4 ms·

Feels more and more like we're at the end of an era when it comes to the internet.

by hexator 2y ago

mbostleman 2y ago
By Internet do you mean Western Civilization?
- DoingIsLearning 2y ago
  I was gonna say looking at world affairs, it's starting to feel like the end of the Westphalian system.
  - TeaBrain 2y ago
    Any pretense of the Westphalian system in most of Europe ended with the European Union.
    - Swenrekcah 2y ago
      Then how come the UK has left the European Union? This is a common misunderstanding, but a misunderstanding nonetheless. Any country in the EU has full sovereignty and chooses to exercise it by combining forces with other countries in order to strengthen their combined influence in the wider world.
      - TeaBrain 2y ago
        >Then how come the UK has left the European Union? Are you suggesting that if the European Union were post-Westphalian that the UK wouldn't be able to leave? Not sure how that follows. That the EU is a post-Westphalian system is not a new idea.
        Swenrekcah 2y ago
        fair point, I’m just a bit tired of people falsely claiming countries give up sovereignty by joining the EU. Thought you were making a point in that direction, but today we need to stay together and stay strong.
- notatty 2y ago
  [flagged]
kelnos 2y ago
How so? This is just the UK. While the UK really does want to enforce this globally, they really have no enforcement power against non-UK citizens who do not reside in the UK. Certainly it's possible (and perhaps likely!) that the EU and US will want to copycat this kind of law, but until that happens, I think your alarm is a bit of an overreaction.
- hexator 2y ago
  Similar laws are being written elsewhere, Section 230 may not last the next few years. It's not just the UK.
  - gotoeleven 2y ago
    Well the attacks on section 230 from the right are about removing censorship not adding censorship so I'm not sure section 230 is a good comparison.
    - hexator 2y ago
      You mean moderation. People are freaking out because they were banned from places for saying awful shit. Removing section 230 removes the right to moderation, which would kill the internet as we know it. It would become like cable internet. EFF summary on Section 230: https://www.eff.org/issues/cda230 https://www.eff.org/issues/cda230
      - throwaway48476 2y ago
        Moderation wouldn't disappear, it would just become controlled by the user.
        hexator 2y ago
        Yes, it would. Any site offering moderation capabilities of any kind would be open to legal attack. That is enough to make it infeasible for any smaller site to have moderation, unless they're big tech of course (which is why they're OK with this)
notatty 2y ago
[flagged]

Feels more and more like we're at the end of an era when it comes to the internet.

mbostleman 2y ago

By Internet do you mean Western Civilization?

DoingIsLearning 2y ago
I was gonna say looking at world affairs, it's starting to feel like the end of the Westphalian system.
- TeaBrain 2y ago
  Any pretense of the Westphalian system in most of Europe ended with the European Union.
  - Swenrekcah 2y ago
    Then how come the UK has left the European Union? This is a common misunderstanding, but a misunderstanding nonetheless. Any country in the EU has full sovereignty and chooses to exercise it by combining forces with other countries in order to strengthen their combined influence in the wider world.
    - TeaBrain 2y ago
      >Then how come the UK has left the European Union? Are you suggesting that if the European Union were post-Westphalian that the UK wouldn't be able to leave? Not sure how that follows. That the EU is a post-Westphalian system is not a new idea.
      - Swenrekcah 2y ago
        fair point, I’m just a bit tired of people falsely claiming countries give up sovereignty by joining the EU. Thought you were making a point in that direction, but today we need to stay together and stay strong.
notatty 2y ago
[flagged]

kelnos 2y ago

How so? This is just the UK. While the UK really does want to enforce this globally, they really have no enforcement power against non-UK citizens who do not reside in the UK. Certainly it's possible (and perhaps likely!) that the EU and US will want to copycat this kind of law, but until that happens, I think your alarm is a bit of an overreaction.

hexator 2y ago
Similar laws are being written elsewhere, Section 230 may not last the next few years. It's not just the UK.
- gotoeleven 2y ago
  Well the attacks on section 230 from the right are about removing censorship not adding censorship so I'm not sure section 230 is a good comparison.
  - hexator 2y ago
    You mean moderation. People are freaking out because they were banned from places for saying awful shit. Removing section 230 removes the right to moderation, which would kill the internet as we know it. It would become like cable internet. EFF summary on Section 230: https://www.eff.org/issues/cda230 https://www.eff.org/issues/cda230
    - throwaway48476 2y ago
      Moderation wouldn't disappear, it would just become controlled by the user.
      - hexator 2y ago
        Yes, it would. Any site offering moderation capabilities of any kind would be open to legal attack. That is enough to make it infeasible for any smaller site to have moderation, unless they're big tech of course (which is why they're OK with this)

notatty 2y ago

[flagged]