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None at present to my knowledge. The French Rafale is the only western jet fighter without any US components.
by graeme 2y ago
None at present to my knowledge. The French Rafale is the only western jet fighter without any US components.
- toomuchtodo 2y agoThanks. This leads me to the conclusion reverse engineering and production of these GE engines is a priority.
- nradov 2y agoYou've got to be kidding. Reverse engineering the GE F414 for local production and maintenance is just completely impractical, or maybe impossible. It would be faster and cheaper to adapt something like the Eurojet EJ200 to fit into the Gripen.
- toomuchtodo 2y agoAre you saying the Europeans or Chinese cannot reverse engineer an aerospace engine for mass production? I have no particular preference where it’s done, any sufficiently advanced country will do. I suppose any afterburning turbofan engine will do if it fits? Again, not particularly opinionated. Just get out from under US control using the path of least resistance.
- nradov 2y agoYes, I am saying that the Europeans or Chinese cannot reverse engineer a turbine engine as sophisticated as the F414. Having some examples in hand doesn't tell you much about how it was built, nor does that give you the source code for the embedded control software and diagnostic systems. The Chinese have been trying for years to reverse engineer older Russian turbofan engines and still can't get them quite right. And those are a level below the F414 in complexity.
- CRConrad 2y agoYou don't need the source code for the embedded control software and diagnostic systems. If you're pirating the whole engine design anyway, just copy the binary from the example you're copying. (Then just make sure not to hook it up to any radio transmitter under the engine's direct control, so it can't call home to the American manufacturer and be disabled remotely.)
- willvarfar 2y agoWhy try to copy an engine which would enrage the US when you can simply replace it with an engine, a newer engine, that you already produce in Europe and Europe has soverign control over and can offer the Swedes the _right_ to produce etc? Just go talk to Rolls Royce in the UK or Safran in France.
- genewitch 2y agoIs Rolls Royce not owned by Ford motor company? Or is the aircraft engine part separate?
- rkosk 2y agoAfter the original Rolls-Royce Ltd. went bust the British government bought up all it's assets and set up a new company in 1971. The automobile division was spun off as a separate company and sold off a few years later. The engine company is Rolls-Royce Holdings Plc and ain't a subsidiary of anyone. It's the second largest manufacturer of aircraft engines after CFM. BMW owns the modern car company and licenses the name and logo from the engine company.
- genewitch 2y agookay, but 8 of the top 10 shareholders (and four of the top four) in Rolls-Royce Holdings Plc are American. I'm not really sure "ain't a subsidiary" is quite what you make of it. I was incorrect, but i hedged, i guessed that the aircraft engine parts wasn't owned by ford, but i was not sure. in the context of this discussion, if all american investors pulled out of Rolls-Royce Holdings Plc because they were tasked with copying an american engine... could Rolls-Royce Holdings Plc make that engine? This is what american isolationism means and will look like.
- nradov 2y agoWhat do you mean by "pull out"? If investors sell their shares then the company including all assets and employees still exist, it just has different owners. The actual obstacle to any separation from US control isn't financial but rather some level of dependence on US parts suppliers and licensed technology.
- genewitch 2y agoYes, without help from the US the rest of the world is about 230 years behind in warfighting technology.. Patriot missiles were first successfully deployed against a US drone aircraft in 1965. Patriot systems were in use to shield Kyiv et al to great success. I know it sucks to hear this, but if the US goes isolationist, there's not much anyone can do.
- thisislife2 2y agoDuring the cold war, Soviet Russia realised that NATO Air Force was becoming superior in numbers to their own, and would probably dominate the air domain in a conflict with them. So they pivoted their focus to missiles and anti-ballistic missile (ABM) shields to neutralise this western advantage. And, for a period, their missile and ABM programs did have a big lead over the west. After the USSR disintegrated, the west managed to catch up with them. As for Ukraine, they have the S-300 ABM, the Buks and Osa-AKM for air defence. (The Russian made Buk was one of the first systems able to intercept cruise missiles and US-made Lance tactical ballistic missiles, Harm anti-radar missiles and other airborne and ground-based precision weapons). Though quite old, they are still formidable and is one of the main reasons Russian Air Force has a low key role in the current ongoing conflict. (That + the NATO AWACS). The problem Ukraine had was that they ran out of missiles for these platform and that's why the US provided them with the Patriot system. But since America did not have enough spare Patriot missiles, East Europe and the US also modified the Buk platform to fire the radar-guided AIM-7 Sparrow and the semi-active radar-guided RIM-7 Sea Sparrow, as well as the heat-seeking AIM-9M Sidewinder air-to-air missile.
- mike_hearn 2y ago230 years? Which number did you mean to write there, 23?
- genewitch 2y ago1965 is more than 23 years ago.
- dieortin 2y agoIs this satire? Or do you truly believe the rest of the world is 230 years behind?
- eitland 2y agoRather try to get some cooperation with French industry (who already have a complete engine without US strings attached), or British Industry (which has a workings engines, but as far as I understand with some US strings attached.)
- riffraff 2y agoisn't the Eurofighter Typhoon also "US-free"? I kinda thought that was the point of it.