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I keep seeing this bits and pieces of this story pop up, does anyone have an ELI5 on what the Ziz cult is?
by aduffy 2y ago
I keep seeing this bits and pieces of this story pop up, does anyone have an ELI5 on what the Ziz cult is?
- throwcatowayne 2y agohttps://zizians.info/ https://zizians.info/
- emmelaich 2y agohttps://zizians.info/ https://zizians.info/ A warning about them, started over five years ago.
- decimalenough 2y agoThis Wiki article is badly named, but it's still the best ELI5 overview I've seen: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_David_Maland https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_David_Maland
- idlewords 2y agoHave either of you ever met a five year old?
- zozbot234 2y agoInteresting challenge: put all of this crazy information into a LLM prompt and ask it to explain everything as if to a real five year old. Maybe the newer "Deep research" models could do it. (See also https://xkcd.com/547/ https://xkcd.com/547/ of course.)
- computerthings 2y ago[flagged]
- nl 2y agoThis works of course. I asked chat GPT to "ELI5 this:" and pasted the text from https://maxread.substack.com/p/the-zizians-and-the-rationalist-death https://maxread.substack.com/p/the-zizians-and-the-rationali... This is what it created: A journalist wrote a long article about a weird, extreme group called the “Zizians.” They’re a mix of radical thinkers from the Rationalist movement—a community of people obsessed with using logic to solve big problems, like AI safety or moral philosophy. The Zizians, led by a person named Ziz, took these ideas to an extreme, combining them with unusual beliefs about morality, consciousness, and even Star Wars-like "Sith" philosophy. This group has been connected to multiple violent incidents, including murders and standoffs with police. Some of its members have been arrested, gone into hiding, or mysteriously died. The author explains that Rationalist groups, while not inherently violent, often attract highly analytical but socially disconnected people, making them vulnerable to cult-like thinking. The article also touches on how similar communities—like Effective Altruists and AI researchers—can sometimes create intense, insular environments that lead to extreme behavior. Basically, the Zizians are an example of how even smart, logical people can end up in very bizarre and dangerous places when they take ideas too far.
- spondylosaurus 2y agoI tried to write a genuine ELI5 explanation but I'm not sure it's possible unless you can assume a five-year-old knows what "philosophy" means, lol. You could say "a group of people think that being smart gives them magic powers, and that most people are evil zombies, but they think everyone in their own special group is good and can do whatever they want" but you lose a lot of nuance.
- chatmasta 2y agoYou lose a lot of nuance but that’s actually a pretty good explanation because it reveals the obvious parallels to nearly every mainstream religion throughout history.
- gosub100 2y agoAh, the "no true 5-year-old" argument...
- dahdum 2y ago> Have either of you ever met a five year old? I expect you are simply trolling, but for those that are not aware ELI5 has been defined in popular culture for well over a decade. https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/ https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/
- aaron695 2y ago[dead]
- lupusreal 2y ago> following a traffic stop, United States Border Patrol agent David Maland was killed in a shootout with Teresa Youngblut, who was wounded, and German national Ophelia Bauckholt, who also died in the shootout. The pair were traveling south on Interstate 91 in Coventry, Vermont, when they were pulled over as part of a traffic stop.[1] The two were put under "periodic surveillance" nearly one week before the shooting after they were reported to be armed and wearing all-black tactical clothing when checking in to their hotel. So these guys were being surveilled for being armed and decked out in tactical gear, so the authorities send in a lone traffic cop to pull them over? And predictably, the cop is killed. This isn't the first time I've heard of this kind of thing happening. That agent was basically set up to die, sacrificed like a pawn by his superiors playing a sick game of chess. The same thing happened to Darian Jarott, who was directed by his boss to arrest an armed and dangerous meth smuggler without being briefed of the danger, despite the fact that the danger was clearly understood by his superiors (a tactical team with medics were stationed nearby, but Jarott was sent in alone without knowledge of this.) The meth smuggler stepped out of his truck with an AR-15, taking Jarott completely by surprise, and murdered him. The meth smuggler was then chased down and killed by the other officers and agents.
- aerostable_slug 2y agoFor what purpose? Do you think that if the meth smuggler had been met by two or more officers he would have acted differently?
- lupusreal 2y ago[flagged]
- MichaelZuo 2y agoHow is this more plausible then any of the alternative explanations? e.g. the decision makers could be incompetent, they might not care that much, they had some other contradicting information not publicly revealed, etc…
- 2y ago
- catlover76 2y ago[dead]
- matthewdgreen 2y agoI don't love podcasts as a medium, but this one provides a good overview of the group. https://soundcloud.com/trueanonpod/zizian-murder-cult-1 https://soundcloud.com/trueanonpod/zizian-murder-cult-1
- spondylosaurus 2y agohttps://maxread.substack.com/p/the-zizians-and-the-rationalist-death https://maxread.substack.com/p/the-zizians-and-the-rationali... This is (1) a thorough write-up (2) with quotes/info multiple sources (3) whose author is NOT affiliated with any of these communities.
- ChrisArchitect 2y agohttps://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42897871 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42897871
- hoseja 2y agoThe last two paragraphs are really great.
- chatmasta 2y agoThe author may not be affiliated with the community, but he shares its affliction for longposting…
- nradov 2y agoReporter Andy Ngo has written several news articles about the the Ziz cult. https://thepostmillennial.com/andy-ngo-reports-trans-terror-trans-duo-revealed-as-suspects-in-killing-of-a-vermont-border-patrol-officer https://thepostmillennial.com/andy-ngo-reports-trans-terror-...
- KerrAvon 2y ago[flagged]
- unwise-exe 2y agoJust because he has, um, interesting ideas about what's worth covering or what lens to view things through, does not change that he does in fact report things and is therefore a reporter.
- m-ee 2y agoFor anyone unfamiliar with Andy Ngo he has an extreme far right bias and associates with the proud boys. Worth taking anything he says we a heap of salt.
- nradov 2y agoI'm unfamiliar with Andy Ngo's other activities, I just noticed that article and it seemed relevant. Is there anything factually incorrect in it?
- jjj123 2y agoIdk about factually incorrect, but the piece repeatedly misgenders the cultists, puts their names in scare quotes and favors their old names (and calls those old names their “real names”) and leads with “trans terror” in the headline. At every turn the purpose of the piece is demonize trans people, even if it got the facts right.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- akuchling 2y agoRebecca Watson wrote about them a week ago: https://skepchick.org/2025/02/the-rationalist-death-cult-spreading-mayhem/ https://skepchick.org/2025/02/the-rationalist-death-cult-spr...
- dullcrisp 2y agoThis one’s a good summary. Also why does it seem like everyone in California is in some cult?
- compiler-guy 2y agoThe availability heuristic. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Availability_heuristic https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Availability_heuristic
- mindslight 2y agoWinter is a hard reality check.
- hilux 2y agoWe're not ALL in a cult, nor are we vegan, transgender, or math geniuses. (That last one is a pity, since I was a math major.)
- kragen 2y agoSeems pretty confused. The maxread piece linked above and the Wikipedia article linked below are a lot better.
- templeOSdotcom 2y agoA possibly mentally ill trans woman with the moniker Ziz developed a following blogging and posting on philosophy groups. Ziz developed that following into a cult.
- droptablemain 2y agoTransgender vegan murderous AI apocalyptic cult?
- Viliam1234 2y agoAlso anarchists, I think. Having many adjectives is nice, because it allows everyone to make this story be about their favorite topic.