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Can we finish the F-35 before we start another trillion dollar boondoggle? Especially with Boeing.

by ein0p 2y ago

jerlam 2y ago
The F-35 has been operational for years, and has already been in combat. How is it not "finished"?
- sillywalk 2y ago
  Yes it's achieved an Initial Operational Capacity, at least for the earlier versions. However, it hasn't finished Operational Testing, for the newer versions of software/hardware upgrades. "The Office of the Director, Operational Test and Evaluation said in its annual report, submitted to Congress on Jan. 31, that dedicated operational tests for the F-35’s Technology Refresh 3, or TR-3, upgrades will probably start in mid to late fiscal 2026, or around next summer. Those tests are intended to determine whether TR-3 is operationally effective. Lt. Gen. Michael Schmidt, the military’s F-35 program executive officer, said in a statement to Defense News that as of January, Lockheed Martin has delivered more than 100 TR-3 equipped fighters. All of those jets have software allowing its pilots to conduct training flights, including combat training." https://www.defensenews.com/air/2025/02/05/key-tests-for-latest-f-35s-will-begin-in-2026-two-years-after-rollout/ https://www.defensenews.com/air/2025/02/05/key-tests-for-lat...
  - nradov 2y ago
    Well now that's moving the goalposts. Military aircraft are frequently upgraded with new models or blocks throughout the production run. So there will always be new capabilities undergoing testing. The F-35 TR-3 is behind schedule and over budget as usual, but that really has nothing to do with the NGAD / F-47 program.
    - ein0p 2y ago
      Only 30% of F-35 fleet are "mission ready", software suite is full of bugs, and the airframe cracks if you use the cannon, but sure, it's just "moving the goal posts" and has nothing to do with anything. Let's spend another couple trillion on another half-baked heap of bugs, except this time around let's spend it with the company that forgot how to build reliable planes or spacecraft.
      - bdangubic 2y ago
        DOGE hard at work making efficiency and shit… :)
      - nradov 2y ago
        It's not like there's any alternative. We need the capabilities and there are no other comparable aircraft in production, so despite its flaws it's the F-35 or nothing. Meanwhile the F-22 airframes are wearing out, and it's too small to be fully effective in the Indo-Pacific theater, so the F-47 is needed as well. There's plenty of blame to go around for the current deplorable state of readiness but it is what it is. And let's not have any silly claims that those manned fighters could be completely replaced by cheaper drones. Maybe that will be possible someday but for now AI software is nowhere near ready to take on the full mission set.
  - dragonwriter 2y ago
    > Yes it's achieved an Initial Operational Capacity, at least for the earlier versions. However, it hasn't finished Operational Testing, for the newer versions of software/hardware upgrades. Yeah, by that standard, we’ve jumped the gun on the B-21 (and the B-2 and the B-1 and...) because the B-52 isn't “finished”, with B-52J Initial Operational Capacity now expected in 2033.

Can we finish the F-35 before we start another trillion dollar boondoggle? Especially with Boeing.

by ein0p 2y ago

Can we finish the F-35 before we start another trillion dollar boondoggle? Especially with Boeing.

jerlam 2y ago

The F-35 has been operational for years, and has already been in combat. How is it not "finished"?

sillywalk 2y ago
Yes it's achieved an Initial Operational Capacity, at least for the earlier versions. However, it hasn't finished Operational Testing, for the newer versions of software/hardware upgrades. "The Office of the Director, Operational Test and Evaluation said in its annual report, submitted to Congress on Jan. 31, that dedicated operational tests for the F-35’s Technology Refresh 3, or TR-3, upgrades will probably start in mid to late fiscal 2026, or around next summer. Those tests are intended to determine whether TR-3 is operationally effective. Lt. Gen. Michael Schmidt, the military’s F-35 program executive officer, said in a statement to Defense News that as of January, Lockheed Martin has delivered more than 100 TR-3 equipped fighters. All of those jets have software allowing its pilots to conduct training flights, including combat training." https://www.defensenews.com/air/2025/02/05/key-tests-for-latest-f-35s-will-begin-in-2026-two-years-after-rollout/ https://www.defensenews.com/air/2025/02/05/key-tests-for-lat...
- nradov 2y ago
  Well now that's moving the goalposts. Military aircraft are frequently upgraded with new models or blocks throughout the production run. So there will always be new capabilities undergoing testing. The F-35 TR-3 is behind schedule and over budget as usual, but that really has nothing to do with the NGAD / F-47 program.
  - ein0p 2y ago
    Only 30% of F-35 fleet are "mission ready", software suite is full of bugs, and the airframe cracks if you use the cannon, but sure, it's just "moving the goal posts" and has nothing to do with anything. Let's spend another couple trillion on another half-baked heap of bugs, except this time around let's spend it with the company that forgot how to build reliable planes or spacecraft.
    - bdangubic 2y ago
      DOGE hard at work making efficiency and shit… :)
    - nradov 2y ago
      It's not like there's any alternative. We need the capabilities and there are no other comparable aircraft in production, so despite its flaws it's the F-35 or nothing. Meanwhile the F-22 airframes are wearing out, and it's too small to be fully effective in the Indo-Pacific theater, so the F-47 is needed as well. There's plenty of blame to go around for the current deplorable state of readiness but it is what it is. And let's not have any silly claims that those manned fighters could be completely replaced by cheaper drones. Maybe that will be possible someday but for now AI software is nowhere near ready to take on the full mission set.
- dragonwriter 2y ago
  > Yes it's achieved an Initial Operational Capacity, at least for the earlier versions. However, it hasn't finished Operational Testing, for the newer versions of software/hardware upgrades. Yeah, by that standard, we’ve jumped the gun on the B-21 (and the B-2 and the B-1 and...) because the B-52 isn't “finished”, with B-52J Initial Operational Capacity now expected in 2033.