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> I'm not sure this is fixable? Not from Apple's end. Apple mandates that all requests for permissions go through a single, OS-provided dialog. If a user acce

> I'm not sure this is fixable? Not from Apple's end. Apple mandates that all requests for permissions go through a single, OS-provided dialog. If a user accepts, the permission is granted; if the user rejects, the permission is not granted, and the app can't ask again. Simple enough. App developers try to maximize their chances of getting that permission granted by adding another warm-up dialog before actually doing the official permissions request. Since those other dialogs aren't part of Apple's permissions request chain, they can be rejected by the user without consequence, and the app can present them as often as it wants. There is nothing which requires third-party developers to use these additional dialogs. It's a design pattern (and an annoying one at that) which many developers have gravitated towards. Not all developers use it; in particular, Apple doesn't use it for their first-party apps. And apparently FCA is faulting Apple for not following that pattern themselves.

refulgentis 2y ago
> There is nothing which requires third-party developers to use these additional dialogs. Well, yes there is: I don't have carte blanche to do whatever I want with your data because you tapped an Apple dialog: I have to obtain your consent first.
- benmanns 2y ago
  This is interesting to me—are you an app developer that does this pattern for that reason? I definitely figured it was exclusively because they can request repeatedly for the fake prompt, and only “use” their prompt when the user is inclined to accept. There are times where I’ll accept the first prompt and reject the second prompt when apps are spammy about it.
- kemayo 2y ago
  I don't see why that matters? Your app triggered the Apple dialog to be shown, asking a question about what your app is allowed to do, and you can see what the answer the user gave is. Why wouldn't that be enough?
cosmic_cheese 2y ago
That, “we need to maintain the ability to pester the user again” pattern is really annoying. Apple should add a screen at initial setup that allows the user to default every permission that it’s possible to use that pattern with to “no” and skip the one time dialog just to screw with apps that do it.
abdullahkhalids 2y ago
It's part of acceptable use by Apple [1], with guidelines how to show the first popup. [1] https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guidelines/privacy#Pre-alert-screens-windows-or-views https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guideline...
- duskwuff 2y ago
  It's considered acceptable within bounds (i.e. no tricking the user into tapping "accept"), but not required. At least, not by Apple.
- frumper 2y ago
  The link you posted is about not giving the user a choice. It's an optional pre alert screen that only leads to the system request. Apps are choosing to allow users to say no/cancel on that screen that then lets them ask again and again without wasting their one chance with the system prompt pop up.

refulgentis 2y ago

> There is nothing which requires third-party developers to use these additional dialogs. Well, yes there is: I don't have carte blanche to do whatever I want with your data because you tapped an Apple dialog: I have to obtain your consent first.

benmanns 2y ago
This is interesting to me—are you an app developer that does this pattern for that reason? I definitely figured it was exclusively because they can request repeatedly for the fake prompt, and only “use” their prompt when the user is inclined to accept. There are times where I’ll accept the first prompt and reject the second prompt when apps are spammy about it.
kemayo 2y ago
I don't see why that matters? Your app triggered the Apple dialog to be shown, asking a question about what your app is allowed to do, and you can see what the answer the user gave is. Why wouldn't that be enough?

cosmic_cheese 2y ago

That, “we need to maintain the ability to pester the user again” pattern is really annoying. Apple should add a screen at initial setup that allows the user to default every permission that it’s possible to use that pattern with to “no” and skip the one time dialog just to screw with apps that do it.

abdullahkhalids 2y ago

It's part of acceptable use by Apple [1], with guidelines how to show the first popup. [1] https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guidelines/privacy#Pre-alert-screens-windows-or-views https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guideline...

duskwuff 2y ago
It's considered acceptable within bounds (i.e. no tricking the user into tapping "accept"), but not required. At least, not by Apple.
frumper 2y ago
The link you posted is about not giving the user a choice. It's an optional pre alert screen that only leads to the system request. Apps are choosing to allow users to say no/cancel on that screen that then lets them ask again and again without wasting their one chance with the system prompt pop up.