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> is a good protection against authoritarianism, The increasing authoritarianism disagrees with you, and states can only ignore federal law to the extent that

> is a good protection against authoritarianism, The increasing authoritarianism disagrees with you, and states can only ignore federal law to the extent that the federal government allows it. There has been an increase in defiance recently, but nothing stops the feds from storming in and enforcing their laws beyond it not being seen as worth doing.

anovikov 2y ago
Because states have their own armies - the National Guard - it can be only done by military, not police, or even FBI/SWAT/whatever. That is, real military with tanks and fighter jets. A civil war. I seriously doubt military loyalty to Trump can be THAT high.
- autoexec 2y ago
  The National Guard is only authorized in the first place by the US constitution, and every member of the National Guard swears an oath to support and uphold the US constitution against all enemies (foreign and domestic), and also to obey the president of the US. The idea that the national guard will rise up against their own commander in chief is a fantasy. We've already seen how it plays out when states raise an army against the federal government and it doesn't work out very well for them. Even if (and it's a big if) the military didn't agree with Trump specifically, they'll still largely believe in the country and the constitution. If the federal government does something terrible and unconstitutional enough that it becomes necessary for states to attack the federal government they will have abandoned anything resembling 'state's rights' and moved into lawless/oath-breaking civil war.
  - archagon 2y ago
    States do have their own State Guard. The California State Guard, for example, has a size of... around 900? Oh boy. Something tells me we should be prioritizing expansion of this force.
  - jrs235 2y ago
    I agree. See my sister comment.
- ben_w 2y ago
  > I seriously doubt military loyalty to Trump can be THAT high. While the military have sworn an oath to the constitution first and only the person of president to the extent that orders are lawful, the most recent opinion poll I found suggests 2:1 support in favour of Trump in the closest proxy I have for active military — I'll have to let everyone else argue how good a proxy "veterans" is, as I'm neither military nor Ami: https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/09/30/military-veterans-remain-a-republican-group-backing-trump-over-harris-by-wide-margin/ https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/09/30/military-...
- jrs235 2y ago
  When things are moving fast and chaotic folks are more likely to just go along and not stick/speak up or out. Their self preservation instincts will commit atrocities on others rather than them be punished for disobeying orders. Military members can't just walk away without facing punishment in prison. They have to decide at what point the orders handed them are too unethical or unconstitutional. They will slowly be boiling frogs per se and rationalize what they are doing. Most likely don't have the immediate and timely access to personal lawyers to help them decide. And if they resist they will likely spend time in jail until adjudicated. The current head of the military seems like he will ignore legal advice from others and prevent soldiers from obtaining it. The current path really is setting us up to inflict severe pain on our neighbors and countrymen that don't go along to get along with what's happening or voice dissent with it. God help us all. https://lithub.com/resist-authoritarianism-by-refusing-to-obey-in-advance/ https://lithub.com/resist-authoritarianism-by-refusing-to-ob...

anovikov 2y ago

Because states have their own armies - the National Guard - it can be only done by military, not police, or even FBI/SWAT/whatever. That is, real military with tanks and fighter jets. A civil war. I seriously doubt military loyalty to Trump can be THAT high.

autoexec 2y ago
The National Guard is only authorized in the first place by the US constitution, and every member of the National Guard swears an oath to support and uphold the US constitution against all enemies (foreign and domestic), and also to obey the president of the US. The idea that the national guard will rise up against their own commander in chief is a fantasy. We've already seen how it plays out when states raise an army against the federal government and it doesn't work out very well for them. Even if (and it's a big if) the military didn't agree with Trump specifically, they'll still largely believe in the country and the constitution. If the federal government does something terrible and unconstitutional enough that it becomes necessary for states to attack the federal government they will have abandoned anything resembling 'state's rights' and moved into lawless/oath-breaking civil war.
- archagon 2y ago
  States do have their own State Guard. The California State Guard, for example, has a size of... around 900? Oh boy. Something tells me we should be prioritizing expansion of this force.
- jrs235 2y ago
  I agree. See my sister comment.
ben_w 2y ago
> I seriously doubt military loyalty to Trump can be THAT high. While the military have sworn an oath to the constitution first and only the person of president to the extent that orders are lawful, the most recent opinion poll I found suggests 2:1 support in favour of Trump in the closest proxy I have for active military — I'll have to let everyone else argue how good a proxy "veterans" is, as I'm neither military nor Ami: https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/09/30/military-veterans-remain-a-republican-group-backing-trump-over-harris-by-wide-margin/ https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/09/30/military-...
jrs235 2y ago
When things are moving fast and chaotic folks are more likely to just go along and not stick/speak up or out. Their self preservation instincts will commit atrocities on others rather than them be punished for disobeying orders. Military members can't just walk away without facing punishment in prison. They have to decide at what point the orders handed them are too unethical or unconstitutional. They will slowly be boiling frogs per se and rationalize what they are doing. Most likely don't have the immediate and timely access to personal lawyers to help them decide. And if they resist they will likely spend time in jail until adjudicated. The current head of the military seems like he will ignore legal advice from others and prevent soldiers from obtaining it. The current path really is setting us up to inflict severe pain on our neighbors and countrymen that don't go along to get along with what's happening or voice dissent with it. God help us all. https://lithub.com/resist-authoritarianism-by-refusing-to-obey-in-advance/ https://lithub.com/resist-authoritarianism-by-refusing-to-ob...