4 ms·

Ah, gotta hand it to Googlers, diligently organizing the world’s misinformation so long as the RSU handouts are generous.

unyttigfjelltol 2y ago
Google is not a nation state and does not dictate geographical boundaries or names. Are you saying Mexico's preferences are superior to those of the US? Or that Google may disregard orders of a democratically-elected leader? Map makers always are in a tough spot when nations disagree about the places and landforms they are depicting.
- bananapub 2y ago
  what on earth are you talking about? of course Google can call it whatever it wants > Google may disregard orders of a democratically-elected leader? what? random companies need to comply with press releases from politicians now? does this apply to all politicians and press releases? or just ones from people who have a proven record of asking for very stupid things and enacting very dumb punishments on people they feel haven't respected said stupid things?
  - unyttigfjelltol 2y ago
    > random companies need to comply with press releases from politicians now? You are misinformed. This was not a "press release", it was an executive order. [1] Google naturally has some expressive latitude, but that's constrained by legal, diplomatic, social, contractual and political considerations that all map makers have when they balance what they might personally feel is a nice boundary or place name, versus the legally-protected designations of sovereign nations and their governments. [1] https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/02/gulf-of-america-day-2025/ https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/02/gulf...
    - JohnFen 2y ago
      Executive orders only apply to the executive branch activities. They aren't law that everyone has to follow.
      - mr_mitm 2y ago
        There are many name disputes and even border disputes, just ask China about Taiwan. If I were Google, I wouldn't want to make that decision either. I'd show Chinese users the borders as defined by the Chinese government and other users whatever their government says is the border. That's what's happening here as well, and as dumb as I think this decision is, I think that's fine. I wouldn't want Google to be the final arbiter over names and borders. They should be as neutral as possible and get their data from official sources, and if they are in conflict, show users the result from their respective official source.
        RegnisGnaw 2y ago
        Same with Kashmir and Sea of Japan/East Sea.
        JohnFen 2y ago
        "As neutral as possible" would mean using both names, one in parentheses, for people in the US just as they are doing it for people in other nations. Google isn't taking a neutral stance here, they're choosing sides. I don't think this is the largest issue by a longshot. I'll keep calling it by its correct name no matter what Trump says. It's basically just Trump trolling. But Google, and other large corporations, are kowtowing and it's a very bad look.
        mr_mitm 2y ago
        They have a process for this and they're following it in this case just like in any other case where a country disagrees with international consensus: https://www.cnbc.com/2025/01/28/google-reclassifies-us-as-sensitive-country-like-china-russia-.html https://www.cnbc.com/2025/01/28/google-reclassifies-us-as-se...
- Gerardo1 2y ago
  > Or that Google may disregard orders of a democratically-elected leader? Yes because said democratically elected leader has absolutely no legal authority to tell a private business how they should label a geographic feature.
  - unyttigfjelltol 2y ago
    Mexico says it has the legal right to force Google to use it's preferred name for the part of the Gulf near Mexico.[1] Is your point simply that the US is more liberal and respectful of free speech than Mexico? [1] https://apnews.com/article/gulf-mexico-america-trump-sheinbaum-google-map-a1edcea55462b1df747295526787b959 https://apnews.com/article/gulf-mexico-america-trump-sheinba...
    - Gerardo1 2y ago
      My point was that you miss-represented the scenario: Google has not been ordered by the President to do anything, because the president doesn't have that authority. Your dishonest redirecting here is both transparent and insulting. Whether Mexico or the US is more "liberal and respectful of free speech" is neither relevant to this conversation or to my prior comment.
      - unyttigfjelltol 2y ago
        The reality is none of us can confidently declare things as unequivocally as you do. Google knows best what their risk profile is. Mexico threatens to sue and yet you are so confident the US could not do the same? Maybe there's a federal contract in the mix, or maybe users are federal contractors. Google is an institution, figuratively speaking. Maybe being a globally-significant provider, Google has seen the trajectory similar disputes in dredging quasi-legal cruft like official interference with their services. Maybe they recognize that once you abandon democratic decision-making, you are adrift, and that's not a place they wish to be.
        Gerardo1 2y ago

unyttigfjelltol 2y ago

Google is not a nation state and does not dictate geographical boundaries or names. Are you saying Mexico's preferences are superior to those of the US? Or that Google may disregard orders of a democratically-elected leader? Map makers always are in a tough spot when nations disagree about the places and landforms they are depicting.

bananapub 2y ago
what on earth are you talking about? of course Google can call it whatever it wants > Google may disregard orders of a democratically-elected leader? what? random companies need to comply with press releases from politicians now? does this apply to all politicians and press releases? or just ones from people who have a proven record of asking for very stupid things and enacting very dumb punishments on people they feel haven't respected said stupid things?
- unyttigfjelltol 2y ago
  > random companies need to comply with press releases from politicians now? You are misinformed. This was not a "press release", it was an executive order. [1] Google naturally has some expressive latitude, but that's constrained by legal, diplomatic, social, contractual and political considerations that all map makers have when they balance what they might personally feel is a nice boundary or place name, versus the legally-protected designations of sovereign nations and their governments. [1] https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/02/gulf-of-america-day-2025/ https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/02/gulf...
  - JohnFen 2y ago
    Executive orders only apply to the executive branch activities. They aren't law that everyone has to follow.
    - mr_mitm 2y ago
      There are many name disputes and even border disputes, just ask China about Taiwan. If I were Google, I wouldn't want to make that decision either. I'd show Chinese users the borders as defined by the Chinese government and other users whatever their government says is the border. That's what's happening here as well, and as dumb as I think this decision is, I think that's fine. I wouldn't want Google to be the final arbiter over names and borders. They should be as neutral as possible and get their data from official sources, and if they are in conflict, show users the result from their respective official source.
      - RegnisGnaw 2y ago
        Same with Kashmir and Sea of Japan/East Sea.
      - JohnFen 2y ago
        "As neutral as possible" would mean using both names, one in parentheses, for people in the US just as they are doing it for people in other nations. Google isn't taking a neutral stance here, they're choosing sides. I don't think this is the largest issue by a longshot. I'll keep calling it by its correct name no matter what Trump says. It's basically just Trump trolling. But Google, and other large corporations, are kowtowing and it's a very bad look.
        mr_mitm 2y ago
        They have a process for this and they're following it in this case just like in any other case where a country disagrees with international consensus: https://www.cnbc.com/2025/01/28/google-reclassifies-us-as-sensitive-country-like-china-russia-.html https://www.cnbc.com/2025/01/28/google-reclassifies-us-as-se...
Gerardo1 2y ago
> Or that Google may disregard orders of a democratically-elected leader? Yes because said democratically elected leader has absolutely no legal authority to tell a private business how they should label a geographic feature.
- unyttigfjelltol 2y ago
  Mexico says it has the legal right to force Google to use it's preferred name for the part of the Gulf near Mexico.[1] Is your point simply that the US is more liberal and respectful of free speech than Mexico? [1] https://apnews.com/article/gulf-mexico-america-trump-sheinbaum-google-map-a1edcea55462b1df747295526787b959 https://apnews.com/article/gulf-mexico-america-trump-sheinba...
  - Gerardo1 2y ago
    My point was that you miss-represented the scenario: Google has not been ordered by the President to do anything, because the president doesn't have that authority. Your dishonest redirecting here is both transparent and insulting. Whether Mexico or the US is more "liberal and respectful of free speech" is neither relevant to this conversation or to my prior comment.
    - unyttigfjelltol 2y ago
      The reality is none of us can confidently declare things as unequivocally as you do. Google knows best what their risk profile is. Mexico threatens to sue and yet you are so confident the US could not do the same? Maybe there's a federal contract in the mix, or maybe users are federal contractors. Google is an institution, figuratively speaking. Maybe being a globally-significant provider, Google has seen the trajectory similar disputes in dredging quasi-legal cruft like official interference with their services. Maybe they recognize that once you abandon democratic decision-making, you are adrift, and that's not a place they wish to be.
      - Gerardo1 2y ago