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The problem is that I don't think this distinction actually exists outside the Bureau of Labor Statistics. The obvious hypothesis to me, which the source articl

The problem is that I don't think this distinction actually exists outside the Bureau of Labor Statistics. The obvious hypothesis to me, which the source article doesn't seem to consider, is that this statistic isn't measuring anything other than a change in fashionable job titles.

trescenzi 2y ago
I’ve been asked multiple times in interviews what I think the difference between a dev/engineer and a programmer is. As a hiring manager I’ve also had people ask me the question as a way to get at role expectations. These were all at smaller companies though and on the East Coast so it might be a small vs big company thing? But it’s definitively not just a BLS understanding of job roles. I do agree with your hypothesis though. The article doesn’t even account for the software engineer title either.
williamdclt 2y ago
This is literally the first time that I hear someone making any difference between “programmer” and “developer”. Hell I don’t even think I’ve ever heard a difference with “software engineer”, apart from countries where engineer is a protected title
- kohbo 2y ago
  If you don't work in the government sector than that makes sense
  - frumper 2y ago
    I work in government and my position has been reclassified from computer programmer to software developer and software engineer over the past 20 years. Same workload and skillset. We're even supporting some of that same software written 20 years ago.
redeux 2y ago
If we assume programmer and software developer are the same job and there's been a 22% drop in programmers without a corresponding increase in devs, then it still seems like a net job loss?
- xemoka 2y ago
  Absolutely, and this is the story. Not what they seem to have wrote about...
- SpicyLemonZest 2y ago
  A net job loss, but a much smaller one. The source article includes a graph of "Employment in the computer and data-processing services industry", showing a perceptible but quite small dip which could be correlated with either widespread GenAI or the 2022 bear market.

trescenzi 2y ago

I’ve been asked multiple times in interviews what I think the difference between a dev/engineer and a programmer is. As a hiring manager I’ve also had people ask me the question as a way to get at role expectations. These were all at smaller companies though and on the East Coast so it might be a small vs big company thing? But it’s definitively not just a BLS understanding of job roles. I do agree with your hypothesis though. The article doesn’t even account for the software engineer title either.

williamdclt 2y ago

This is literally the first time that I hear someone making any difference between “programmer” and “developer”. Hell I don’t even think I’ve ever heard a difference with “software engineer”, apart from countries where engineer is a protected title

kohbo 2y ago
If you don't work in the government sector than that makes sense
- frumper 2y ago
  I work in government and my position has been reclassified from computer programmer to software developer and software engineer over the past 20 years. Same workload and skillset. We're even supporting some of that same software written 20 years ago.

redeux 2y ago

If we assume programmer and software developer are the same job and there's been a 22% drop in programmers without a corresponding increase in devs, then it still seems like a net job loss?

xemoka 2y ago
Absolutely, and this is the story. Not what they seem to have wrote about...
SpicyLemonZest 2y ago
A net job loss, but a much smaller one. The source article includes a graph of "Employment in the computer and data-processing services industry", showing a perceptible but quite small dip which could be correlated with either widespread GenAI or the 2022 bear market.