4 ms·

What a silly point of view. Instead what should they do? Post comments like this on HN? They clearly enjoy watching and digesting information from YouTube- the

What a silly point of view. Instead what should they do? Post comments like this on HN? They clearly enjoy watching and digesting information from YouTube- the biggest platform for this. But people need to make money from it hence the ailment these these plugins remedy

_Algernon_ 2y ago
>Instead what should they do? Read a book, touch grass, etc. >They clearly enjoy watching and digesting information from YouTube- the biggest platform for this. I'd probably enjoy heroin but I still choose not do take it because I know it's not good for me. What's your point?
- exe34 2y ago
  > Read a book I wanted to say something flippant, but dang with the halo on my shoulder urges me otherwise. so here goes: books can also full of filler crap and useless and outright wrong material. just because it's a different medium doesn't make it any better for wasting time. in fact, a bad book can waste weeks of your life whereas a bad video on YouTube could waste about 10 minutes. ultimately I approve of any tools that allow one to extract the information that they are after without paying the cost of giving more attention to somebody than they've earned.
  - _Algernon_ 2y ago
    Books at least go through a minimal amount of vetting before they are published, and there are meaningful differences between forms of media. As McLuhan wrote: "The medium is the message".
    - IshKebab 2y ago
      Maybe in the 1900s. Not any more
    - Tuna-Fish 2y ago
      Lol, no they don't. If you have a pdf with enough words in it, you can go from that to a published paperback on Amazon in 15 minutes.
      - _Algernon_ 2y ago
        Those aren't books. They're printed blogs you pay for. Every book can be published as a pdf. That doesn't mean that every pdf is a book.
        satvikpendem 2y ago
        What a textbook (sorry, printed blog) example of a No True Scotsman.
        shkkmo 2y ago
        > Those aren't books. They're printed blogs you pay for. If you are going to make an outlandish claim like this, at least try to post some criteria to defend. Not doing so has led to you not realizing that you can't without also excluding works of classical literature like Sense & Sensibility (which was self-published by Jane Austin). There's also more direct problems with the arbitary line you are trying to draw, like best-selling book The Martian, which was originally published as a blog, then self-published as an e-book, then officially published as a book by a major publisher.
        smsm42 2y ago
        No true Scottsman!
        _Algernon_ 2y ago
        Actually its implication: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Implication https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Implication
        abecedarius 2y ago
        1. Some blogs are better than most books. 2. Some carefully-written ebooks now are self-published, and I don't care if their cover design and promotion campaign aren't as professional.
    - exe34 2y ago
      so if they're good, they're books. if not, they're not _really_ books.
  - kragen 2y ago
    Being a different medium does in fact make it much better for wasting time. Skipping a paragraph in a book takes 100 milliseconds. Referring back to a previous paragraph to understand a seeming contradiction does too. Pausing a book requires no effort, and no effort to return to the place where you were. Books can be excerpted and quoted, not just in other books, but also in conversation or in videos, in a way that videos just can't. (Talking-head filler scripts can be quoted that way, but the video can only be quoted in video or still images.) Errata sheets, errata websites, and later editions of books can correct errors in earlier editions. Books are much smaller and therefore easier to archive than videos, making them less likely to get lost. Neil Postman's Amusing Ourselves To Death is an extended and very persuasive reflection on precisely this difference in the tendencies of these two media, although particularly attuned to the form of video that was popular at the time, TV, which had commercials and didn't even have pause and rewind.
    - exe34 2y ago
      somehow I doubt that the person I was replying to would consider ebooks as a book. videos can be viewed in double speed, and they can be rewound. they can be watched over and over if needed. they can describe/demonstrate information in ways that books can only project into 2 dimensions. a picture is worth a thousand words - well imagine 24 of those per second. certainly with STEM subjects, nothing beats a good animation. even for things like history/geography, I find animations and progressive disclosure to be much more engaging and easier to remember than dry words on a page.
- pinoy420 2y ago
  “Touch grass” This turn of phrase says everything to be honest.
- jasode 2y ago
  >Read a book, touch grass, etc. There's a ton of useful information that's only available in Youtube videos and not books such as DIY tutorials, repairs, etc. Unfortunately, many helpful videos also include useless fluff. E.g. a "good" 10 minute video on how to disassemble a Samsung dryer to replace the heating element also has 2 extra minutes of "click my link to Nord VPN" and "please smash that Like button and subscribe". Therefore, tools using AI to remove the extra time-wasting fluff can help. There is no book in the public library or Amazon that will show the tricky steps to repair a Samsung dryer. It's Youtube videos uploaded by random people that has information like that. My friend learned how to use her new Apple Watch by watching Youtube videos. Yes, there's official Apple documentation but it's hard to learn from a wall of text with static screen shots. In contrast, watching youtubers do live demonstrations with their fingers manipulating the screen accompanied by voiceover narration is easier to understand. EDIT reply to: >When you've saved "years of watching" by using sponsorblock and 2x speed, that's not how you use YT. Sponsorblock saves 25% at most. Your math is incomplete in your characterization of the gp you replied to because he also mentioned "DeArrow (de-clickbaits thumbnails and titles). That tool saves 100% of the watch time when the re-titled videos instantly informs him he can totally skip it.
  - _Algernon_ 2y ago
    When you've saved "years of watching" by using sponsorblock and 2x speed, that's not how you use YT. Sponsorblock saves 25% at most. To be clear, I am not saying that youtube has no use, but the commenter I originally responded to is clearly in excess of whatever that reasonable level is.
    - satvikpendem 2y ago
      How exactly does one "use YouTube," in your opinion then? You also forgot the effects of the other extensions than just SponsorBlock, even 2x speed (I watch at higher than that usually) saves 50% immediately. You presume I don't also do those things you listed, I now have more time to do them because of the time saved, not less.
      - 2y ago

_Algernon_ 2y ago

>Instead what should they do? Read a book, touch grass, etc. >They clearly enjoy watching and digesting information from YouTube- the biggest platform for this. I'd probably enjoy heroin but I still choose not do take it because I know it's not good for me. What's your point?

exe34 2y ago
> Read a book I wanted to say something flippant, but dang with the halo on my shoulder urges me otherwise. so here goes: books can also full of filler crap and useless and outright wrong material. just because it's a different medium doesn't make it any better for wasting time. in fact, a bad book can waste weeks of your life whereas a bad video on YouTube could waste about 10 minutes. ultimately I approve of any tools that allow one to extract the information that they are after without paying the cost of giving more attention to somebody than they've earned.
- _Algernon_ 2y ago
  Books at least go through a minimal amount of vetting before they are published, and there are meaningful differences between forms of media. As McLuhan wrote: "The medium is the message".
  - IshKebab 2y ago
    Maybe in the 1900s. Not any more
  - Tuna-Fish 2y ago
    Lol, no they don't. If you have a pdf with enough words in it, you can go from that to a published paperback on Amazon in 15 minutes.
    - _Algernon_ 2y ago
      Those aren't books. They're printed blogs you pay for. Every book can be published as a pdf. That doesn't mean that every pdf is a book.
      - satvikpendem 2y ago
        What a textbook (sorry, printed blog) example of a No True Scotsman.
      - shkkmo 2y ago
        > Those aren't books. They're printed blogs you pay for. If you are going to make an outlandish claim like this, at least try to post some criteria to defend. Not doing so has led to you not realizing that you can't without also excluding works of classical literature like Sense & Sensibility (which was self-published by Jane Austin). There's also more direct problems with the arbitary line you are trying to draw, like best-selling book The Martian, which was originally published as a blog, then self-published as an e-book, then officially published as a book by a major publisher.
      - smsm42 2y ago
        No true Scottsman!
        _Algernon_ 2y ago
        Actually its implication: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Implication https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Implication
      - abecedarius 2y ago
        1. Some blogs are better than most books. 2. Some carefully-written ebooks now are self-published, and I don't care if their cover design and promotion campaign aren't as professional.
  - exe34 2y ago
    so if they're good, they're books. if not, they're not _really_ books.
- kragen 2y ago
  Being a different medium does in fact make it much better for wasting time. Skipping a paragraph in a book takes 100 milliseconds. Referring back to a previous paragraph to understand a seeming contradiction does too. Pausing a book requires no effort, and no effort to return to the place where you were. Books can be excerpted and quoted, not just in other books, but also in conversation or in videos, in a way that videos just can't. (Talking-head filler scripts can be quoted that way, but the video can only be quoted in video or still images.) Errata sheets, errata websites, and later editions of books can correct errors in earlier editions. Books are much smaller and therefore easier to archive than videos, making them less likely to get lost. Neil Postman's Amusing Ourselves To Death is an extended and very persuasive reflection on precisely this difference in the tendencies of these two media, although particularly attuned to the form of video that was popular at the time, TV, which had commercials and didn't even have pause and rewind.
  - exe34 2y ago
    somehow I doubt that the person I was replying to would consider ebooks as a book. videos can be viewed in double speed, and they can be rewound. they can be watched over and over if needed. they can describe/demonstrate information in ways that books can only project into 2 dimensions. a picture is worth a thousand words - well imagine 24 of those per second. certainly with STEM subjects, nothing beats a good animation. even for things like history/geography, I find animations and progressive disclosure to be much more engaging and easier to remember than dry words on a page.
pinoy420 2y ago
“Touch grass” This turn of phrase says everything to be honest.
jasode 2y ago
>Read a book, touch grass, etc. There's a ton of useful information that's only available in Youtube videos and not books such as DIY tutorials, repairs, etc. Unfortunately, many helpful videos also include useless fluff. E.g. a "good" 10 minute video on how to disassemble a Samsung dryer to replace the heating element also has 2 extra minutes of "click my link to Nord VPN" and "please smash that Like button and subscribe". Therefore, tools using AI to remove the extra time-wasting fluff can help. There is no book in the public library or Amazon that will show the tricky steps to repair a Samsung dryer. It's Youtube videos uploaded by random people that has information like that. My friend learned how to use her new Apple Watch by watching Youtube videos. Yes, there's official Apple documentation but it's hard to learn from a wall of text with static screen shots. In contrast, watching youtubers do live demonstrations with their fingers manipulating the screen accompanied by voiceover narration is easier to understand. EDIT reply to: >When you've saved "years of watching" by using sponsorblock and 2x speed, that's not how you use YT. Sponsorblock saves 25% at most. Your math is incomplete in your characterization of the gp you replied to because he also mentioned "DeArrow (de-clickbaits thumbnails and titles). That tool saves 100% of the watch time when the re-titled videos instantly informs him he can totally skip it.
- _Algernon_ 2y ago
  When you've saved "years of watching" by using sponsorblock and 2x speed, that's not how you use YT. Sponsorblock saves 25% at most. To be clear, I am not saying that youtube has no use, but the commenter I originally responded to is clearly in excess of whatever that reasonable level is.
  - satvikpendem 2y ago
    How exactly does one "use YouTube," in your opinion then? You also forgot the effects of the other extensions than just SponsorBlock, even 2x speed (I watch at higher than that usually) saves 50% immediately. You presume I don't also do those things you listed, I now have more time to do them because of the time saved, not less.
    - 2y ago