5 ms·

The Rise of the Brutal American

67 points by petethomas 2y ago

mitchbob 2y ago
https://archive.ph/IL50f https://archive.ph/IL50f
listenallyall 2y ago
Why is it that articles like this one, describing what all non-Americans think (and proposing that they all think alike), seem to always be written by Americans?
- s1artibartfast 2y ago
  Moreover, the the sentiment of non-Americans always seems to mirror that of the author.
- specproc 2y ago
  And Anne Applebaum no less. One hideous thing about America's (further) lurch to the right is that somehow Bush-era hawk hacks like her are lecturing us on democracy.
  - DrNosferatu 2y ago
    I’m not aware of her (Bush?) past, but her arguments certainly have merit.
- propagandist 2y ago
  In this case, the author is a well-known bad-faith actor who twists and contorts reality in order to sell her political agenda. Just any anything from this publication nowadays fits that mold. See David's Frum involvement. That's one of the people who sold the Iraq WMD fraud in the Bush administration.
outer_web 2y ago
Surely, most people (regardless of nationality) realize that the "alt reality" is simply an narrative offered to cynically accomplish an objective. You can't instruct your proxies to avoid asking the question "did Russia invade Ukraine" without understanding Russia invaded Ukraine.
sras-me 2y ago
This article appear to be a bit childish. The whole issue is that the President of the Ukraine choose to argue in an event that was just ceremonial to an agreement that he agreed to. It was NOT supposed to be a discussion or negotiations. The POTUS and vice president were pissed because the Ukraine president tired to put them in a difficult situation when the media was involved, particularly when he has came in the guise of already having agreed to sign the agreement. That is literally what the vice president said he said the Ukraine president was being "deeply disrespectful", and know what, I agree. Not an American by the way.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- johntitorjr 2y ago
  In my viewing of it, Zelensky was very respectful in the face of extreme, and unwarranted, condescension. The biggest disagreement was started by Zelensky politely correcting Trump on a fact. Trump and Vance escalated from there. >POTUS and vice president were pissed I don't care if they were pissed, they need to act like fucking statesmen! I'm allowed to be a little uncivil here because I'm not the fucking POTUS. Let's hold our nation's best and brightest to a high standard. They're supposed to be figures that we aspire to emulate.
  - ty6853 2y ago
    I hope defending his ego was worth it. It feels a bit like defending your ego against a bully with a 3 year old in tow. Even if you are right, there's no need to expose your dependents to the rage of a psychopath you need something from. This spat is going to cost Ukraine -- it already has.
  - Jimmc414 2y ago
    Respectfully, did you watch the entire 50-minute exchange? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pxbGjvcdyY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pxbGjvcdyY
    - 2y ago
frohrer 2y ago
I disagree with the author that this a "brand-new" stereotype. America has always been described as aggressive, militaristic and heavy handed in international affairs, in my anecdotal experience as a European.
- sph 2y ago
  Yes, such a personality had its place when it was also well educated and knowledgeable about the world. These days, America is aggressive, militaristic, heavy handed in international affairs as well as being completely brainwashed by social media, online propaganda, and terrible education to a lesser extent. In these days of turmoil, trying to figure out what is going on and what could cause this, it is appalling to me that no one since to blame the elephant in the room: social media, the social internet and making it the core of our society was in hindsight the stupidest thing humanity has ever made. Don't go blaming the Russian bots or Chinese posters. The whole thing is making us more stupid, more entrenched, more vulnerable to massive manipulation of public opinion. And we go cry whenever they take away our algorithms (see the popularity of BlueSky vs Mastodon for example). Call me dramatic, but social media and Web 2.0 indirectly will cause the end of civilisation much faster and more effectively than mass media of old ever dreamed of. And we are still all here happily engaging with it.
  - throw-the-towel 2y ago
    I'm sorry because this is going to be rude, but we're talking stereotypes anyway. I cannot remember a time, ever, when America was considered "well educated". And the "knowledgeable about the world" bit is just ridiculous, that quote about war being God's way of teaching Americans geography dates back to the 19th century.
    - sph 2y ago
      I am not American. I'm just, like many, influenced by your propaganda. It is very possible that Americans in the 70s where as dumb as they are today, no way for me to confirm it, apart from the fact that a lot of nonsense that's happening today was not happening then, so that has to count for something. If it helps, the idiocy is not a purely American phenomenon but widespread and now affecting the younger generations. As someone with a Gen-Z sibling, the illiteracy of that generation, grown on Youtube and Tiktok, is utterly mind-boggling. A large contingent of them voted for conservatives and fascists just "for the memes." Back in my day, young people tended to be idealistic and progressive. Fighting for something. Hoping to be better and more open-minded than their parents. I squarely blame this shift on the social like-and-subscribe upvote-driven Internet.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
waltercool 2y ago
[dead]
aaomidi 2y ago
What’s really happening is that countries are seeing the real America. The America that the global south knows all too well. This isn’t new. If you’re ashamed of how this country is behaving now, and you weren’t before, you’re part of the problem TBH.

67 points by petethomas 2y ago

https://archive.ph/IL50f https://archive.ph/IL50f

Why is it that articles like this one, describing what all non-Americans think (and proposing that they all think alike), seem to always be written by Americans?

s1artibartfast 2y ago
Moreover, the the sentiment of non-Americans always seems to mirror that of the author.
specproc 2y ago
And Anne Applebaum no less. One hideous thing about America's (further) lurch to the right is that somehow Bush-era hawk hacks like her are lecturing us on democracy.
- DrNosferatu 2y ago
  I’m not aware of her (Bush?) past, but her arguments certainly have merit.
propagandist 2y ago
In this case, the author is a well-known bad-faith actor who twists and contorts reality in order to sell her political agenda. Just any anything from this publication nowadays fits that mold. See David's Frum involvement. That's one of the people who sold the Iraq WMD fraud in the Bush administration.

outer_web 2y ago

Surely, most people (regardless of nationality) realize that the "alt reality" is simply an narrative offered to cynically accomplish an objective. You can't instruct your proxies to avoid asking the question "did Russia invade Ukraine" without understanding Russia invaded Ukraine.

sras-me 2y ago

This article appear to be a bit childish. The whole issue is that the President of the Ukraine choose to argue in an event that was just ceremonial to an agreement that he agreed to. It was NOT supposed to be a discussion or negotiations. The POTUS and vice president were pissed because the Ukraine president tired to put them in a difficult situation when the media was involved, particularly when he has came in the guise of already having agreed to sign the agreement. That is literally what the vice president said he said the Ukraine president was being "deeply disrespectful", and know what, I agree. Not an American by the way.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
johntitorjr 2y ago
In my viewing of it, Zelensky was very respectful in the face of extreme, and unwarranted, condescension. The biggest disagreement was started by Zelensky politely correcting Trump on a fact. Trump and Vance escalated from there. >POTUS and vice president were pissed I don't care if they were pissed, they need to act like fucking statesmen! I'm allowed to be a little uncivil here because I'm not the fucking POTUS. Let's hold our nation's best and brightest to a high standard. They're supposed to be figures that we aspire to emulate.
- ty6853 2y ago
  I hope defending his ego was worth it. It feels a bit like defending your ego against a bully with a 3 year old in tow. Even if you are right, there's no need to expose your dependents to the rage of a psychopath you need something from. This spat is going to cost Ukraine -- it already has.
- Jimmc414 2y ago
  Respectfully, did you watch the entire 50-minute exchange? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pxbGjvcdyY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pxbGjvcdyY
  - 2y ago

frohrer 2y ago

I disagree with the author that this a "brand-new" stereotype. America has always been described as aggressive, militaristic and heavy handed in international affairs, in my anecdotal experience as a European.

sph 2y ago
Yes, such a personality had its place when it was also well educated and knowledgeable about the world. These days, America is aggressive, militaristic, heavy handed in international affairs as well as being completely brainwashed by social media, online propaganda, and terrible education to a lesser extent. In these days of turmoil, trying to figure out what is going on and what could cause this, it is appalling to me that no one since to blame the elephant in the room: social media, the social internet and making it the core of our society was in hindsight the stupidest thing humanity has ever made. Don't go blaming the Russian bots or Chinese posters. The whole thing is making us more stupid, more entrenched, more vulnerable to massive manipulation of public opinion. And we go cry whenever they take away our algorithms (see the popularity of BlueSky vs Mastodon for example). Call me dramatic, but social media and Web 2.0 indirectly will cause the end of civilisation much faster and more effectively than mass media of old ever dreamed of. And we are still all here happily engaging with it.
- throw-the-towel 2y ago
  I'm sorry because this is going to be rude, but we're talking stereotypes anyway. I cannot remember a time, ever, when America was considered "well educated". And the "knowledgeable about the world" bit is just ridiculous, that quote about war being God's way of teaching Americans geography dates back to the 19th century.
  - sph 2y ago
    I am not American. I'm just, like many, influenced by your propaganda. It is very possible that Americans in the 70s where as dumb as they are today, no way for me to confirm it, apart from the fact that a lot of nonsense that's happening today was not happening then, so that has to count for something. If it helps, the idiocy is not a purely American phenomenon but widespread and now affecting the younger generations. As someone with a Gen-Z sibling, the illiteracy of that generation, grown on Youtube and Tiktok, is utterly mind-boggling. A large contingent of them voted for conservatives and fascists just "for the memes." Back in my day, young people tended to be idealistic and progressive. Fighting for something. Hoping to be better and more open-minded than their parents. I squarely blame this shift on the social like-and-subscribe upvote-driven Internet.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

waltercool 2y ago

[dead]

aaomidi 2y ago

What’s really happening is that countries are seeing the real America. The America that the global south knows all too well. This isn’t new. If you’re ashamed of how this country is behaving now, and you weren’t before, you’re part of the problem TBH.