5 ms·

So the main advantage is that LLMs can type faster than you?

by turtletontine 2y ago

simonw 2y ago
Yes, exactly.
- dttze 2y ago
  Burning down the rainforests so I don’t have to wait for my fingers.
  - Dylan16807 2y ago
    If you do a basic query to GPT-4o every ten seconds it uses a blistering... hundred watts or so. More for long inputs, less when you're not using it that rapidly.
  - simonw 2y ago
    The environmental impact of running prompts through (most) of these models is massively over-stated. (I say "most" because GPT-4.5 is 1000x the price of GPT-4o-mini, which implies to me that it burns a whole lot more energy.)
- bluefirebrand 2y ago
  This is honestly really unimpressive Typing speed is not usually the constraint for programming, for a programmer that knows what they are doing Creating the solution is the hard work, typing it out is just a small portion of it
  - simonw 2y ago
    I know. That's why I've consistently said that LLMs give me a 2-5x productivity boost on the portion of my job which involves typing code into a computer... which is only about 10% of what I do. (One recent example: https://simonwillison.net/2024/Sep/10/software-misadventures/#letting-skills-atrophy https://simonwillison.net/2024/Sep/10/software-misadventures... ) (I get boosts from LLMs to a bunch of activities too, like researching and planning, but those are less obvious than the coding acceleration.)
    - bluefirebrand 2y ago
      > That's why I've consistently said that LLMs give me a 2-5x productivity boost on the portion of my job which involves typing code into a computer... which is only about 10% of what I do This explains it then. You aren't a software developer You get a productivity boost from LLMs when writing code because it's not something you actually do very much That makes sense I write code for probably between 50-80% of any given week, which is pretty typical for any software dev I've ever worked with at any company I've ever worked at So we're not really the same. It's no wonder LLMs help you, you code so little that you're constantly rusty
      - simonw 2y ago
        I'm a software developer: https://github.com/simonw https://github.com/simonw I very much doubt you spend 80% of your working time actively typing code into a computer. My other activities include: - Researching code. This is a LOT of my time - reading my own code, reading other code, reading through documentation, searching for useful libraries to use, evaluating if those libraries are any good. - Exploratory coding in things like Jupyter notebooks, Firefox developer tools etc. I guess you could call this "coding time", but I don't consider it part of that 10% I mentioned earlier. - Talking to people about the code I'm about to write (or the code I've just written). - Filing issues, or updating issues with comments. - Writing documentation for my code. - Straight up thinking about code. I do a lot of that while walking the dog. - Staying up-to-date on what's new in my industry. - Arguing with people about whether or not LLMs are useful on Hacker News.
      - Dylan16807 2y ago
        "typing code is a small portion of programming" "I agree, only 10% of what I do is typing code" "that explains it, you aren't a software developer" What the hell?
      - danso 2y ago
        You should check out Simon’s wikipedia and github pages, when you have time between your coding sprints.

So the main advantage is that LLMs can type faster than you?

simonw 2y ago

Yes, exactly.

dttze 2y ago
Burning down the rainforests so I don’t have to wait for my fingers.
- Dylan16807 2y ago
  If you do a basic query to GPT-4o every ten seconds it uses a blistering... hundred watts or so. More for long inputs, less when you're not using it that rapidly.
- simonw 2y ago
  The environmental impact of running prompts through (most) of these models is massively over-stated. (I say "most" because GPT-4.5 is 1000x the price of GPT-4o-mini, which implies to me that it burns a whole lot more energy.)
bluefirebrand 2y ago
This is honestly really unimpressive Typing speed is not usually the constraint for programming, for a programmer that knows what they are doing Creating the solution is the hard work, typing it out is just a small portion of it
- simonw 2y ago
  I know. That's why I've consistently said that LLMs give me a 2-5x productivity boost on the portion of my job which involves typing code into a computer... which is only about 10% of what I do. (One recent example: https://simonwillison.net/2024/Sep/10/software-misadventures/#letting-skills-atrophy https://simonwillison.net/2024/Sep/10/software-misadventures... ) (I get boosts from LLMs to a bunch of activities too, like researching and planning, but those are less obvious than the coding acceleration.)
  - bluefirebrand 2y ago
    > That's why I've consistently said that LLMs give me a 2-5x productivity boost on the portion of my job which involves typing code into a computer... which is only about 10% of what I do This explains it then. You aren't a software developer You get a productivity boost from LLMs when writing code because it's not something you actually do very much That makes sense I write code for probably between 50-80% of any given week, which is pretty typical for any software dev I've ever worked with at any company I've ever worked at So we're not really the same. It's no wonder LLMs help you, you code so little that you're constantly rusty
    - simonw 2y ago
      I'm a software developer: https://github.com/simonw https://github.com/simonw I very much doubt you spend 80% of your working time actively typing code into a computer. My other activities include: - Researching code. This is a LOT of my time - reading my own code, reading other code, reading through documentation, searching for useful libraries to use, evaluating if those libraries are any good. - Exploratory coding in things like Jupyter notebooks, Firefox developer tools etc. I guess you could call this "coding time", but I don't consider it part of that 10% I mentioned earlier. - Talking to people about the code I'm about to write (or the code I've just written). - Filing issues, or updating issues with comments. - Writing documentation for my code. - Straight up thinking about code. I do a lot of that while walking the dog. - Staying up-to-date on what's new in my industry. - Arguing with people about whether or not LLMs are useful on Hacker News.
    - Dylan16807 2y ago
      "typing code is a small portion of programming" "I agree, only 10% of what I do is typing code" "that explains it, you aren't a software developer" What the hell?
    - danso 2y ago
      You should check out Simon’s wikipedia and github pages, when you have time between your coding sprints.