9 ms·

Video footage appears to contradict Israeli account of Gaza medic killings

188 points by r721 2y ago

kvdveer 2y ago
As long as a substantial number of christians consider Israel a divine-ordained country, there will not be any repercussions for any crime they commit. The Bible contains literal instructions for genocide, and many Christians bemoan anci nt Israel for not following those instructions to the letter.
- actionfromafar 2y ago
  We’re way off repercussions territory. Trump just cut the leash and let the foxes run wild.
- like_any_other 2y ago
  Only 8% of Americans have a positive impression of Zionism [1]. Whatever is driving US support for Israel, it's not the will of the people. [1] Figure 2, "What is your impression of Zionism?", https://www.brookings.edu/articles/how-do-americans-feel-about-zionism-antisemitism-and-israel/ https://www.brookings.edu/articles/how-do-americans-feel-abo...
  - watwut 2y ago
    Sure, but conservative Christians do have disproportionate influence on politics ... and they believe these.
    - like_any_other 2y ago
      Suppose that they do - why is this the only area where they have had such astounding success? The closest they've come elsewhere is bans on abortion, where their victories are limited and intermittent, and the occasional transgender bathroom ban. The persecution of Christians abroad [1] doesn't even show up on their radar. From this behavior, one would think support for Israel was the central pillar of the Christian faith. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_post%E2%80%93Cold_War_era https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_t...
      - throwaway01536 2y ago
        > From this behavior, one would think support for Israel was the central pillar of the Christian faith For some, it is their primary goal. They think the end times are near, and by escalating the conflict they hope to make it happen as soon as possible. They support Israel because the Bible says that those that bless Israel is blessed. On the other hand, they think only some Christians will survive the end times, so any non-christians (jews included) that are hurt, doesn't really matter. It's just collateral damage in a holy war. It is one of the reasons why this conflict is so special for many. This is not a conspiracy, but a minority of evangelical Christians with access to lots of money that pays lobbyists. They don't even try to hide it, and you can read about this from traditional news sources that has covered this for years.
      - ImJamal 2y ago
        > From this behavior, one would think support for Israel was the central pillar of the Christian faith. It is for dispensationalists. Of course, that heresy only popped up a couple hundred years ago and goes against what Christians have always believed, that the Church is the New Israel, not some modern state.
  - sir0010010 2y ago
    This survey also shows ~80% of those polled to have an impression of one of: * neither positive or negative * don't know, or * unfamiliar If you look for surveys that ask about support for Israel directly, you will get significantly different numbers.
  - 7952 2y ago
    Its more complicated isn't it. People can be favourable towards one side in a conflict without fully identifying with their goals. And they can be sympathetic to people without fully supporting the nation or its institutions. My guess is that the global political elite are a small social circle of wealthy powerful people. And that if an action is socially acceptable within that group then it has little cost in the real world. It is not a conspiracy or anything or an evil plot. It is just how people behave.
  - throw310822 2y ago
    In any case, it doesn't matter much. Of course in a democracy if you want something to happen you need to convince a lot of people (maybe not a majority but a lot). It's called propaganda. The fact that there's a lot of people that are enthusiastic about advancing the interests of another country is probably just the effect of some very effective propaganda originating from the actual beneficiaries.
    - fmxsh 2y ago
      Reception of propaganda is contrary to the essence of democracy, relying on a rational citizen able to critically weight different viewpoints and cut trough the worst of bias where propaganda thrives. In a democracy, propaganda works, because of weak democratic implementation. If democracy is an ideal able to be realized, it would protect against that. The burden is on the shoulders of the citizens, culture and state. Without education in the sense of critical thinking, intelligence isn't developed enough to establish democratic structures.
  - nailer 2y ago
    Herzl’s zionism is simply a belief that Jewish people should buy land and live in their ancestral homeland. He wasn’t orthodox, didn’t believe God promised anything to anyone, didn’t speak Hebrew, but after the Dreyfuss affair (usual racist fake accusation BS) started to petition Rothschild (he was denied) and then other wealthier Jewish people with more success to start buying sand dunes and swamplands for Jewish families to return to Israel. Herzl is definitely worth either reading or just studying for HN, the books are short and to the point, they dispel a lot of myths one gets from the media, and starting a country is a fairly ambitious project worth studying for any founder.
    - stormfather 2y ago
      He also said that Jews should only hire other Jews. If I was a politician that advocated Britain is for the British, and that whites should only hire other whites so that minorities have to leave due to economic pressure, how would you view me? Or is this wrong?
      - nailer 2y ago
        My own personal beliefs aren’t really relevant to the topic. To answer the question anyway: Jewish and British and French and Arabs and Ghanaians and Balinese may want to hire their own, but there’s a certain point where the rubber hits the road and you may find someone outside the group with the skills or contacts you need.
        stormfather 2y ago
        My point is that you're presenting Herzl as if all he wanted was to legally purchase land for a Jewish state. But you left out that he advocated systemic racial discrimination to coerce another group to leave. I'm trying to ask if this would color your previously neutral and benign characterization of him.
        nailer 2y ago
        > he advocated systemic racial discrimination to coerce another group to leave When? You haven't made that point, only discussed that Herzl said Jewish people should hire other Jewish people, which is common among all groups of people, fairly benign and was almost universal in the past.
- p3rls 2y ago
  Don't care about the war but there some weird tribal dynamics going on in this conflict that I find fascinating This forum being basically being the h1b aspirant phpbb I'd expect more pro-israel sentiment from our indian cohorts like on other platforms-- but they overwhelmingly seem to be pro-palestinian here. I suppose the typical rss hindutva pro-israel accounts we see allover the rest of the internet might be lower class indians while ycombinator selects for more california-aligned values and gets more international ones with the precooked contemporary neoliberal value-set?
  - afroboy 2y ago
    Not a war but genocide, it will be war when gazan people get billions of dollars in bombs.
keygen_music 2y ago
[flagged]
2Gkashmiri 2y ago
Fake news /s
new_user_final 2y ago
Once all the people of Gaza are dead, what those soldiers are going to do? They are built as soulless killing machine. They will start killing their allies.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
Qem 2y ago
"Appears to contradict" is a euphemism. The footage clearly shows the IDF initial account was a complete lie.
- jsheard 2y ago
  It didn't happen. And if it did, it wasn't that bad. And if it was, that's not a big deal. And if it is, that's not my fault. And if it was, I didn't mean it. And if I did, you deserved it.
  - AtlasBarfed 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - ever1337 2y ago
      The users you replied to are pointing out a simple fact that the Israeli govt lied, it is only you who is moralizing about anything.
      - Sabinus 2y ago
        The Israeli government may have been lied to by a radicalised IDF commander. I assume it's at least a squad required to do what's in the video.
    - netsharc 2y ago
      Bull Burr said it best about human shields: https://www.youtube.com/v/t-mMt3c3ngQ https://www.youtube.com/v/t-mMt3c3ngQ If we want to collectively punish people who voted for (or whose election resulted in the rule of) a bunch of fucking morons, well... I have some bad news for US citizens...
      - gruez 2y ago
        >If we want to collectively punish people who voted for (or whose election resulted in the rule of) a bunch of fucking morons, well... I have some bad news for US citizens... I've seen comments unironically arguing for collective punishments when it came to the US, and they're at least popular enough that they don't show up as gray/[flagged].
an0malous 2y ago
This will get flagged off the front page in a couple hours
- r721 2y ago
  It was flagged already at one point and got vouched back.
- smugma 2y ago
  Question is, why? Yes, but why? Is this a cabal of Jews trying to hide the truth? (no, it is not). Or is it that the atrocity isn’t highly relevant to discuss on a hacker news thread, and also hard to have people follow HN Guidelines? (Much more likely explanation)
  - za3faran 2y ago
    Israel absolutely employs individuals and idf members online to push their agendas and attempt to push back against the negative media being reported against them. Even western news sources reported on it.
  - an0malous 2y ago
    > Or is it that the atrocity isn’t highly relevant to discuss on a hacker news thread, and also hard to have people follow HN Guidelines? (Much more likely explanation) The guidelines themselves say posts should be "anything that gratifies one's intellectual curiosity." No I don't think it's a cabal of Jews, but I've seen posts get flagged for being critical of YC or OpenAI, and just a few days ago PG's essay got flagged seemingly just for vague references to the current political climate. There are clearly people using the flagging system to take down posts they don't like and it's always justified with "the post was off topic" even though there are no objective rules for what is on topic.
testing22321 2y ago
We have video footage of Israeli soldiers pulling the pin and tossing live grenades over the West Bank wall. [1] There is no “appears” about it. [1] https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KCw6Lff5XcU https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KCw6Lff5XcU
- tguvot 2y ago
  tear gas grenades for dispersing crowd
- volleyball 2y ago
  We have video footage of Israeli soldiers sniping a 12-year old boy setting off fireworks near the west-bank wall. To those asking "How do we know if it was IDF that shot the boy" there is video footage of Israeli security minister congratulating and praisingthe shooter. [1] We have video footage of IDF raping prisoners[2] and we have footage of one of the rapists being treated like a celebrity and getting standing ovations on Israeli national tv [3][4]. If i had to list all the video footage just from the last 18 months alone, i would be here all day and it would likely ruin your day. If anyone has still not woken up to the reality of what Israel is, its not for lack of video footage. [1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBkNDNj05XA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBkNDNj05XA [2] https://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2024/aug/08/israeli-media-alleged-sexual-abuse-palestinian-detainee-video https://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2024/aug/08/israeli-... [3]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UNWxLz6_ME https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UNWxLz6_ME [4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UNWxLz6_ME https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UNWxLz6_ME
engels_gibs 2y ago
The real news is how anyone would believe that Israel says the truth about anything at all. The real news is how the BBC, Guardian, NYP and all mainstream media repeats and amplifies israeli discourse taking it at face value as objective truth
- nailer 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - netsharc 2y ago
    Gotta love character assassination by screenshot, but I guess that's "cancel culture" for you. A quick google doesn't support your assertion that he made those comments on "their" (BBC's) social media. And for me "a journalist they've worked with" doesn't equal "one of their correspondents". But oh well, it's the age of emotions overriding our judgements, the question is, who's doing more of that between the 2 of us. And your "general thread" is inaccessible since it requires making an account on a Nazi website...
    - nailer 2y ago
      > character assassination by screenshot You mean 'judging people by their own published thoughts'. > A quick google doesn't support your assertion that he made those comments on "their" (BBC's) social media. That wasn't the allegation in the comment you are responding to. Rather the allegation was that someone the BBC hired hates Jewish people, as shown on the person's social media. > making an account on a Nazi website... I thought really hard about engaging with you after you discussed this conspiracy theory but thought I may as well correct your post in case anyone didn't see what you were doing. This will be my last post in the thread. Seek help.
- smugma 2y ago
  BBC, Guardian, and NYT have all reported on this footage.
  - 2y ago
khaledh 2y ago
This is just one of an endless string of lies from Israel. Hind Rajab? World Central Kitchen? and many others that we don't know about. They even shot their own hostages waving white flags. Their first reaction is to lie, and if they get caught they say they will investigate. How can anyone believe them anymore, and how can anyone expect their investigation to lead to full accountability and prevention of future incidents? It just baffles me.
- za3faran 2y ago
  Let's not forget the 40 beheaded babies hoax and the mass rape hoax.
  - sir0010010 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - za3faran 2y ago
      Where is the material? "reasonable grounds" is not evidence. I'll just leave this here from the same report[1][2][3] But the world did see how Palestinian prisoners were raped in prisons. [1] https://imgur.com/a/TmKGadc https://imgur.com/a/TmKGadc [2] https://imgur.com/a/C6bsMp7 https://imgur.com/a/C6bsMp7 [3] https://imgur.com/a/ADsmgWy https://imgur.com/a/ADsmgWy
      - sir0010010 2y ago
        Note the words "corroborated by [...] digital material" (emphasis added).
        za3faran 2y ago
        Given the consistent lies we are seeing by them, this cannot be accepted as is. I posted material from the same report you are citing.
        2y ago
aaron695 2y ago
[dead]
Workaccount2 2y ago
How do you rectify the simultaneous feelings that arise from knowing that Israel is shooting innocent civilians and knowing that Hamas uses ambulances to carry out missions? Am I the only one aware of this? Everyone else seems to be blind in one eye...
- wredcoll 2y ago
  Dunno, which side has more power?
  - claytongulick 2y ago
    I'm confused. Are you making an argument that relative lack of power justifies immoral actions? I.e. "My family is starving, I have less money than others, so it's ok for me to steal bread" (hat tip to Jean Valjean). Just curious about your perspective.
    - jpc0 2y ago
      Unrelated to the above discussion but, not justfies it, it's still wrong. But a poor hungry person is a lot more likely to commit a crime of opportunity that feeds them and their family than a well of, well fed person. Maybe you are actually agreeing with me. My view, as a neutral observer to the Hamas / IDF debate is they are both wrong and you would ( inclusive you not you specifically ) would probably do the same... Cough Afghanistan etc...
      - nailer 2y ago
        Gaza has an incredibly high obesity rate, over 4K calories a day per capita, and it’s Hamas that stockpiles food not Israel.
    - wredcoll 2y ago
      I'm actually making the argument that people should be held more accountable for solving problems the more power they have. It's easy to say "both sides" committed immoral actions, but that doesn't really get us anywhere useful, other than perhaps some moral superiority. If we want to actually solve problems, i.e. prevent those bad things from happening in the future, the practical suggestion is to start with those people who have the most power to effect change.
givemeethekeys 2y ago
I often wonder why people have such high expectations from anyone during a fight to the death. In all other times, one aide would have completely erased the other side. Yet, here we are, the Palestinians have yet to surrender. None of the Arab countries that fooled the Palestinians into believing that they will one day be liberated want them.
- shihab 2y ago
  In no modern times did one side complete erase the other side. Hell, even 2000 years ago many regular romans were disgusted by the brutality of roman soldiers against Carthage. Israeli violence is unprecedented in several objective metrics: in pounds of bumbs dropped, percentage of civilians death, percentage of civilian household destroyed (on par with Dresden now).
  - nailer 2y ago
    Odd, all the sources I’ve read have the lowest civilian to combatant death ratio of any modern conflict.
    - marxplank 2y ago
      on the Israeli side I’m guessing
      - nailer 2y ago
        It’s genuinely hard to get non-Hamas numbers, if you do take the Hamas numbers, they constantly shift wildly in both directions.
        nailer 2y ago
        An example: https://www.euronews.com/2025/04/03/hamas-run-health-ministry-quietly-removes-thousands-from-gaza-death-toll-researchers-find https://www.euronews.com/2025/04/03/hamas-run-health-ministr...
omer9 2y ago
This is called "Hasbara". Israeli for "Lie like the devil, boldly and always." They've have used it constantly. Lately they have increased their budget so that influencer spread they lies.
zoklet-enjoyer 2y ago
Israel is a terrorist state and should be treated as one.
volleyball 2y ago
Just to summarize and being conservative with interpretation of events : - On 23 March, IDF ambushes a convoy of 5 ambulances, a fire truck and a UN vehicle responding to a distress call. - 15 paramedics and aid workers are massacred. There is 1 survivor. - Israel buries the bodies in shallow graves along with ambulances and the the fire truck and bulldoze over the site. This is picked up by satellite imagery. - Israel blocks access to the area and refuses to cooperate with agencies trying to find & recover the bodies. - The IDF and Israeli foreign minister claims that the vehicles were "advancing suspiciously toward IDF troops without headlights or emergency signals" and it eliminated "a hamas military terrorist ... who took part in the October 7 attack" and "eight other terrorists" from Hamas and PIJ . - Lone survivor gives own account contradicting Israeli's version of events. - The mass grave and bodies are uncovered on 30th March. A smartphone with the relevant footage is found among the remains. - Smartphone footage recovered repudiates all of Israel claims and corroborates the survivor's account. That the emergency vehicles had their emergency lights and headlights on, many of the workers were wearing high-viz jackets. No weapons, or terrorists or IDF in sight. - None of the names of the victims match the names of the "terrorists" given by Israel. The "hamas October 7 terrorist" is also not among the bodies. - Israel "admits" it "made a mistake" and is "investigating". Looking at the headlines and articles, I have to say that the BBC and the western media outlets did a better job burying the lede than Israel did, burying the bodies.
y_just_urgent 2y ago
[flagged]

188 points by r721 2y ago

As long as a substantial number of christians consider Israel a divine-ordained country, there will not be any repercussions for any crime they commit. The Bible contains literal instructions for genocide, and many Christians bemoan anci nt Israel for not following those instructions to the letter.

actionfromafar 2y ago
We’re way off repercussions territory. Trump just cut the leash and let the foxes run wild.
like_any_other 2y ago
Only 8% of Americans have a positive impression of Zionism [1]. Whatever is driving US support for Israel, it's not the will of the people. [1] Figure 2, "What is your impression of Zionism?", https://www.brookings.edu/articles/how-do-americans-feel-about-zionism-antisemitism-and-israel/ https://www.brookings.edu/articles/how-do-americans-feel-abo...
- watwut 2y ago
  Sure, but conservative Christians do have disproportionate influence on politics ... and they believe these.
  - like_any_other 2y ago
    Suppose that they do - why is this the only area where they have had such astounding success? The closest they've come elsewhere is bans on abortion, where their victories are limited and intermittent, and the occasional transgender bathroom ban. The persecution of Christians abroad [1] doesn't even show up on their radar. From this behavior, one would think support for Israel was the central pillar of the Christian faith. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_post%E2%80%93Cold_War_era https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_t...
    - throwaway01536 2y ago
      > From this behavior, one would think support for Israel was the central pillar of the Christian faith For some, it is their primary goal. They think the end times are near, and by escalating the conflict they hope to make it happen as soon as possible. They support Israel because the Bible says that those that bless Israel is blessed. On the other hand, they think only some Christians will survive the end times, so any non-christians (jews included) that are hurt, doesn't really matter. It's just collateral damage in a holy war. It is one of the reasons why this conflict is so special for many. This is not a conspiracy, but a minority of evangelical Christians with access to lots of money that pays lobbyists. They don't even try to hide it, and you can read about this from traditional news sources that has covered this for years.
    - ImJamal 2y ago
      > From this behavior, one would think support for Israel was the central pillar of the Christian faith. It is for dispensationalists. Of course, that heresy only popped up a couple hundred years ago and goes against what Christians have always believed, that the Church is the New Israel, not some modern state.
- sir0010010 2y ago
  This survey also shows ~80% of those polled to have an impression of one of: * neither positive or negative * don't know, or * unfamiliar If you look for surveys that ask about support for Israel directly, you will get significantly different numbers.
- 7952 2y ago
  Its more complicated isn't it. People can be favourable towards one side in a conflict without fully identifying with their goals. And they can be sympathetic to people without fully supporting the nation or its institutions. My guess is that the global political elite are a small social circle of wealthy powerful people. And that if an action is socially acceptable within that group then it has little cost in the real world. It is not a conspiracy or anything or an evil plot. It is just how people behave.
- throw310822 2y ago
  In any case, it doesn't matter much. Of course in a democracy if you want something to happen you need to convince a lot of people (maybe not a majority but a lot). It's called propaganda. The fact that there's a lot of people that are enthusiastic about advancing the interests of another country is probably just the effect of some very effective propaganda originating from the actual beneficiaries.
  - fmxsh 2y ago
    Reception of propaganda is contrary to the essence of democracy, relying on a rational citizen able to critically weight different viewpoints and cut trough the worst of bias where propaganda thrives. In a democracy, propaganda works, because of weak democratic implementation. If democracy is an ideal able to be realized, it would protect against that. The burden is on the shoulders of the citizens, culture and state. Without education in the sense of critical thinking, intelligence isn't developed enough to establish democratic structures.
- nailer 2y ago
  Herzl’s zionism is simply a belief that Jewish people should buy land and live in their ancestral homeland. He wasn’t orthodox, didn’t believe God promised anything to anyone, didn’t speak Hebrew, but after the Dreyfuss affair (usual racist fake accusation BS) started to petition Rothschild (he was denied) and then other wealthier Jewish people with more success to start buying sand dunes and swamplands for Jewish families to return to Israel. Herzl is definitely worth either reading or just studying for HN, the books are short and to the point, they dispel a lot of myths one gets from the media, and starting a country is a fairly ambitious project worth studying for any founder.
  - stormfather 2y ago
    He also said that Jews should only hire other Jews. If I was a politician that advocated Britain is for the British, and that whites should only hire other whites so that minorities have to leave due to economic pressure, how would you view me? Or is this wrong?
    - nailer 2y ago
      My own personal beliefs aren’t really relevant to the topic. To answer the question anyway: Jewish and British and French and Arabs and Ghanaians and Balinese may want to hire their own, but there’s a certain point where the rubber hits the road and you may find someone outside the group with the skills or contacts you need.
      - stormfather 2y ago
        My point is that you're presenting Herzl as if all he wanted was to legally purchase land for a Jewish state. But you left out that he advocated systemic racial discrimination to coerce another group to leave. I'm trying to ask if this would color your previously neutral and benign characterization of him.
        nailer 2y ago
        > he advocated systemic racial discrimination to coerce another group to leave When? You haven't made that point, only discussed that Herzl said Jewish people should hire other Jewish people, which is common among all groups of people, fairly benign and was almost universal in the past.
p3rls 2y ago
Don't care about the war but there some weird tribal dynamics going on in this conflict that I find fascinating This forum being basically being the h1b aspirant phpbb I'd expect more pro-israel sentiment from our indian cohorts like on other platforms-- but they overwhelmingly seem to be pro-palestinian here. I suppose the typical rss hindutva pro-israel accounts we see allover the rest of the internet might be lower class indians while ycombinator selects for more california-aligned values and gets more international ones with the precooked contemporary neoliberal value-set?
- afroboy 2y ago
  Not a war but genocide, it will be war when gazan people get billions of dollars in bombs.

keygen_music 2y ago

[flagged]

2Gkashmiri 2y ago

Fake news /s

new_user_final 2y ago

Once all the people of Gaza are dead, what those soldiers are going to do? They are built as soulless killing machine. They will start killing their allies.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

Qem 2y ago

"Appears to contradict" is a euphemism. The footage clearly shows the IDF initial account was a complete lie.

jsheard 2y ago
It didn't happen. And if it did, it wasn't that bad. And if it was, that's not a big deal. And if it is, that's not my fault. And if it was, I didn't mean it. And if I did, you deserved it.
- AtlasBarfed 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - ever1337 2y ago
    The users you replied to are pointing out a simple fact that the Israeli govt lied, it is only you who is moralizing about anything.
    - Sabinus 2y ago
      The Israeli government may have been lied to by a radicalised IDF commander. I assume it's at least a squad required to do what's in the video.
  - netsharc 2y ago
    Bull Burr said it best about human shields: https://www.youtube.com/v/t-mMt3c3ngQ https://www.youtube.com/v/t-mMt3c3ngQ If we want to collectively punish people who voted for (or whose election resulted in the rule of) a bunch of fucking morons, well... I have some bad news for US citizens...
    - gruez 2y ago
      >If we want to collectively punish people who voted for (or whose election resulted in the rule of) a bunch of fucking morons, well... I have some bad news for US citizens... I've seen comments unironically arguing for collective punishments when it came to the US, and they're at least popular enough that they don't show up as gray/[flagged].

an0malous 2y ago

This will get flagged off the front page in a couple hours

r721 2y ago
It was flagged already at one point and got vouched back.
smugma 2y ago
Question is, why? Yes, but why? Is this a cabal of Jews trying to hide the truth? (no, it is not). Or is it that the atrocity isn’t highly relevant to discuss on a hacker news thread, and also hard to have people follow HN Guidelines? (Much more likely explanation)
- za3faran 2y ago
  Israel absolutely employs individuals and idf members online to push their agendas and attempt to push back against the negative media being reported against them. Even western news sources reported on it.
- an0malous 2y ago
  > Or is it that the atrocity isn’t highly relevant to discuss on a hacker news thread, and also hard to have people follow HN Guidelines? (Much more likely explanation) The guidelines themselves say posts should be "anything that gratifies one's intellectual curiosity." No I don't think it's a cabal of Jews, but I've seen posts get flagged for being critical of YC or OpenAI, and just a few days ago PG's essay got flagged seemingly just for vague references to the current political climate. There are clearly people using the flagging system to take down posts they don't like and it's always justified with "the post was off topic" even though there are no objective rules for what is on topic.

testing22321 2y ago

We have video footage of Israeli soldiers pulling the pin and tossing live grenades over the West Bank wall. [1] There is no “appears” about it. [1] https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KCw6Lff5XcU https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KCw6Lff5XcU

tguvot 2y ago
tear gas grenades for dispersing crowd
volleyball 2y ago
We have video footage of Israeli soldiers sniping a 12-year old boy setting off fireworks near the west-bank wall. To those asking "How do we know if it was IDF that shot the boy" there is video footage of Israeli security minister congratulating and praisingthe shooter. [1] We have video footage of IDF raping prisoners[2] and we have footage of one of the rapists being treated like a celebrity and getting standing ovations on Israeli national tv [3][4]. If i had to list all the video footage just from the last 18 months alone, i would be here all day and it would likely ruin your day. If anyone has still not woken up to the reality of what Israel is, its not for lack of video footage. [1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBkNDNj05XA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBkNDNj05XA [2] https://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2024/aug/08/israeli-media-alleged-sexual-abuse-palestinian-detainee-video https://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2024/aug/08/israeli-... [3]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UNWxLz6_ME https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UNWxLz6_ME [4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UNWxLz6_ME https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UNWxLz6_ME

engels_gibs 2y ago

The real news is how anyone would believe that Israel says the truth about anything at all. The real news is how the BBC, Guardian, NYP and all mainstream media repeats and amplifies israeli discourse taking it at face value as objective truth

nailer 2y ago
[flagged]
- netsharc 2y ago
  Gotta love character assassination by screenshot, but I guess that's "cancel culture" for you. A quick google doesn't support your assertion that he made those comments on "their" (BBC's) social media. And for me "a journalist they've worked with" doesn't equal "one of their correspondents". But oh well, it's the age of emotions overriding our judgements, the question is, who's doing more of that between the 2 of us. And your "general thread" is inaccessible since it requires making an account on a Nazi website...
  - nailer 2y ago
    > character assassination by screenshot You mean 'judging people by their own published thoughts'. > A quick google doesn't support your assertion that he made those comments on "their" (BBC's) social media. That wasn't the allegation in the comment you are responding to. Rather the allegation was that someone the BBC hired hates Jewish people, as shown on the person's social media. > making an account on a Nazi website... I thought really hard about engaging with you after you discussed this conspiracy theory but thought I may as well correct your post in case anyone didn't see what you were doing. This will be my last post in the thread. Seek help.
smugma 2y ago
BBC, Guardian, and NYT have all reported on this footage.
- 2y ago

khaledh 2y ago

This is just one of an endless string of lies from Israel. Hind Rajab? World Central Kitchen? and many others that we don't know about. They even shot their own hostages waving white flags. Their first reaction is to lie, and if they get caught they say they will investigate. How can anyone believe them anymore, and how can anyone expect their investigation to lead to full accountability and prevention of future incidents? It just baffles me.

za3faran 2y ago
Let's not forget the 40 beheaded babies hoax and the mass rape hoax.
- sir0010010 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - za3faran 2y ago
    Where is the material? "reasonable grounds" is not evidence. I'll just leave this here from the same report[1][2][3] But the world did see how Palestinian prisoners were raped in prisons. [1] https://imgur.com/a/TmKGadc https://imgur.com/a/TmKGadc [2] https://imgur.com/a/C6bsMp7 https://imgur.com/a/C6bsMp7 [3] https://imgur.com/a/ADsmgWy https://imgur.com/a/ADsmgWy
    - sir0010010 2y ago
      Note the words "corroborated by [...] digital material" (emphasis added).
      - za3faran 2y ago
        Given the consistent lies we are seeing by them, this cannot be accepted as is. I posted material from the same report you are citing.
      - 2y ago

aaron695 2y ago

[dead]

Workaccount2 2y ago

How do you rectify the simultaneous feelings that arise from knowing that Israel is shooting innocent civilians and knowing that Hamas uses ambulances to carry out missions? Am I the only one aware of this? Everyone else seems to be blind in one eye...

wredcoll 2y ago
Dunno, which side has more power?
- claytongulick 2y ago
  I'm confused. Are you making an argument that relative lack of power justifies immoral actions? I.e. "My family is starving, I have less money than others, so it's ok for me to steal bread" (hat tip to Jean Valjean). Just curious about your perspective.
  - jpc0 2y ago
    Unrelated to the above discussion but, not justfies it, it's still wrong. But a poor hungry person is a lot more likely to commit a crime of opportunity that feeds them and their family than a well of, well fed person. Maybe you are actually agreeing with me. My view, as a neutral observer to the Hamas / IDF debate is they are both wrong and you would ( inclusive you not you specifically ) would probably do the same... Cough Afghanistan etc...
    - nailer 2y ago
      Gaza has an incredibly high obesity rate, over 4K calories a day per capita, and it’s Hamas that stockpiles food not Israel.
  - wredcoll 2y ago
    I'm actually making the argument that people should be held more accountable for solving problems the more power they have. It's easy to say "both sides" committed immoral actions, but that doesn't really get us anywhere useful, other than perhaps some moral superiority. If we want to actually solve problems, i.e. prevent those bad things from happening in the future, the practical suggestion is to start with those people who have the most power to effect change.

givemeethekeys 2y ago

I often wonder why people have such high expectations from anyone during a fight to the death. In all other times, one aide would have completely erased the other side. Yet, here we are, the Palestinians have yet to surrender. None of the Arab countries that fooled the Palestinians into believing that they will one day be liberated want them.

shihab 2y ago
In no modern times did one side complete erase the other side. Hell, even 2000 years ago many regular romans were disgusted by the brutality of roman soldiers against Carthage. Israeli violence is unprecedented in several objective metrics: in pounds of bumbs dropped, percentage of civilians death, percentage of civilian household destroyed (on par with Dresden now).
- nailer 2y ago
  Odd, all the sources I’ve read have the lowest civilian to combatant death ratio of any modern conflict.
  - marxplank 2y ago
    on the Israeli side I’m guessing
    - nailer 2y ago
      It’s genuinely hard to get non-Hamas numbers, if you do take the Hamas numbers, they constantly shift wildly in both directions.
      - nailer 2y ago
        An example: https://www.euronews.com/2025/04/03/hamas-run-health-ministry-quietly-removes-thousands-from-gaza-death-toll-researchers-find https://www.euronews.com/2025/04/03/hamas-run-health-ministr...

omer9 2y ago

This is called "Hasbara". Israeli for "Lie like the devil, boldly and always." They've have used it constantly. Lately they have increased their budget so that influencer spread they lies.

zoklet-enjoyer 2y ago

Israel is a terrorist state and should be treated as one.

volleyball 2y ago

Just to summarize and being conservative with interpretation of events : - On 23 March, IDF ambushes a convoy of 5 ambulances, a fire truck and a UN vehicle responding to a distress call. - 15 paramedics and aid workers are massacred. There is 1 survivor. - Israel buries the bodies in shallow graves along with ambulances and the the fire truck and bulldoze over the site. This is picked up by satellite imagery. - Israel blocks access to the area and refuses to cooperate with agencies trying to find & recover the bodies. - The IDF and Israeli foreign minister claims that the vehicles were "advancing suspiciously toward IDF troops without headlights or emergency signals" and it eliminated "a hamas military terrorist ... who took part in the October 7 attack" and "eight other terrorists" from Hamas and PIJ . - Lone survivor gives own account contradicting Israeli's version of events. - The mass grave and bodies are uncovered on 30th March. A smartphone with the relevant footage is found among the remains. - Smartphone footage recovered repudiates all of Israel claims and corroborates the survivor's account. That the emergency vehicles had their emergency lights and headlights on, many of the workers were wearing high-viz jackets. No weapons, or terrorists or IDF in sight. - None of the names of the victims match the names of the "terrorists" given by Israel. The "hamas October 7 terrorist" is also not among the bodies. - Israel "admits" it "made a mistake" and is "investigating". Looking at the headlines and articles, I have to say that the BBC and the western media outlets did a better job burying the lede than Israel did, burying the bodies.

y_just_urgent 2y ago

[flagged]