4 ms·

I'm shocked when in 2025 the term "you stay in control" regarding browser emerges as something exclusive. When a web page or a program is downloaded to my comp

I'm shocked when in 2025 the term "you stay in control" regarding browser emerges as something exclusive. When a web page or a program is downloaded to my computer I cannot imagine anything else, yet every major company tries to do something opposed - take the control from me as soon as possible.

UweSchmidt 2y ago
My mental model of a browser is the same as of any tool, as a hammer, purely defined by its technical capabilities to do a job, like to display a website and offer basic functionality like for saving a bookmark. The very idea of an entity called "we", an anonymous and ever-changing cast of people managing "responsible defaults" and "simple tools to manage your data" and communicating it on their terms, making me try and keep up, is alien to this idea. They lay their hands on our data; want to know how exactly? Follow several links to this page: https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/privacy/firefox/#notice https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/privacy/firefox/#notice The page in its tone trivializes the entire deal and is just another EULA and as such could just as well be presented in a small textbox in all-caps. It's more than the average user will ever read, and way too vague anyway. "Be informed about what data we process about you, why and who it’s shared with (that’s this Notice!)" they say, but ...how about you show the entire dataset compiled about any user with information who is using it and for what exactly (excluding truly secret law enforcement requests). Everyone involved would be mortified with shame.
- p0w3n3d 2y ago
  I consider a browser as similar as a complicated curl with GUI. Therefore: - when I see that browser does not allow playing video in the background (youtube on mobile phones) - when my browser disallows me blocking certain things - when my browser prevents me from taking screenshot of things I can see on it ... it really angers me, as I feel betrayed. Of course, nowadays, web applications tend to get complicated and hide everything behind 'obscurity-security'; however, this should still be code that is a guest on my device, not me being a guest on their device running their code. I consider it extremely impolite behaviour.
  - fiverz 2y ago
    You can actually play YouTube in the background with Firefox on Android. There is two ways, 1. Put the video in full screen mode and then press the system home button, this enabled PiP. 2. Start the video, click onto another tab in Firefox (this will pause the video) but then with that second tab active, open the tab switcher and press the play button beside the other tab with the video. Then it will play in the background until you interact with the tab again.
    - pohuing 2y ago
      Or install an add on that blocks the api yt uses to detect if it's in the background. It wrecks my charge though.
  - winterbloom 2y ago
    Disagree It is your device and you are free to not run that code. You can leave Of course this changes if it is something you specifically fund like government websites
    - UweSchmidt 2y ago
      Ah, the good old Internet Libertarian. If only free and enlightened individuals could, through their choices in a market in which everything is allowed, spawn such a diverse set of solutions, or allow true self-help, that every need is met... ...rather than everything consolidating under a few big players who leave few realistic alternatives, who confront users and customers with conflicting and hard to identify or quantify problems. There might just be 3 unreconcilable goals like: - not allowing Google/Chrome to own the internet outright - have privacy for oneself and others who don't "opt out" - have a browser that is established enough to work on most websites and you can't tell me what browser to use. The same issue is present almost everywhere you look: All products have such massive permutations of health, energy, waste, sustainability, ethicical and economical parameters that making a decision is almost impossible for any well-informed individual, let alone for enough people to steer change in any meaningful way. If you maintaing this sort of "Libertarian" view, make sure you're not inadvertendly serve the interest of corporations that would like to not be criticized nor regulated.
amelius 2y ago
Browsers are becoming SmartTVs.
MathMonkeyMan 2y ago
Either you control the software, or the software controls you, yadda yadda...

UweSchmidt 2y ago

My mental model of a browser is the same as of any tool, as a hammer, purely defined by its technical capabilities to do a job, like to display a website and offer basic functionality like for saving a bookmark. The very idea of an entity called "we", an anonymous and ever-changing cast of people managing "responsible defaults" and "simple tools to manage your data" and communicating it on their terms, making me try and keep up, is alien to this idea. They lay their hands on our data; want to know how exactly? Follow several links to this page: https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/privacy/firefox/#notice https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/privacy/firefox/#notice The page in its tone trivializes the entire deal and is just another EULA and as such could just as well be presented in a small textbox in all-caps. It's more than the average user will ever read, and way too vague anyway. "Be informed about what data we process about you, why and who it’s shared with (that’s this Notice!)" they say, but ...how about you show the entire dataset compiled about any user with information who is using it and for what exactly (excluding truly secret law enforcement requests). Everyone involved would be mortified with shame.

p0w3n3d 2y ago
I consider a browser as similar as a complicated curl with GUI. Therefore: - when I see that browser does not allow playing video in the background (youtube on mobile phones) - when my browser disallows me blocking certain things - when my browser prevents me from taking screenshot of things I can see on it ... it really angers me, as I feel betrayed. Of course, nowadays, web applications tend to get complicated and hide everything behind 'obscurity-security'; however, this should still be code that is a guest on my device, not me being a guest on their device running their code. I consider it extremely impolite behaviour.
- fiverz 2y ago
  You can actually play YouTube in the background with Firefox on Android. There is two ways, 1. Put the video in full screen mode and then press the system home button, this enabled PiP. 2. Start the video, click onto another tab in Firefox (this will pause the video) but then with that second tab active, open the tab switcher and press the play button beside the other tab with the video. Then it will play in the background until you interact with the tab again.
  - pohuing 2y ago
    Or install an add on that blocks the api yt uses to detect if it's in the background. It wrecks my charge though.
- winterbloom 2y ago
  Disagree It is your device and you are free to not run that code. You can leave Of course this changes if it is something you specifically fund like government websites
  - UweSchmidt 2y ago
    Ah, the good old Internet Libertarian. If only free and enlightened individuals could, through their choices in a market in which everything is allowed, spawn such a diverse set of solutions, or allow true self-help, that every need is met... ...rather than everything consolidating under a few big players who leave few realistic alternatives, who confront users and customers with conflicting and hard to identify or quantify problems. There might just be 3 unreconcilable goals like: - not allowing Google/Chrome to own the internet outright - have privacy for oneself and others who don't "opt out" - have a browser that is established enough to work on most websites and you can't tell me what browser to use. The same issue is present almost everywhere you look: All products have such massive permutations of health, energy, waste, sustainability, ethicical and economical parameters that making a decision is almost impossible for any well-informed individual, let alone for enough people to steer change in any meaningful way. If you maintaing this sort of "Libertarian" view, make sure you're not inadvertendly serve the interest of corporations that would like to not be criticized nor regulated.

amelius 2y ago

Browsers are becoming SmartTVs.

MathMonkeyMan 2y ago

Either you control the software, or the software controls you, yadda yadda...