask X and crunch numbers and get answer Y but think it could be explained by Z they'll just leave it at Y and make Z it's own follow up so then can get credit for two rather than one. The people summarizing it for mass market consumption have every incentive to go with the most outrageous interpretations of Y because that's what grabs eyeballs and that's how they get paid. And this is before you account for all the bad actors who'll willfully make little "oversights" like not correcting for stats across countries because they or their backers or colleagues they're trying to curry favor with have an axe to grind and want to see a particular result.
- FireBeyond 2y ago
  No, it doesn't, at all: > within 1 year of the end of pregnancy from any cause related to or aggravated by the pregnancy We have you here saying "If you overdose on recreational drugs a year after giving birth that's considered pregnancy-related" - no it's not. Just as elsewhere someone is claiming "If you die in a car accident six months after giving birth, that's pregnancy-related". Too many people think they have these "gotcha" moments that they think have uncovered some ideological agenda in this data, but in reality, it only uncovers their own agenda. The same was true a few years ago - "if you fall down the stairs and die a year after having COVID, that will be counted as a COVID death". Again, no, it won't.
  - SpicyLemonZest 2y ago
    The source article says that "mental and behavior disorders and drug and alcohol induced death contributed to 21.2% of late maternal deaths". It seems clear that at least some drug overdoses are being counted in the late maternal deaths subcategory. (The article also says "homicide, suicide, and drug overdose are the leading causes of pregnancy-associated death", although they do take care to note that pregnancy-associated is a broader category which statistics don't typically include.)

thunderfork 2y ago

[dead]

mike-the-mikado 2y ago

Post-natal depression affects many mothers who subsequently go on to have happy lives. Suicide among new mothers has a terrible effect on their surviving family and friends. Anything that can be done to reduce this death rate must be worth considering.