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From the abstract: > Detectable levels of DNA were also observed in air and dust samples from ultra-clean forensic laboratories which can potentially contamina

From the abstract: > Detectable levels of DNA were also observed in air and dust samples from ultra-clean forensic laboratories which can potentially contaminate casework samples. Great news for criminal defense attorneys.

thfuran 2y ago
The defense attorneys of criminal criminal forensics lab technicians at least.
- Hupriene 2y ago
  Dexter Morgan wins again.
- looofooo0 2y ago
  Phantom of Heilbronn strikes again: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn
moontear 2y ago
How would that argument go? As far as I understand it, the DNA of the occupants of said lab may be found. That would mean that the criminal samples may also contain DNA of the lab occupants/scientists. Isn’t that the case currently as well and those DNA parts would be omitted?
- archerx 2y ago
  What if the murderer works in the lab?
  - gunian 2y ago
    [dead]
  - a_bonobo 2y ago
    The Phantom of Heilbronn! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn
    - archerx 2y ago
      That was interesting story, the ending in hindsight seems obvious. Thank you for sharing.
- greenpresident 2y ago
  That would ideal, yet we still got things like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn Woman at a cotton swab factory was identified after being considered a serial killer.
- yzydserd 2y ago
  It’s possibly not the GP’s point, but in general the more DNA that is available the better from a defense perspective. Many wrongful convictions involve a lack of physical evidence. Recent advances like “touch dna” and “m-vac” have led to new DNA evidence used in actual innocence decisions. Too often, a jury convicts a likely suspect on weak circumstantial evidence. Just as with Touch DNA, Air DNA will create new problems with avoiding contamination. The path toward Air DNA has been known for years [0]. Wouldn’t be surprised to learn crime scene investigators have been sampling and storing air in high profile cases ready for the tech to catch up. [0] https://www.science.org/content/article/dna-pulled-thin-air-identifies-nearby-animals https://www.science.org/content/article/dna-pulled-thin-air-...
mrtksn 2y ago
It cuts both ways, there was this high profile case of the son of a very rich and powerful family brutally murdering his working class girlfriend in his family mansion with some family present, motives still unknown. In the autopsy they discovered sperm from a 3rd person on her body, tried to claim that it was an infidelity case(you get different sentece depending on your motives and circumstances) but later it was revealed that this was just a contamination during the autopsy. So, the more forensic options the better but likely longer and more expensive trials. All lawyers win.
- paulluuk 2y ago
  > just a contamination during the autopsy. How does sperm end up on her body during the autopsy? Are we talking necrophilia or are there multiple murdered bodies laying next to each other and the tools are re-used or something?
  - mrtksn 2y ago
    IRRC The official explanation is that there were a few autopsies going on at the same time in that facility and it came from the body next to hers. The public opinion was that they bribed the technician to contaminate her body. The whole case is a huge mess with attempts of cover ups, months long manhunts and all kinds of conspiracy theories. The killer was sentenced to 24 years of prison but unalived himself in prison and there're still conspiracy theories saying that he actually escaped to China because he was studying Chinese in prison prior that. This happened more than 10 years ago and last year they opened his grave to check the remains and again it was confirmed that that's him. Yet, this is still not enough to end the public discussion and conspiracy theories. Anyway, if anyone is curious this is the case in question: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Münevver_Karabulut https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Münevver_Karabulut Unfortunately, the juicy literature around that is mostly in Turkish.
    - bozhark 2y ago
      You can say he killed himself it’s not kitkots

thfuran 2y ago

The defense attorneys of criminal criminal forensics lab technicians at least.

Hupriene 2y ago
Dexter Morgan wins again.
looofooo0 2y ago
Phantom of Heilbronn strikes again: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn

moontear 2y ago

How would that argument go? As far as I understand it, the DNA of the occupants of said lab may be found. That would mean that the criminal samples may also contain DNA of the lab occupants/scientists. Isn’t that the case currently as well and those DNA parts would be omitted?

archerx 2y ago
What if the murderer works in the lab?
- gunian 2y ago
  [dead]
- a_bonobo 2y ago
  The Phantom of Heilbronn! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn
  - archerx 2y ago
    That was interesting story, the ending in hindsight seems obvious. Thank you for sharing.
greenpresident 2y ago
That would ideal, yet we still got things like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn Woman at a cotton swab factory was identified after being considered a serial killer.
yzydserd 2y ago
It’s possibly not the GP’s point, but in general the more DNA that is available the better from a defense perspective. Many wrongful convictions involve a lack of physical evidence. Recent advances like “touch dna” and “m-vac” have led to new DNA evidence used in actual innocence decisions. Too often, a jury convicts a likely suspect on weak circumstantial evidence. Just as with Touch DNA, Air DNA will create new problems with avoiding contamination. The path toward Air DNA has been known for years [0]. Wouldn’t be surprised to learn crime scene investigators have been sampling and storing air in high profile cases ready for the tech to catch up. [0] https://www.science.org/content/article/dna-pulled-thin-air-identifies-nearby-animals https://www.science.org/content/article/dna-pulled-thin-air-...

mrtksn 2y ago

It cuts both ways, there was this high profile case of the son of a very rich and powerful family brutally murdering his working class girlfriend in his family mansion with some family present, motives still unknown. In the autopsy they discovered sperm from a 3rd person on her body, tried to claim that it was an infidelity case(you get different sentece depending on your motives and circumstances) but later it was revealed that this was just a contamination during the autopsy. So, the more forensic options the better but likely longer and more expensive trials. All lawyers win.

paulluuk 2y ago
> just a contamination during the autopsy. How does sperm end up on her body during the autopsy? Are we talking necrophilia or are there multiple murdered bodies laying next to each other and the tools are re-used or something?
- mrtksn 2y ago
  IRRC The official explanation is that there were a few autopsies going on at the same time in that facility and it came from the body next to hers. The public opinion was that they bribed the technician to contaminate her body. The whole case is a huge mess with attempts of cover ups, months long manhunts and all kinds of conspiracy theories. The killer was sentenced to 24 years of prison but unalived himself in prison and there're still conspiracy theories saying that he actually escaped to China because he was studying Chinese in prison prior that. This happened more than 10 years ago and last year they opened his grave to check the remains and again it was confirmed that that's him. Yet, this is still not enough to end the public discussion and conspiracy theories. Anyway, if anyone is curious this is the case in question: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Münevver_Karabulut https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Münevver_Karabulut Unfortunately, the juicy literature around that is mostly in Turkish.
  - bozhark 2y ago
    You can say he killed himself it’s not kitkots