4 ms·

Not gonna lie, I expected Apple to just kind of roll over and take the blow on this one. Interesting.

by LuciOfStars 2y ago

ben_w 2y ago
If any of the tech firms would resist, it would be Apple. I wasn't sure which way they'd go.
- scarface_74 2y ago
  While Apple especially under Tim Cook has done a lot questionable acquiescences under Cook for political expediences, they really didn’t have a choice here. It was the law. Now going back on Twitter to get in the good graces of President Musk and bringing TikTok back to the AppStore even though it is clearly against the law is different.
  - busymom0 2y ago
    > they really didn’t have a choice here They did have a choice. They could have said they will just get out of UK. That would have resulted in enough political turmoil in UK that their government would roll back this stupid law. Apple chickened out.
    - nobankai 2y ago
      Abandoning the UK market would hurt Apple more than it would hurt the UK. They are not a nation-state, Apple cannot wage diplomacy by threatening the government, they can only shoot their own foot off and say it was for the good of everyone. It would also partially validate the EU's regulation if they abandoned the UK but stayed in Europe. Apple very much doesn't want to feed either side a line.
      - busymom0 2y ago
        They could have started with not offering iCloud at all in UK. See how the blowback gets UK government to play ball and rollback the law. It may have hurt Apple in the short term but helped in the long term.
        thewebguyd 2y ago
        Then instead of mandating a backdoor to cloud data, the UK would just mandate backdoor access to the devices themselves, again forcing Apple's hand to either comply or GTFO, if they want it bad enough. We're losing the fight, and people are as apathetic as ever around privacy and security issues. Besides, never trust E2EE where you don't control both ends, but everyone here should have already known that.
    - scarface_74 2y ago
      If the UK wants the law to change, that’s up to the citizens of the UK. These are the people they elected. Don’t expect Apple to rescue the UK citizens to from their own choices.
      - busymom0 2y ago
        So, Apple will just give in to whoever is in power? They were not this soft in the San Bernardino case when FBI asked them to unlock a phone.
        scarface_74 2y ago
        The FBI doesn’t create laws. If Congress had passed a law then you would have a good analogy. Yes Apple follows the laws of every country it operates in just like any other company.
        ImJamal 2y ago
        There is an easy way to avoid having to follow laws of a country. Don't operate in that country.
        ben_w 2y ago
        If you don't want to be sued by activist investors, you need a good reason for that, and to be able to tell those investors what else you tried first before escalating that far if you eventually do pull out of a market.
        maeil 2y ago
        Apple absolutely does not follow the laws of every country it operates in, else TikTok wouldn't be back on the App Store.
        scarface_74 2y ago
        If only I had thought about that, I might have mentioned it. Oh wait https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43128684 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43128684 > Now going back on Twitter to get in the good graces of President Musk and bringing TikTok back to the AppStore even though it is clearly against the law is different.
    - kandesbunzler 2y ago
      [flagged]
madeofpalk 2y ago
They did. They've giving the UK Government a backdoor to all UK users. Apple lost here.
- balozi 2y ago
  Technically, they are leaving the front door open to all interested parties
- gormandizer 2y ago
  But Apple is not giving the UK Government anything they didn't already have. Now iCloud encryption will function in the UK just as it has for years (decades?) before the inception of ADP.
eugenekolo 2y ago
They heavily compete on "privacy" and "security", so I wouldn't expect them to. Additionally, once you start rolling with one government, every one wants you to do something for them while offering you no additional money for the work and weakening of your project.

Not gonna lie, I expected Apple to just kind of roll over and take the blow on this one. Interesting.

ben_w 2y ago

If any of the tech firms would resist, it would be Apple. I wasn't sure which way they'd go.

scarface_74 2y ago
While Apple especially under Tim Cook has done a lot questionable acquiescences under Cook for political expediences, they really didn’t have a choice here. It was the law. Now going back on Twitter to get in the good graces of President Musk and bringing TikTok back to the AppStore even though it is clearly against the law is different.
- busymom0 2y ago
  > they really didn’t have a choice here They did have a choice. They could have said they will just get out of UK. That would have resulted in enough political turmoil in UK that their government would roll back this stupid law. Apple chickened out.
  - nobankai 2y ago
    Abandoning the UK market would hurt Apple more than it would hurt the UK. They are not a nation-state, Apple cannot wage diplomacy by threatening the government, they can only shoot their own foot off and say it was for the good of everyone. It would also partially validate the EU's regulation if they abandoned the UK but stayed in Europe. Apple very much doesn't want to feed either side a line.
    - busymom0 2y ago
      They could have started with not offering iCloud at all in UK. See how the blowback gets UK government to play ball and rollback the law. It may have hurt Apple in the short term but helped in the long term.
      - thewebguyd 2y ago
        Then instead of mandating a backdoor to cloud data, the UK would just mandate backdoor access to the devices themselves, again forcing Apple's hand to either comply or GTFO, if they want it bad enough. We're losing the fight, and people are as apathetic as ever around privacy and security issues. Besides, never trust E2EE where you don't control both ends, but everyone here should have already known that.
  - scarface_74 2y ago
    If the UK wants the law to change, that’s up to the citizens of the UK. These are the people they elected. Don’t expect Apple to rescue the UK citizens to from their own choices.
    - busymom0 2y ago
      So, Apple will just give in to whoever is in power? They were not this soft in the San Bernardino case when FBI asked them to unlock a phone.
      - scarface_74 2y ago
        The FBI doesn’t create laws. If Congress had passed a law then you would have a good analogy. Yes Apple follows the laws of every country it operates in just like any other company.
        ImJamal 2y ago
        There is an easy way to avoid having to follow laws of a country. Don't operate in that country.
        ben_w 2y ago
        If you don't want to be sued by activist investors, you need a good reason for that, and to be able to tell those investors what else you tried first before escalating that far if you eventually do pull out of a market.
        maeil 2y ago
        Apple absolutely does not follow the laws of every country it operates in, else TikTok wouldn't be back on the App Store.
        scarface_74 2y ago
        If only I had thought about that, I might have mentioned it. Oh wait https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43128684 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43128684 > Now going back on Twitter to get in the good graces of President Musk and bringing TikTok back to the AppStore even though it is clearly against the law is different.
  - kandesbunzler 2y ago
    [flagged]

madeofpalk 2y ago

They did. They've giving the UK Government a backdoor to all UK users. Apple lost here.

balozi 2y ago
Technically, they are leaving the front door open to all interested parties
gormandizer 2y ago
But Apple is not giving the UK Government anything they didn't already have. Now iCloud encryption will function in the UK just as it has for years (decades?) before the inception of ADP.

eugenekolo 2y ago

They heavily compete on "privacy" and "security", so I wouldn't expect them to. Additionally, once you start rolling with one government, every one wants you to do something for them while offering you no additional money for the work and weakening of your project.