5 ms·

I agree that the process is unnecessarily complex, but I also think hiring someone for that would be the wise choice in most places anyway. And even in Germany

I agree that the process is unnecessarily complex, but I also think hiring someone for that would be the wise choice in most places anyway. And even in Germany hiring someone for that would probably amount to paying 500-1000€ for the whole registration of the company instead of doing everything yourself and only paying the 100-200€ notary fees. It's not as bad as you might think. > I will never try it in my home country. May I ask, where would you try it? As I understand it, it's not really possible to found in a different European country while you're still living in Germany.

zwnow 2y ago
I never thought about founding my own company while living in Germany. I hate this countries bureaucracy to the core. If I ever wanted to found one, I'd first move out of Germany.
- wombatpm 2y ago
  German Bureaucracy: see Th Trial by Franz Kafka for a fictional view that is surprisingly accurate
echelon 2y ago
It's so easy (relative to this) to just go grab a SAFE. No strings, no bureaucracy. You can structure your endeavor however you want. And you can sometimes do it with just a conversation.
pembrook 2y ago
> but I also think hiring someone for [government paperwork] would be the wise choice in most places anyway. I’m not sure if you’ve ever tried founding a business or fundraising in any other non-Germany country, but this is an insane thing to say imo. Is this why Germany has no globally relevant software (or hardware tbh) companies founded in the last 40 years? Are we sure we want to be holding up this model as an example of “a good one”?
- dinoqqq 2y ago
  You probably missed SAP then. > The company is the largest non-American software company by revenue and the world's third-largest publicly traded software company by revenue. As of December 2023, SAP is the largest German company by market capitalization. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAP https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAP
  - codethief 2y ago
    I suppose OP specifically excluded SAP as it was founded more than 40 years ago.
    - fsndz 2y ago
      SAP is kinda of a monopoly no ? The software is bloated and complex to use. The UI is dated but everyone still uses it because it is so embedded into the core arteries of businesses.
      - fakedang 2y ago
        It's not a monopoly if it is hard to migrate from. SAP doesn't go out of its way to prevent you from migrating out of the HANA database. It's just that by the time you need a software like SAP, whatever you're buying becomes business critical and hard to migrate from regardless. And SAP is good enough to handle all kinds of edge case scenarios reasonably strongly. SAP doesn't even engage in monopolistic practices like what Microsoft or Apple do. SAP and Salesforce are pretty much in the same bucket imo. The reason there is no Hubspot for SAP is that most smaller companies don't really need an ERP system.
        fsndz 2y ago
        true. SAP is more of an entrenched SaaS. Once you have it, the switching costs are too high later on. What an amazing kind of biz. The stickiness is crazy.
  - bgnn 2y ago
Gud 2y ago
Why would that be “a wise choice”? I’m from Sweden and live in Switzerland. I know many people who have their own companies, and I was looking to start one myself before moving to Switzerland. It is SUPER EASY. I’ve helped my wife become self employed in Switzerland. I do most of the admin work for her. Again, very straight forward.
- AlchemistCamp 2y ago
  I think Sweden is one of the very most entrepreneur-friendly EU countries. It's got a big safety net, but doesn't impose much bureaucratic or financial burden on new businesses or even solopreneurs just getting started out.

zwnow 2y ago

I never thought about founding my own company while living in Germany. I hate this countries bureaucracy to the core. If I ever wanted to found one, I'd first move out of Germany.

wombatpm 2y ago
German Bureaucracy: see Th Trial by Franz Kafka for a fictional view that is surprisingly accurate

echelon 2y ago

It's so easy (relative to this) to just go grab a SAFE. No strings, no bureaucracy. You can structure your endeavor however you want. And you can sometimes do it with just a conversation.

pembrook 2y ago

> but I also think hiring someone for [government paperwork] would be the wise choice in most places anyway. I’m not sure if you’ve ever tried founding a business or fundraising in any other non-Germany country, but this is an insane thing to say imo. Is this why Germany has no globally relevant software (or hardware tbh) companies founded in the last 40 years? Are we sure we want to be holding up this model as an example of “a good one”?

dinoqqq 2y ago
You probably missed SAP then. > The company is the largest non-American software company by revenue and the world's third-largest publicly traded software company by revenue. As of December 2023, SAP is the largest German company by market capitalization. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAP https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAP
- codethief 2y ago
  I suppose OP specifically excluded SAP as it was founded more than 40 years ago.
  - fsndz 2y ago
    SAP is kinda of a monopoly no ? The software is bloated and complex to use. The UI is dated but everyone still uses it because it is so embedded into the core arteries of businesses.
    - fakedang 2y ago
      It's not a monopoly if it is hard to migrate from. SAP doesn't go out of its way to prevent you from migrating out of the HANA database. It's just that by the time you need a software like SAP, whatever you're buying becomes business critical and hard to migrate from regardless. And SAP is good enough to handle all kinds of edge case scenarios reasonably strongly. SAP doesn't even engage in monopolistic practices like what Microsoft or Apple do. SAP and Salesforce are pretty much in the same bucket imo. The reason there is no Hubspot for SAP is that most smaller companies don't really need an ERP system.
      - fsndz 2y ago
        true. SAP is more of an entrenched SaaS. Once you have it, the switching costs are too high later on. What an amazing kind of biz. The stickiness is crazy.
- bgnn 2y ago

Gud 2y ago

Why would that be “a wise choice”? I’m from Sweden and live in Switzerland. I know many people who have their own companies, and I was looking to start one myself before moving to Switzerland. It is SUPER EASY. I’ve helped my wife become self employed in Switzerland. I do most of the admin work for her. Again, very straight forward.

AlchemistCamp 2y ago
I think Sweden is one of the very most entrepreneur-friendly EU countries. It's got a big safety net, but doesn't impose much bureaucratic or financial burden on new businesses or even solopreneurs just getting started out.