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I think it depends a bit on how you think about rehabilitation? Many believe incarcerated people should be given a chance to get their life back on track (a dif

by neom 2y ago

I think it depends a bit on how you think about rehabilitation? Many believe incarcerated people should be given a chance to get their life back on track (a difficult thing to do no matter what walk of life you come from), you may not like her methods, but she is certainly entitled to them.

4ndrewl 2y ago
She can absolutely do that without the need for obsequious front-page magazine spreads.
anovikov 2y ago
I know some people who went through incarceration. Their life lesson is: don't get caught. They come out of there just being better criminals, not better people.
- idiotsecant 2y ago
  Easy there. Anecdote != Data.
  - andsoitis 2y ago
    I agree that we should not be confident in anecdotes, but the statistics support the assertion for the US: The percentage of people who commit crimes again after release varies by state, time, and type of crime, but it's generally around 68% within three years. https://usafacts.org/articles/how-common-is-it-for-released-prisoners-to-re-offend/ https://usafacts.org/articles/how-common-is-it-for-released-...
    - anovikov 2y ago
      In general it would be stupid to expect things to be different. What kind of creature gets better because of being locked up for years with a bunch of other worse-than-average creatures of it's kind? Incarceration, if done properly, might make people less likely to reoffend simply because they get older and their health gets poorer, thus having less energy and becoming less of a nuisance. But that's not done because of insufficient prison capacity. They nearly all get out while still young enough to remain a massive problem.
cool_dude85 2y ago
That all may be so, but it's mighty coincidental that we are reminded of the need for rehabilitation and humane treatment and so on exactly when the convict happens to be famous and rich.
Avshalom 2y ago
Rehabilitation is about getting your life on a different track. I'm an abolitionist but a PR campaign isn't justice or rehabilitation either.
- neom 2y ago
  I typically try to avoid brining a monochromatic lens to situations that I believe are anything but (99% of situations generally). I could present all sorts of recidivism stats about violent criminals, including ones on the same life path, but differently, would it sway you? The only people I know personally who have been to jail are the people I've worked with via TLM, but I certainly don't profess to be an expert on the penal system in any way whatsoever. In matters of luck of life, it's quite easy to bring a reductionist or defeatist frame to the situation. (I think conversations like this are often worth having, I'm not trying to cause a flame war or anything like that.)
idiotsecant 2y ago
Somehow I think if someone has the resources to have the times and people write puff pieces about them, they probably don't need all that much of our help for rehabilitation. We're not talking about someone going back out on the streets here. The a is a powerful member of the capital class with connections and influence.

by neom 2y ago

4ndrewl 2y ago

She can absolutely do that without the need for obsequious front-page magazine spreads.

anovikov 2y ago

I know some people who went through incarceration. Their life lesson is: don't get caught. They come out of there just being better criminals, not better people.

idiotsecant 2y ago
Easy there. Anecdote != Data.
- andsoitis 2y ago
  I agree that we should not be confident in anecdotes, but the statistics support the assertion for the US: The percentage of people who commit crimes again after release varies by state, time, and type of crime, but it's generally around 68% within three years. https://usafacts.org/articles/how-common-is-it-for-released-prisoners-to-re-offend/ https://usafacts.org/articles/how-common-is-it-for-released-...
  - anovikov 2y ago
    In general it would be stupid to expect things to be different. What kind of creature gets better because of being locked up for years with a bunch of other worse-than-average creatures of it's kind? Incarceration, if done properly, might make people less likely to reoffend simply because they get older and their health gets poorer, thus having less energy and becoming less of a nuisance. But that's not done because of insufficient prison capacity. They nearly all get out while still young enough to remain a massive problem.

cool_dude85 2y ago

That all may be so, but it's mighty coincidental that we are reminded of the need for rehabilitation and humane treatment and so on exactly when the convict happens to be famous and rich.

Avshalom 2y ago

Rehabilitation is about getting your life on a different track. I'm an abolitionist but a PR campaign isn't justice or rehabilitation either.

neom 2y ago
I typically try to avoid brining a monochromatic lens to situations that I believe are anything but (99% of situations generally). I could present all sorts of recidivism stats about violent criminals, including ones on the same life path, but differently, would it sway you? The only people I know personally who have been to jail are the people I've worked with via TLM, but I certainly don't profess to be an expert on the penal system in any way whatsoever. In matters of luck of life, it's quite easy to bring a reductionist or defeatist frame to the situation. (I think conversations like this are often worth having, I'm not trying to cause a flame war or anything like that.)

idiotsecant 2y ago

Somehow I think if someone has the resources to have the times and people write puff pieces about them, they probably don't need all that much of our help for rehabilitation. We're not talking about someone going back out on the streets here. The a is a powerful member of the capital class with connections and influence.