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We're inevitably creating and assembling all the pieces of the dystopian world from Manna[1], as if it were a handbook. The expectation of infinite growth and p

We're inevitably creating and assembling all the pieces of the dystopian world from Manna[1], as if it were a handbook. The expectation of infinite growth and profit at all costs is going to destroy all but the very, very wealthy. 1: https://marshallbrain.com/manna1 https://marshallbrain.com/manna1

ysofunny 2y ago
all of these enabled by a clear application of distance-abstraction how can the "ultra wealthy" be so evil? they don't even know it, they purposefully do not want to know. they have a thing for being ignorant about whence their wealth comes and how it's handled. all they care is they get the best of everything by my account's handle I should make this funny some how but not today.
- ryandrake 2y ago
  It's useful to think of -The World- as a gigantic factory. But instead of producing products, this factory produces billionaires. The raw materials that go into the factory are money, energy and a few privileged people, the output from the assembly line are billionaires, and the waste product discarded out the back are the worn-out and no-longer-efficient minds and bodies of common workers. If you look at every significant policy decision that gets made in any country (regardless of government type), you will see that they are all in service of keeping this factory running.
smallmancontrov 2y ago
The world is run by the rich, for the rich. Rich people get paid for being rich when there is growth. If real growth can't be had, fake growth (inflation and debt) will do, since it serves the same ultimate purpose just as well: paying rich people for being rich. The beatings will continue until the growth resumes.
- worldsayshi 2y ago
  > The world is run by the rich, for the rich. I sympathize but am extremely frustrated at this defeatist idea. Yes they run it, but only because people in general fail to coordinate around some other way of doing things. It's coordination plain and "simple". The rich doesn't run the world. They tell people what to do and people run the world as they command because there seems to be no better alternative. Why have we stopped trying out better ways to coordinate? We somehow have come to believe that mass coordination outside of corporations can't be improved upon.
  - 3np 2y ago
    > Why have we stopped trying out better ways to coordinate? To a large extent because somehow "that serves no purpose", "any alternative is a scam" and "blockchain evil" propaganda have been very effective in an environment where greed has been distracting too many from the damn point. We need to relearn and establish new ways to run perpetual and huge coordination efforts outside of corporate systems and government without fear or greed as necessary driving forces. The first step is to start trying ans honestly explore options.
    - worldsayshi 2y ago
      > greed has been distracting too many from the damn point I also suspect that another factor is ever increasing acceptance of the immutability of debt. When most people are stuck in debt they have to keep running in the treadmill. Imagine if there was a non-blockable way for everyone to vote on a universal debt cancellation event - "Should we all just from now on ignore any debt incurred before today? ¤ yes, ¤ no".
      - pixl97 2y ago
        >everyone to vote on a universal debt cancellation event Just look at the student loan forgiveness debacle. It seems our population would sooner vote in capital punishment for not paying debt.
        2y ago
- darth_avocado 2y ago
  Too many people don’t learn from history. Especially the Rich. There was a very popular thing the French did when things got out of hand. And they were not the only only to do it throughout the history.
  - nazgulsenpai 2y ago
    How quickly do you think those people would be declared terrorists and neutralized in 2025?
    - dingnuts 2y ago
      why dont you tell us, nazgulsenpai? I mean why bother resist against a tyrannical government right? sheesh. Relevant username.
      - nazgulsenpai 2y ago
        I'm not sure what my username has to do with anything, or why the combative tone. It's intended as a thought exercise, if a revolution in the spirit of the French revolution were to happen today, with the surveillance at the government's disposal, how quickly would it be justified legally (declared terrorists) and neutralized. The more time passes, the more technological advances are used for mass surveillance and propaganda, the less likely it seems.
        metalman 2y ago
        there is a presumption on your part, that control of the net, is absolute revolutions of the past,have all included some control of the press and we can see, everywhere, the frantic efforts to control the net, and digital currency the old axiom of "control the press and the mint, and they can have the rest" is now bieng put to the test, internaly and externaly. the truth bieng that the level of control now possible, real realy realy, is cramping everybodys style, and so the forms of protest and revolution are evolving, and matching the wierdness, insanity for insanity, there IS absolute control , but there is no sure way to describe what exactly is bieng controlled, no revolutionary symbols,check no calls to kill the leaders,check billions of worky workers, worky working, check, trillions of hours spent grinding out an entirely new and evolving memetic language of comunication in a vast never ending seathing quest for some meaning, uh huh.
- torginus 2y ago
  This is a bit of an aside but why is this rich-bashing so endemic to modern Western society, even at the highest levels? To be clear I'm not asking if the rich are evil or not, I am asking why are there movies with hundred-million dollar budgets, whose entire message is that the 'rich are evil'? Why are there leftist newspapers 'fighting for the little guy', staffed by 1%ers, and owned by billionaires? Why is the cookie cutter young adult dystopia book, sold by the millions, about a bunch of poor kids in a dystopian capitalist society? None of this shit makes sense to me.
  - AlotOfReading 2y ago
    Consider the pervasive narratives those people are reacting to: that people who are wealthy/powerful are better humans. Being poor is often seen as a moral failing, whereas people who are wealthy are attractive, intelligent people. In some cases, "better" is even meant literally, like this well-known, only partly tongue-in-cheek new Yorker article (https://www.newyorker.com/humor/daily-shouts/rich-people-really-are-better https://www.newyorker.com/humor/daily-shouts/rich-people-rea...) or the British class system. You're only questioning one half of these ideas.
    - argentinian 2y ago
      Where do you observe the promotion of the absurd narrative that says that the rich are better humans?
      - AlotOfReading 2y ago
        Well, you could look at the examples provided, any of various historical (and modern) class systems, great man theory, do a quick search (e.g. https://www.forbes.com/sites/rainerzitelmann/2019/05/08/new-psychological-studies-how-the-wealthy-really-are-different-from-everyone-else/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/rainerzitelmann/2019/05/08/new-...), read self-help literature (e.g. rich dad, poor dad), and so on. It might be harder to find media where that narrative isn't either present or intentionally absent. And just because something is present doesn't mean it's an intentional or complete narrative being promoted by the author. This is simply an idea that's virtually omnipresent in Western societies, like the acceptance of capitalism or the system of colors. Things that challenge these sorts of deeply assumed ideas often seem like attacks on society itself. If you want an author who intentionally addresses it, Ursula Guin has made it a big focus of her works (e.g. Omelas, the hainish cycle).
- immibis 2y ago
  They are only rich because we value what they have. What's the difference between a US dollar and a square of toilet paper? One is more rectangular and has a guy's face printed on it.

ysofunny 2y ago

all of these enabled by a clear application of distance-abstraction how can the "ultra wealthy" be so evil? they don't even know it, they purposefully do not want to know. they have a thing for being ignorant about whence their wealth comes and how it's handled. all they care is they get the best of everything by my account's handle I should make this funny some how but not today.

ryandrake 2y ago
It's useful to think of -The World- as a gigantic factory. But instead of producing products, this factory produces billionaires. The raw materials that go into the factory are money, energy and a few privileged people, the output from the assembly line are billionaires, and the waste product discarded out the back are the worn-out and no-longer-efficient minds and bodies of common workers. If you look at every significant policy decision that gets made in any country (regardless of government type), you will see that they are all in service of keeping this factory running.

smallmancontrov 2y ago

The world is run by the rich, for the rich. Rich people get paid for being rich when there is growth. If real growth can't be had, fake growth (inflation and debt) will do, since it serves the same ultimate purpose just as well: paying rich people for being rich. The beatings will continue until the growth resumes.

worldsayshi 2y ago
> The world is run by the rich, for the rich. I sympathize but am extremely frustrated at this defeatist idea. Yes they run it, but only because people in general fail to coordinate around some other way of doing things. It's coordination plain and "simple". The rich doesn't run the world. They tell people what to do and people run the world as they command because there seems to be no better alternative. Why have we stopped trying out better ways to coordinate? We somehow have come to believe that mass coordination outside of corporations can't be improved upon.
- 3np 2y ago
  > Why have we stopped trying out better ways to coordinate? To a large extent because somehow "that serves no purpose", "any alternative is a scam" and "blockchain evil" propaganda have been very effective in an environment where greed has been distracting too many from the damn point. We need to relearn and establish new ways to run perpetual and huge coordination efforts outside of corporate systems and government without fear or greed as necessary driving forces. The first step is to start trying ans honestly explore options.
  - worldsayshi 2y ago
    > greed has been distracting too many from the damn point I also suspect that another factor is ever increasing acceptance of the immutability of debt. When most people are stuck in debt they have to keep running in the treadmill. Imagine if there was a non-blockable way for everyone to vote on a universal debt cancellation event - "Should we all just from now on ignore any debt incurred before today? ¤ yes, ¤ no".
    - pixl97 2y ago
      >everyone to vote on a universal debt cancellation event Just look at the student loan forgiveness debacle. It seems our population would sooner vote in capital punishment for not paying debt.
      - 2y ago
darth_avocado 2y ago
Too many people don’t learn from history. Especially the Rich. There was a very popular thing the French did when things got out of hand. And they were not the only only to do it throughout the history.
- nazgulsenpai 2y ago
  How quickly do you think those people would be declared terrorists and neutralized in 2025?
  - dingnuts 2y ago
    why dont you tell us, nazgulsenpai? I mean why bother resist against a tyrannical government right? sheesh. Relevant username.
    - nazgulsenpai 2y ago
      I'm not sure what my username has to do with anything, or why the combative tone. It's intended as a thought exercise, if a revolution in the spirit of the French revolution were to happen today, with the surveillance at the government's disposal, how quickly would it be justified legally (declared terrorists) and neutralized. The more time passes, the more technological advances are used for mass surveillance and propaganda, the less likely it seems.
      - metalman 2y ago
        there is a presumption on your part, that control of the net, is absolute revolutions of the past,have all included some control of the press and we can see, everywhere, the frantic efforts to control the net, and digital currency the old axiom of "control the press and the mint, and they can have the rest" is now bieng put to the test, internaly and externaly. the truth bieng that the level of control now possible, real realy realy, is cramping everybodys style, and so the forms of protest and revolution are evolving, and matching the wierdness, insanity for insanity, there IS absolute control , but there is no sure way to describe what exactly is bieng controlled, no revolutionary symbols,check no calls to kill the leaders,check billions of worky workers, worky working, check, trillions of hours spent grinding out an entirely new and evolving memetic language of comunication in a vast never ending seathing quest for some meaning, uh huh.
torginus 2y ago
This is a bit of an aside but why is this rich-bashing so endemic to modern Western society, even at the highest levels? To be clear I'm not asking if the rich are evil or not, I am asking why are there movies with hundred-million dollar budgets, whose entire message is that the 'rich are evil'? Why are there leftist newspapers 'fighting for the little guy', staffed by 1%ers, and owned by billionaires? Why is the cookie cutter young adult dystopia book, sold by the millions, about a bunch of poor kids in a dystopian capitalist society? None of this shit makes sense to me.
- AlotOfReading 2y ago
  Consider the pervasive narratives those people are reacting to: that people who are wealthy/powerful are better humans. Being poor is often seen as a moral failing, whereas people who are wealthy are attractive, intelligent people. In some cases, "better" is even meant literally, like this well-known, only partly tongue-in-cheek new Yorker article (https://www.newyorker.com/humor/daily-shouts/rich-people-really-are-better https://www.newyorker.com/humor/daily-shouts/rich-people-rea...) or the British class system. You're only questioning one half of these ideas.
  - argentinian 2y ago
    Where do you observe the promotion of the absurd narrative that says that the rich are better humans?
    - AlotOfReading 2y ago
      Well, you could look at the examples provided, any of various historical (and modern) class systems, great man theory, do a quick search (e.g. https://www.forbes.com/sites/rainerzitelmann/2019/05/08/new-psychological-studies-how-the-wealthy-really-are-different-from-everyone-else/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/rainerzitelmann/2019/05/08/new-...), read self-help literature (e.g. rich dad, poor dad), and so on. It might be harder to find media where that narrative isn't either present or intentionally absent. And just because something is present doesn't mean it's an intentional or complete narrative being promoted by the author. This is simply an idea that's virtually omnipresent in Western societies, like the acceptance of capitalism or the system of colors. Things that challenge these sorts of deeply assumed ideas often seem like attacks on society itself. If you want an author who intentionally addresses it, Ursula Guin has made it a big focus of her works (e.g. Omelas, the hainish cycle).
immibis 2y ago
They are only rich because we value what they have. What's the difference between a US dollar and a square of toilet paper? One is more rectangular and has a guy's face printed on it.