3 ms·

A billionaire can go to a lawless place like parts of Somalia, and see first-hand how much people respect their claims to their safety and property there, if th

A billionaire can go to a lawless place like parts of Somalia, and see first-hand how much people respect their claims to their safety and property there, if they did not pay yet more for mercenaries. Even for people who do not believe in investing in social welfare and public infrastructure and goods, taxes pay for the police, army, and laws that enforce their claim and monopoly over their own property. Without the government that taxes fund, private property is just a wishful concept, and it is difficult to own anything in the first place.

nonethewiser 2y ago
See my explicit note about taxes being necessary. None of what you're saying addresses my point that it is basically theft because the money is taken from you without your consent.
- jhanschoo 2y ago
  Since taxation is not legally theft, I assume you are talking philosophically. And philosophically I'm saying that the notions of taxes and government are prior to property, and that the notion of property is a limited privilege that some governments grant to select people under its aegis (see also: certain serfs and slaves, who are not afforded the same privilege; they never had the opportunity that someone gave them a contract that paid them in property). It is absurd to say that when what gave you your monopoly over "your things" wants to limit the extent of its graciousness, that that is theft; rather it is a limitation of their charity. In fact, many historical nations' main function is seemingly to define and protect property (especially land) of a select few privileged people. There are places in the world that you can go to where sovereign violence does not reach and you don't have to pay tax, but lacking the organization afforded by a modern government is typically not what many people regard as a happy existence.

3 ms·

A billionaire can go to a lawless place like parts of Somalia, and see first-hand how much people respect their claims to their safety and property there, if th

by jhanschoo 2y ago

nonethewiser 2y ago
See my explicit note about taxes being necessary. None of what you're saying addresses my point that it is basically theft because the money is taken from you without your consent.
- jhanschoo 2y ago
  Since taxation is not legally theft, I assume you are talking philosophically. And philosophically I'm saying that the notions of taxes and government are prior to property, and that the notion of property is a limited privilege that some governments grant to select people under its aegis (see also: certain serfs and slaves, who are not afforded the same privilege; they never had the opportunity that someone gave them a contract that paid them in property). It is absurd to say that when what gave you your monopoly over "your things" wants to limit the extent of its graciousness, that that is theft; rather it is a limitation of their charity. In fact, many historical nations' main function is seemingly to define and protect property (especially land) of a select few privileged people. There are places in the world that you can go to where sovereign violence does not reach and you don't have to pay tax, but lacking the organization afforded by a modern government is typically not what many people regard as a happy existence.