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Most of the world switched to phonetic scripts a long time ago. That's be because they're strictly superior to pictograms. Icons are optional. Text is required.
by Hizonner 2y ago
Most of the world switched to phonetic scripts a long time ago. That's be because they're strictly superior to pictograms. Icons are optional. Text is required. Sorry if you have to translate it.
- greggsy 2y agoAlso, text is literally just funny shapes that are used to communicate.
- echoangle 2y agoHow are they strictly superior? Here are at least two reasons where icons are better: Speed of recognition and needed Space (especially width).
- DecentShoes 2y agoBut that's just not true. If I have to sit there trying to figure out what an icon means, that's not faster than just reading the word.
- echoangle 2y agoNot when you first open the program, but for advanced users, absolutely.
- wpm 2y agoHow and why would I become an advanced user of a program I can't figure out how to use because none of the buttons have labels? Pixelmator Pro shows you the names of the tool buttons, once, when you first launch the app. They disappear the moment you click a button. Nice. a whole 10 seconds to memorize all two dozen of them. And they chose not to use the system tooltip on hover, so I have to wait for some humungous pictorial tooltip to load in when all I want to know is the goddamn hotkey.
- echoangle 2y agoHow does that matter for the point? You can make it a setting for the user or just always show both. I never said that programs should exclusively use icons. The initial claim was that text is strictly superior to icons, which means that icons have not a single thing they’re better at then text. That’s just plainly false.
- layer8 2y agoThat’s rarely the case, in my experience, especially when there are a dozen monochrome icons in a row. They just aren’t distinct or memorable enough. You learn their position after a while, but confirming the correct item by their pictogram remains slower than just reading a word or two, because the words are universal, whereas the pictograms are typically specific to the application.
- alexvitkov 2y agoKeyboard shortcuts are a feature for advanced users, not pictures.
- andybak 2y agoFor some definitions of "advanced". I use dozens of apps regularly enough to not be a beginner but not so much that I know their keyboard shortcuts. Icons have a role.
- echoangle 2y agoGood luck learning keyboard shortcuts for every feature of a CAD tool. I understand Boolean modifiers from symbols faster than I can read them, but I’m not going to memorize every shortcut for stuff like that.
- alexvitkov 2y agoThere's 3 boolean modifiers and they're used all the time, just learn the shortcuts.
- echoangle 2y agoIt was a simple example. Have you ever used CAD software? There are literally thousands of features, you have 0 chance of learning every shortcut
- crackalamoo 2y agoI think the commenter you're replying to might have been referring to pictograms like many Chinese characters, not icons that you have to figure out. Or maybe not
- thaumasiotes 2y ago> pictograms like many Chinese characters A handful of Chinese characters are pictograms. As far as I recall, it is by far the smallest class of characters, and all of them, including the ones that started as pictograms, are treated by modern readers as phonetic indicators. Compare e.g. 象 to https://img.zdic.net/zy/jinwen/33_E87E.svg https://img.zdic.net/zy/jinwen/33_E87E.svg . They are the same character. Does that help you if you're looking at 象?
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- LocalH 2y agoI glance at a word and instantly (other than eye-to-brain processing delay) know what the word is. Icons that aren't the absolute most common take longer for me to parse.
- echoangle 2y agoAs long as some people are different that you, it’s still not strictly superior though. If some people are better with icons, you still have to do a tradeoff.
- LocalH 2y agoIt's almost like options are good. Let people have the option of icon-dominant or text-dominant UIs. But we all know many modern designers don't know the value of giving the user choice (or aren't given the agency to do so by their employers).
- crazygringo 2y agoThis is obviously not true. You don't need a label to say "Close" next to the "X" on your window. Or "Play" next to a right-facing triangle in your media player. Or the word "Search" next to a text box with a magnifying glass in it. We have certain "pictograms" that are just as widely understood as letters themselves. There is a spectrum from widely-understood symbols that don't need labels, to totally ambiguous/confusing/custom symbols that are helped greatly by labels. That said, I agree with the article that right now, a lot of apps could benefit from more labels rather than less.
- cyberax 2y ago> Or "Play" next to a right-facing triangle in your media player. That's a good example. I love text buttons because they are _larger_. > Or the word "Search" next to a text box with a magnifying glass in it. And here I _definitely_ disagree. I hate the search interfaces that are hidden behind a small icon somewhere.
- danielmarkbruce 2y agoTry to keep going though. Close. Play. Search. Pause. Stop. Fast forward. I'm guessing you can name a few more, and you might get a group of people to agree about 15 are super obvious and generally accepted. It's a tiny number.
- mrandish 2y agoI agree. Maybe I'd add the three horizontal line 'hamburger' for menu, folder, plus sign for 'create new" and directional arrows for back/forward. Maybe around a dozen all in but that's about it. Anything else should have words. Instead, I find myself trying to puzzle out what the hell some cryptic pictogram means, very frustrating. I also have really come to despise this trend of not visually signifying that an icon is a pressable button.
- tristramb 2y agoText is in a sense universal. At least within a particular language. It is not tied to a particular app or operating system. You can interpret it using the same mechanism that you use to interpret a book, the label of a bottle of wine, or the name on a gravestone.