4 ms·

US will sell "gold card" giving foreigners right to live/work for $5M

34 points by vinnyglennon 2y ago

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
pmdulaney 2y ago
This strikes me as very un-American.
- walls 2y ago
  This is one of the most American things possible. Everything is officially for sale.
sss111 2y ago
This is going to replace the EB-5 which required a 800k investment, that you could get back with interest. With this, it seems like a 5 million usd donation to the US government. Which makes sense and puts us in-line with other countries that have "weaker" citizenships. Just makes me a little sad because I was saving up to 1 million to get the EB-5.
- tim333 2y ago
  They've been talking about getting rid of the EB-5 for years but it always seems to hang in there.
nothercastle 2y ago
Anyone donating 5 mil isn’t going to be a burden on the system but they might help loot it musk style
- SlightlyLeftPad 2y ago
  Would looting the system not be a burden?
  - nothercastle 2y ago
    Most politicians don’t acknowledge that
    - SlightlyLeftPad 2y ago
      Politicians are also a burden
JumpinJack_Cash 2y ago
Why would anyone do this? With 5M you can either move to Thailand or Vietnam and live without working for the rest of your days. Or donate it to Trump and Musk and find yourself with zero dollars to your name and the right to be in a place where if you don't have money you are even more of a zero compared to other regular countries, matter of fact if in other countries people without money are zero, in the US they are 6 feet under (or on their way there given health policy)
- sanswork 2y ago
  Anyone paying $5m for a gold card will have a higher standard of living in the US than Thailand or Vietnam. Even if you make just a bit above the US average salary your life will be better in the US than Thailand at least. In Thailand from my experience living there it is great if you're broke/low income but actual luxuries are a premium to western countries. Why would you expect someone to be spending all their money on this? It's clearly for wealthy people. I'm Canadian/Australian so you can probably guess my opinions on Trump and the current US government but I don't have any problem with this type of program and most countries already have a similar one just at a lower price point(I think Canadas in like $2m in venture investing instead of a straight payment to the government but same difference).
  - voidhorse 2y ago
    > Anyone paying $5m for a gold card will have a higher standard of living in the US than Thailand or Vietnam. not for long though, lol
    - sanswork 2y ago
      I have a feeling the QoL for the wealthy in America will stay pretty similar to today even if it drops off a cliff for everyone else
  - lukas099 2y ago
    To me, the real luxury is labor, and I bet servants would be cheaper in Thailand than the US.
inverted_flag 2y ago
> Asked whether he would consider selling the cards to Russian oligarchs, Trump responded: “Yeah, possibly. I know some Russian oligarchs that are very nice people.”
bigfatkitten 2y ago
> Asked whether he would consider selling the cards to Russian oligarchs, Trump responded: “Yeah, possibly. I know some Russian oligarchs that are very nice people.” I think it's a given that none of the character assessments conducted for other visa applicants will apply in this case.
Terr_ 2y ago
> Trump said the sale of the gold cards will begin in about two weeks Where's the law from congress that authorized this new category? The EB-5 he's talking about replacing comes from the Immigration Act of 1990. The timeline suggests Trump is going to sell worthless crap to gullible victims again, and use his lawbreaking to tee up another kind of The President Is A Dictator assertion in the hopes the Supreme Court will endorse it. (The Constitution says Congress has to impeach the President to stop power-grabs, but too many Republicans want their guy to grab power.)
qbxk 2y ago
won't this result in millionaires losing jobs?
- science4sail 2y ago
  As a thought experiment, if one wanted to advantage labor over capital, then a durable way to do so would be to engineer a simultaneous labor shortage and a capital surplus. The amazing Silicon Valley employee perks of the 2010s were the product of such an environment. Labor shortages can be induced by cutting supply: the Black Death was a famous example of this. More modern ways to do so could be reducing the birthrate or deporting able-bodied, working-age immigrants. Capital surplus can occur if there is too much cash and not enough investment opportunities. Importing more rich people and printing money can accomplish the former. Low interest rates and technological stagnation can accomplish the latter. War is also an option: war profiteering is a poor investment since the losing side's investors often get their assets confiscated as loot or reparations. One risk of this approach is that retirement becomes near-impossible. This is because retirees are capital holders: either directly via defined-contribution pensions or indirectly via annuities (defined-benefit pensions). The only way to retire will be if one has kids (or at least younger friends) willing to support them. Another risk of this is that the capital class will try to defy economics by abolishing civil rights and re-instituting slavery or serfdom. After all, it worked for Constantine...
- tim333 2y ago
  Yes sadly the US millionaire positions will be filled by cut price immigrant millionaires.
Jerqfase 2y ago
Feels like a path for oligarchs to avoid sanctions. Passports are big business for the wealthy. I'm sure I'm wrong and I'd love to know why. Anyone smarter than me know?
- Terr_ 2y ago
  I guarantee a core pillar of their plan is asserting that El Presidente [0] may grant or revoke them on a whim. [0] Yes, I know this idiom is increasingly unfair to the rest of the Americas.
anovikov 2y ago
I wonder why anyone would sign up to pay US taxes regardless of their residence, if they have cash... Can't see it working. There are plenty of other places with good passports and countries to live that are either safer/more democratic, or alternatively, more free/lawless and yet welcoming to the rich. Doing business in the US does not require a passport.
- tim333 2y ago
  I was wondering if the gold card will come without the tax obligations of a green card. It could be quite successful if so. I looked at getting an EB-5 but was put off by being liable for tax even if I didn't move to the US and also being expected to move to the US as part of the deal.
  - QQ00 2y ago
    It will not come without tax obligations. Taxing U.S. citizens globally is one of the most backward things ever, and yet the government has never gotten rid of it all these years. To the point, banks all over the world hate dealing with U.S. citizens who want to open accounts because of the amount of information the U.S. government expects the bank to hand over to them.
Ekaros 2y ago
If they managed to sell 8 million of these it would pay of the federal debt. Not actually unreasonable plan to fund it. Not sure if there would be that many takers...
- science4sail 2y ago
  Don't most billionaires have at least some of their assets in the American financial ecosystem? If so then one could find buyers via extortion: first sanction them or freeze their assets, then make permanent residents and citizens exempt from sanctions.
  - thwg 2y ago
    Aha, you are right. This has always been the way he does business.
  - red-iron-pine 2y ago
    this assumes that trump's government would chase these billionaires to shake them down, and shake them down on behalf of the government. instead pay a one-time fee to the man himself and do whatever you want.
mamonster 2y ago
Attempting to take this seriously: If Trump undoes US sanctions and/or gets the Supreme Court to rule that OFAC sanctions cannot extend to permanent residents, then this would make a lot of money.
insane_dreamer 2y ago
Not the worst thing Trump has done, but it does make the US look a bit more like some mafia-style government that you expect from someplace like the DRC.
- thwg 2y ago
  Has always been like a mafia internationally tho.

34 points by vinnyglennon 2y ago

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

pmdulaney 2y ago

This strikes me as very un-American.

walls 2y ago
This is one of the most American things possible. Everything is officially for sale.

sss111 2y ago

This is going to replace the EB-5 which required a 800k investment, that you could get back with interest. With this, it seems like a 5 million usd donation to the US government. Which makes sense and puts us in-line with other countries that have "weaker" citizenships. Just makes me a little sad because I was saving up to 1 million to get the EB-5.

tim333 2y ago
They've been talking about getting rid of the EB-5 for years but it always seems to hang in there.

nothercastle 2y ago

Anyone donating 5 mil isn’t going to be a burden on the system but they might help loot it musk style

SlightlyLeftPad 2y ago
Would looting the system not be a burden?
- nothercastle 2y ago
  Most politicians don’t acknowledge that
  - SlightlyLeftPad 2y ago
    Politicians are also a burden

JumpinJack_Cash 2y ago

Why would anyone do this? With 5M you can either move to Thailand or Vietnam and live without working for the rest of your days. Or donate it to Trump and Musk and find yourself with zero dollars to your name and the right to be in a place where if you don't have money you are even more of a zero compared to other regular countries, matter of fact if in other countries people without money are zero, in the US they are 6 feet under (or on their way there given health policy)

sanswork 2y ago
Anyone paying $5m for a gold card will have a higher standard of living in the US than Thailand or Vietnam. Even if you make just a bit above the US average salary your life will be better in the US than Thailand at least. In Thailand from my experience living there it is great if you're broke/low income but actual luxuries are a premium to western countries. Why would you expect someone to be spending all their money on this? It's clearly for wealthy people. I'm Canadian/Australian so you can probably guess my opinions on Trump and the current US government but I don't have any problem with this type of program and most countries already have a similar one just at a lower price point(I think Canadas in like $2m in venture investing instead of a straight payment to the government but same difference).
- voidhorse 2y ago
  > Anyone paying $5m for a gold card will have a higher standard of living in the US than Thailand or Vietnam. not for long though, lol
  - sanswork 2y ago
    I have a feeling the QoL for the wealthy in America will stay pretty similar to today even if it drops off a cliff for everyone else
- lukas099 2y ago
  To me, the real luxury is labor, and I bet servants would be cheaper in Thailand than the US.

inverted_flag 2y ago

> Asked whether he would consider selling the cards to Russian oligarchs, Trump responded: “Yeah, possibly. I know some Russian oligarchs that are very nice people.”

bigfatkitten 2y ago

> Asked whether he would consider selling the cards to Russian oligarchs, Trump responded: “Yeah, possibly. I know some Russian oligarchs that are very nice people.” I think it's a given that none of the character assessments conducted for other visa applicants will apply in this case.

Terr_ 2y ago

> Trump said the sale of the gold cards will begin in about two weeks Where's the law from congress that authorized this new category? The EB-5 he's talking about replacing comes from the Immigration Act of 1990. The timeline suggests Trump is going to sell worthless crap to gullible victims again, and use his lawbreaking to tee up another kind of The President Is A Dictator assertion in the hopes the Supreme Court will endorse it. (The Constitution says Congress has to impeach the President to stop power-grabs, but too many Republicans want their guy to grab power.)

qbxk 2y ago

won't this result in millionaires losing jobs?

science4sail 2y ago
As a thought experiment, if one wanted to advantage labor over capital, then a durable way to do so would be to engineer a simultaneous labor shortage and a capital surplus. The amazing Silicon Valley employee perks of the 2010s were the product of such an environment. Labor shortages can be induced by cutting supply: the Black Death was a famous example of this. More modern ways to do so could be reducing the birthrate or deporting able-bodied, working-age immigrants. Capital surplus can occur if there is too much cash and not enough investment opportunities. Importing more rich people and printing money can accomplish the former. Low interest rates and technological stagnation can accomplish the latter. War is also an option: war profiteering is a poor investment since the losing side's investors often get their assets confiscated as loot or reparations. One risk of this approach is that retirement becomes near-impossible. This is because retirees are capital holders: either directly via defined-contribution pensions or indirectly via annuities (defined-benefit pensions). The only way to retire will be if one has kids (or at least younger friends) willing to support them. Another risk of this is that the capital class will try to defy economics by abolishing civil rights and re-instituting slavery or serfdom. After all, it worked for Constantine...
tim333 2y ago
Yes sadly the US millionaire positions will be filled by cut price immigrant millionaires.

Jerqfase 2y ago

Feels like a path for oligarchs to avoid sanctions. Passports are big business for the wealthy. I'm sure I'm wrong and I'd love to know why. Anyone smarter than me know?

Terr_ 2y ago
I guarantee a core pillar of their plan is asserting that El Presidente [0] may grant or revoke them on a whim. [0] Yes, I know this idiom is increasingly unfair to the rest of the Americas.

anovikov 2y ago

I wonder why anyone would sign up to pay US taxes regardless of their residence, if they have cash... Can't see it working. There are plenty of other places with good passports and countries to live that are either safer/more democratic, or alternatively, more free/lawless and yet welcoming to the rich. Doing business in the US does not require a passport.

tim333 2y ago
I was wondering if the gold card will come without the tax obligations of a green card. It could be quite successful if so. I looked at getting an EB-5 but was put off by being liable for tax even if I didn't move to the US and also being expected to move to the US as part of the deal.
- QQ00 2y ago
  It will not come without tax obligations. Taxing U.S. citizens globally is one of the most backward things ever, and yet the government has never gotten rid of it all these years. To the point, banks all over the world hate dealing with U.S. citizens who want to open accounts because of the amount of information the U.S. government expects the bank to hand over to them.

Ekaros 2y ago

If they managed to sell 8 million of these it would pay of the federal debt. Not actually unreasonable plan to fund it. Not sure if there would be that many takers...

science4sail 2y ago
Don't most billionaires have at least some of their assets in the American financial ecosystem? If so then one could find buyers via extortion: first sanction them or freeze their assets, then make permanent residents and citizens exempt from sanctions.
- thwg 2y ago
  Aha, you are right. This has always been the way he does business.
- red-iron-pine 2y ago
  this assumes that trump's government would chase these billionaires to shake them down, and shake them down on behalf of the government. instead pay a one-time fee to the man himself and do whatever you want.

mamonster 2y ago

Attempting to take this seriously: If Trump undoes US sanctions and/or gets the Supreme Court to rule that OFAC sanctions cannot extend to permanent residents, then this would make a lot of money.

insane_dreamer 2y ago

Not the worst thing Trump has done, but it does make the US look a bit more like some mafia-style government that you expect from someplace like the DRC.

thwg 2y ago
Has always been like a mafia internationally tho.