6 ms·

I'm pleased the pricing is so low. I did some math and if they're making 10k of these (not clear if that's each or all together), there's not a ton of money to

I'm pleased the pricing is so low. I did some math and if they're making 10k of these (not clear if that's each or all together), there's not a ton of money to be made. Assuming $100 average profit, that's a $2M for 20k watches. Given the work opportunities that the founder and other employees have, that's not a lot of money for them to make in a year, and it comes with significant risk. Basically seems like this is a passion project, for which I am very grateful!

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
nebulous1 2y ago
$100 profit on a $150 watch would be crazy. Rest of the post seems made up too. I don't know where these numbers are coming from. I'm genuinely confused.
- apparent 2y ago
  I was using a blended average of the $150 and $225 watches. Also, it sounds like some of the components for the $150 watch were literally left over from Pebble days, which means they could have gotten an amazing deal on them.
- IshKebab 2y ago
  Nah that's pretty typical, depending on what you mean by "profit".
  - ac29 2y ago
    Right, that is presumably gross profit per unit, not net. Net profit could easily be zero or negative.
- roboror 2y ago
  Not crazy at all in consumer electronics, that's margin on the parts only. R&D, admin, software, etc. costs need to be recovered from that money.
- beambot 2y ago
  MSRP of 3x COGS is a pretty common rule of thumb for hardware. Have to leave room for distribution, software, R&D, returns, SG&A, etc. End of the day, it's probably still only 30-40% gross margin -- less than half of a good SaaS company. Hardware is (indeed!) hard.
  - cenamus 2y ago
    But then how could you call that 100 profit in any way? If you made at most like 30-50?
    - roboror 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - bigstrat2003 2y ago
        That makes no sense. Profit, by definition, is net. If you still have to pay costs out of some money, then it isn't profit.
        KAMSPioneer 2y ago
        Gross and net profit are each their own concept: https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/101314/what-are-differences-between-gross-profit-and-net-income.asp https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/101314/what-are-dif...
        bigstrat2003 2y ago
        What they call "gross profit" is not profit, by definition. It's certainly useful to track $revenue-$cost_of_goods, but you can't call that profit. People are free to use words incorrectly, but they shouldn't expect anyone else to go along with them.
        ActivePattern 2y ago
diggan 2y ago
> Assuming $100 average profit, that's a $2M for 20k watches. Given the work opportunities that the founder and other employees have, that's not a lot of money for them to make in a year, and it comes with significant risk. Basically Reading through the terms on the shop page, it seems they're preparing to (maybe) raise the prices at any time, and they'll ask you to pay more before shipping, if they end up raising the prices after you buy it.
- apparent 2y ago
  Whoa didn't see this! What's the language you're referring to? I only saw the part about how either side can cancel without penalty and didn't read a threat of higher pricing into that bit.
  - diggan 2y ago
    > If tariffs change dramatically, we will pass these costs along to you and require further payment, even for US orders. Under the "What if the tariff situation changes?" section on https://store.repebble.com/ https://store.repebble.com/ I was excited and about to purchase one until I saw this "We might not ship the device unless you pay us more" thing. I get that the economy is very up in the air right now in the US, but sucks that seemingly ordinary businesses are losing international business because of it.
    - ryukafalz 2y ago
      That reads to me as what they'll do if the import tariff situation changes, not if the company changes the price themselves. Which seems like a reasonable thing to say given the massive uncertainty around US economic policy at the moment.
      - diggan 2y ago
        Fair, and you're probably right. I've personally learned to be very cautious when it comes to statements like that though. There has already been additional tariffs, and since it isn't exactly defined, they could raise the price tomorrow based on that, "because it wasn't taken into account at the time" and so on. Better to just wait until the whole drama blows over I suppose.
noname120 2y ago
I'm highly skeptical that they will sell 20k units at that price point.
- NoahKAndrews 2y ago
  That's a great price point, and there's a lot of pebble fans
- bl4kers 2y ago
  There are 3,500 left (18% remaining)
- pimeys 2y ago
  I know that the diabetic community are extremely interested on these watches. 30 days of battery life, already working support for Android APS and xDrip with these watches. What is there not to like. Put one of these to your child's wrist and they can get alerts on the glucose level easily.
  - hda111 2y ago
    Glucose levels were my first thought as well.
  - drdec 2y ago
    I don't understand how the watches help with glucose levels. The specs mention step, sleep and heart rate tracking. What am I missing? (Vested interest as a diabetic myself.)
    - efdee 2y ago
      Diabetics have a sensor on their bodies that speaks Bluetooth. It talks to their phones (running eg. xDrip). The phone then communicates this to the watch. My wife is a diabetic and this kind of stuff, while it seems minimal, makes a big difference for her quality of life.
      - 2y ago
cm-t 2y ago
Do NOT forget the (optionnal) monthly subscription fees :)
whs 2y ago
I ordered my Pebble Time during February 2015 Kickstarter for $169. Today the Core Time 2 is $225 which is the exact same price adjusted for inflation. The DHL shipping though I remembered it was $25 and it is still $25 today
- Andrex 2y ago
  When you put it like that... goddamn inflation has been awful.
  - GlennFarrant 2y ago
    That "price rise" indicates an inflation rate of 2.9%. The average inflation rate for the last 50 years is more like 3.5%. So it totally depends on your perspective. If you've only lived through low-inflation times, then yeah 2.9% seems high. I'm in my 50's and my reaction to the same information was "yeah, seems about right".

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

nebulous1 2y ago

$100 profit on a $150 watch would be crazy. Rest of the post seems made up too. I don't know where these numbers are coming from. I'm genuinely confused.

apparent 2y ago
I was using a blended average of the $150 and $225 watches. Also, it sounds like some of the components for the $150 watch were literally left over from Pebble days, which means they could have gotten an amazing deal on them.
IshKebab 2y ago
Nah that's pretty typical, depending on what you mean by "profit".
- ac29 2y ago
  Right, that is presumably gross profit per unit, not net. Net profit could easily be zero or negative.
roboror 2y ago
Not crazy at all in consumer electronics, that's margin on the parts only. R&D, admin, software, etc. costs need to be recovered from that money.
beambot 2y ago
MSRP of 3x COGS is a pretty common rule of thumb for hardware. Have to leave room for distribution, software, R&D, returns, SG&A, etc. End of the day, it's probably still only 30-40% gross margin -- less than half of a good SaaS company. Hardware is (indeed!) hard.
- cenamus 2y ago
  But then how could you call that 100 profit in any way? If you made at most like 30-50?
  - roboror 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - bigstrat2003 2y ago
      That makes no sense. Profit, by definition, is net. If you still have to pay costs out of some money, then it isn't profit.
      - KAMSPioneer 2y ago
        Gross and net profit are each their own concept: https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/101314/what-are-differences-between-gross-profit-and-net-income.asp https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/101314/what-are-dif...
        bigstrat2003 2y ago
        What they call "gross profit" is not profit, by definition. It's certainly useful to track $revenue-$cost_of_goods, but you can't call that profit. People are free to use words incorrectly, but they shouldn't expect anyone else to go along with them.
        ActivePattern 2y ago

diggan 2y ago

> Assuming $100 average profit, that's a $2M for 20k watches. Given the work opportunities that the founder and other employees have, that's not a lot of money for them to make in a year, and it comes with significant risk. Basically Reading through the terms on the shop page, it seems they're preparing to (maybe) raise the prices at any time, and they'll ask you to pay more before shipping, if they end up raising the prices after you buy it.

apparent 2y ago
Whoa didn't see this! What's the language you're referring to? I only saw the part about how either side can cancel without penalty and didn't read a threat of higher pricing into that bit.
- diggan 2y ago
  > If tariffs change dramatically, we will pass these costs along to you and require further payment, even for US orders. Under the "What if the tariff situation changes?" section on https://store.repebble.com/ https://store.repebble.com/ I was excited and about to purchase one until I saw this "We might not ship the device unless you pay us more" thing. I get that the economy is very up in the air right now in the US, but sucks that seemingly ordinary businesses are losing international business because of it.
  - ryukafalz 2y ago
    That reads to me as what they'll do if the import tariff situation changes, not if the company changes the price themselves. Which seems like a reasonable thing to say given the massive uncertainty around US economic policy at the moment.
    - diggan 2y ago
      Fair, and you're probably right. I've personally learned to be very cautious when it comes to statements like that though. There has already been additional tariffs, and since it isn't exactly defined, they could raise the price tomorrow based on that, "because it wasn't taken into account at the time" and so on. Better to just wait until the whole drama blows over I suppose.

noname120 2y ago

I'm highly skeptical that they will sell 20k units at that price point.

NoahKAndrews 2y ago
That's a great price point, and there's a lot of pebble fans
bl4kers 2y ago
There are 3,500 left (18% remaining)
pimeys 2y ago
I know that the diabetic community are extremely interested on these watches. 30 days of battery life, already working support for Android APS and xDrip with these watches. What is there not to like. Put one of these to your child's wrist and they can get alerts on the glucose level easily.
- hda111 2y ago
  Glucose levels were my first thought as well.
- drdec 2y ago
  I don't understand how the watches help with glucose levels. The specs mention step, sleep and heart rate tracking. What am I missing? (Vested interest as a diabetic myself.)
  - efdee 2y ago
    Diabetics have a sensor on their bodies that speaks Bluetooth. It talks to their phones (running eg. xDrip). The phone then communicates this to the watch. My wife is a diabetic and this kind of stuff, while it seems minimal, makes a big difference for her quality of life.
    - 2y ago

cm-t 2y ago

Do NOT forget the (optionnal) monthly subscription fees :)

whs 2y ago

I ordered my Pebble Time during February 2015 Kickstarter for $169. Today the Core Time 2 is $225 which is the exact same price adjusted for inflation. The DHL shipping though I remembered it was $25 and it is still $25 today

Andrex 2y ago
When you put it like that... goddamn inflation has been awful.
- GlennFarrant 2y ago
  That "price rise" indicates an inflation rate of 2.9%. The average inflation rate for the last 50 years is more like 3.5%. So it totally depends on your perspective. If you've only lived through low-inflation times, then yeah 2.9% seems high. I'm in my 50's and my reaction to the same information was "yeah, seems about right".