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> instead he is a fraud/charlatan and... Just see him talking about things at NeuraLink. Musk wouldn't exist if it weren't for the people working for him. It's

> instead he is a fraud/charlatan and... Just see him talking about things at NeuraLink. Musk wouldn't exist if it weren't for the people working for him. It's a clown that made it to the top in a very dubious way.

glitchc 2y ago
Not dubious. He was rich to begin with and used that wealth to make more.
- ravenstine 2y ago
  Yes, though he wouldn't be relevant if people didn't believe he is a genius.
  - dboreham 2y ago
    Dubious about that. I think people thought he had a bunch of money, so did things for him in exchange for some of that money.
    - glitchc 2y ago
      His father's profile: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Errol_Musk https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Errol_Musk
  - crote 2y ago
    A lot of people believe you need to be a hard-working genius to get rich, so anyone rich must logically be a hard-working genius. Similarly, they believe anyone poor must be a lazy idiot. In reality getting rich has more to do with opportunity, connections, and luck - but accepting that means you've got to accept that the American Dream has always been a lie. It's much easier to convince yourself that people like Elon are geniuses.
plun9 2y ago
What's wrong with him talking about things at Neuralink?
- tim333 2y ago
  And while I haven't seen the talking, Musk never claimed to be a neurologist or have expertise in that area.
dgrin91 2y ago
I see this get thrown around once in a while and I really don't get it. Isn't this true of basically every leader? Gates, Jobs, Buffet, Obama, they all wouldn't existing without their teams. Isn't that just obvious? Isn't one of the important markers of a good leader to be able to build a good team?
- tim333 2y ago
  Buffett did pretty well before having a team. I still think Musk is quite good at physics/engineering type stuff. It's not everyone who can start with modest money and transform industries (rockets and evs mostly).
- mmooss 2y ago
  > I see this get thrown around once in a while and I really don't get it. Isn't this true of basically every leader? Gates, Jobs, Buffet, Obama, they all wouldn't existing without their teams. Isn't that just obvious? Isn't one of the important markers of a good leader to be able to build a good team? The others don't claim the extremes of power and genius, based to a large extent on what their teams do. They also build good teams - look at DOGE, for example.
rstuart4133 2y ago
> Musk wouldn't exist if it weren't for the people working for him. I've decided Musk core talent is creating and running an engineering team. He's done it many times now - Tesla, SpaceX, Paypal, even twitter. It's interesting because I suspect he isn't a particular good engineer himself, although the only evidence I have for that is tried to convert Paypal from Linux to Windows. His addiction to AI's getting results quickly isn't a good look either. To make the product work in the long term the technique has to get you 100% of the way there, not the 70% we see in Tesla and of now DOGE. He isn't particularly good at running businesses either, as both twitter shows and his solar roof's show. But that doesn't matter. He's assembled lots of engineering teams now, and he just needs a few of them to work to make him rich. Long ago it was people who could build train lines faster and cheaper than anyone else that drove the economy, then it was oil fields, then I dunno - maybe assembly lines powered by humans. But now wealth creation is driven by teams of very high level engineers duking it out, whether they be developing 5G, car assembly lines or rockets. Build the best team and you win. Musk has won several times now, in very different fields.

glitchc 2y ago

Not dubious. He was rich to begin with and used that wealth to make more.

ravenstine 2y ago
Yes, though he wouldn't be relevant if people didn't believe he is a genius.
- dboreham 2y ago
  Dubious about that. I think people thought he had a bunch of money, so did things for him in exchange for some of that money.
  - glitchc 2y ago
    His father's profile: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Errol_Musk https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Errol_Musk
- crote 2y ago
  A lot of people believe you need to be a hard-working genius to get rich, so anyone rich must logically be a hard-working genius. Similarly, they believe anyone poor must be a lazy idiot. In reality getting rich has more to do with opportunity, connections, and luck - but accepting that means you've got to accept that the American Dream has always been a lie. It's much easier to convince yourself that people like Elon are geniuses.

plun9 2y ago

What's wrong with him talking about things at Neuralink?

tim333 2y ago
And while I haven't seen the talking, Musk never claimed to be a neurologist or have expertise in that area.

dgrin91 2y ago

I see this get thrown around once in a while and I really don't get it. Isn't this true of basically every leader? Gates, Jobs, Buffet, Obama, they all wouldn't existing without their teams. Isn't that just obvious? Isn't one of the important markers of a good leader to be able to build a good team?

tim333 2y ago
Buffett did pretty well before having a team. I still think Musk is quite good at physics/engineering type stuff. It's not everyone who can start with modest money and transform industries (rockets and evs mostly).
mmooss 2y ago
> I see this get thrown around once in a while and I really don't get it. Isn't this true of basically every leader? Gates, Jobs, Buffet, Obama, they all wouldn't existing without their teams. Isn't that just obvious? Isn't one of the important markers of a good leader to be able to build a good team? The others don't claim the extremes of power and genius, based to a large extent on what their teams do. They also build good teams - look at DOGE, for example.

rstuart4133 2y ago

> Musk wouldn't exist if it weren't for the people working for him. I've decided Musk core talent is creating and running an engineering team. He's done it many times now - Tesla, SpaceX, Paypal, even twitter. It's interesting because I suspect he isn't a particular good engineer himself, although the only evidence I have for that is tried to convert Paypal from Linux to Windows. His addiction to AI's getting results quickly isn't a good look either. To make the product work in the long term the technique has to get you 100% of the way there, not the 70% we see in Tesla and of now DOGE. He isn't particularly good at running businesses either, as both twitter shows and his solar roof's show. But that doesn't matter. He's assembled lots of engineering teams now, and he just needs a few of them to work to make him rich. Long ago it was people who could build train lines faster and cheaper than anyone else that drove the economy, then it was oil fields, then I dunno - maybe assembly lines powered by humans. But now wealth creation is driven by teams of very high level engineers duking it out, whether they be developing 5G, car assembly lines or rockets. Build the best team and you win. Musk has won several times now, in very different fields.