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Surely Apple's lawyers can use this information in court - the fact that the government itself is relying on, and recommending, citizens and (presumably) intell

Surely Apple's lawyers can use this information in court - the fact that the government itself is relying on, and recommending, citizens and (presumably) intelligence assets to use Apple's encryption technology abroad makes it VERY clear that outlawing said technology will systematically weaken ALL UK information infrastructure and make it 110% easier for foreign powers to exploit and sabotage the UK as whole. edit: removed political quip since, as evidenced by sub-comments, it too easily derails from the primary discussion point, excuse-moi.

miohtama 2y ago
Apple is not planning to fight for the UK citizens over encryption. It's a job for the democracy and voters.
- Hizonner 2y ago
  Well, the rumor is that Apple has secretly appealed the order (which is officially secret) to whatever secret tribunal reviews such secret orders to create secret features giving secret government investigations access to various people's secrets. The Court of the Star Chamber, I think it's called. Which is at least Apple doing something vaguely like fighting. But, yeah, UK citizens might want to think hard about doing something about the situation themselves. For one thing, Apple will probably lose. And the US government isn't going to have Apple's back against the UK, either.
- Maxious 2y ago
  Apple may be fighting for the UK citizens. We don't know, we're not allowed to know and Apple isn't allowed to tell us https://www.theverge.com/news/623977/apple-uk-encryption-order-appeal https://www.theverge.com/news/623977/apple-uk-encryption-ord...
jen20 2y ago
If you think Reform are likely to be in favour of anything other than the most authoritarian implantation of whatever law enforcement suggests they want, I don’t think you’ve been paying attention to who Reform are.
danparsonson 2y ago
> Do we really need Reform in power for common sense to flourish in the UK to any degree?! No. You've mistaken demagoguery for common sense I'm afraid. That's one of their favourite tricks though, so you could be forgiven for the mistake.
- gessha 2y ago
  Reminds me of this sketch from A bit of Fry and Laurie: Hugh: And by demagoguery you mean ...? Stephen: I mean demagoguery, I mean highly-charged oratory, persuasive whipping up rhetoric… Transcript: https://abitoffryandlaurie.co.uk/sketches/language_conversation https://abitoffryandlaurie.co.uk/sketches/language_conversat... Video: https://youtu.be/3MWpHQQ-wQg https://youtu.be/3MWpHQQ-wQg

miohtama 2y ago

Apple is not planning to fight for the UK citizens over encryption. It's a job for the democracy and voters.

Hizonner 2y ago
Well, the rumor is that Apple has secretly appealed the order (which is officially secret) to whatever secret tribunal reviews such secret orders to create secret features giving secret government investigations access to various people's secrets. The Court of the Star Chamber, I think it's called. Which is at least Apple doing something vaguely like fighting. But, yeah, UK citizens might want to think hard about doing something about the situation themselves. For one thing, Apple will probably lose. And the US government isn't going to have Apple's back against the UK, either.
Maxious 2y ago
Apple may be fighting for the UK citizens. We don't know, we're not allowed to know and Apple isn't allowed to tell us https://www.theverge.com/news/623977/apple-uk-encryption-order-appeal https://www.theverge.com/news/623977/apple-uk-encryption-ord...

jen20 2y ago

If you think Reform are likely to be in favour of anything other than the most authoritarian implantation of whatever law enforcement suggests they want, I don’t think you’ve been paying attention to who Reform are.

danparsonson 2y ago

> Do we really need Reform in power for common sense to flourish in the UK to any degree?! No. You've mistaken demagoguery for common sense I'm afraid. That's one of their favourite tricks though, so you could be forgiven for the mistake.

gessha 2y ago
Reminds me of this sketch from A bit of Fry and Laurie: Hugh: And by demagoguery you mean ...? Stephen: I mean demagoguery, I mean highly-charged oratory, persuasive whipping up rhetoric… Transcript: https://abitoffryandlaurie.co.uk/sketches/language_conversation https://abitoffryandlaurie.co.uk/sketches/language_conversat... Video: https://youtu.be/3MWpHQQ-wQg https://youtu.be/3MWpHQQ-wQg