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Overt nazi salutes is one, but another is the intentional tinkering-with and partial dismantling of the US Government's system to dispense appropriated funds, a

Overt nazi salutes is one, but another is the intentional tinkering-with and partial dismantling of the US Government's system to dispense appropriated funds, and act that is blatantly illegal.

steveoscaro 2y ago
Edit
- krige 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - steveoscaro 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - archagon 2y ago
      AfD supporting, white supremacist amplifying dude from a deeply racist family being a closet Nazi is the least surprising thing imaginable.
- SimianSci 2y ago
  When people mistakenly make a gesture, they dont do it once more exactly the same. And when people point out that they made this gesture their answer is usually not to crack jokes about how they made a Nazi salute in response. We can maybe disagree about WHY he did it, there's room to discuss if it was genuinely a white nationalism thing or if he was just being an edgelord. But it WAS a nazi salute and denying this is disingenuous.
  - watwut 2y ago
    > it was genuinely a white nationalism thing or if he was just being an edgelord. Can we admit to ourselves that most edgelords are actually people infatuated with exact same movements and value systems? Literally all edgelords get angry and strongly dislike anyone left leaning. For example, you do not see them harassing right wing, but you do see them harassing perceived sjws. Somehow, there is no such thing as left wing edge lord. And that is because when left wing people act badly, they are blamed as bad left wing people. Edgelord is just a way to not blame right wing people and attributing them benefit of the doubt never given to the center or to the left.
    - lewispollard 2y ago
      > Somehow, there is no such thing as left wing edge lord. I mean, I'm a pretty staunch socialist/commie and there are plenty of hard-left edgelords out there "joking" about gulags and executing academics and so on.
      - phillipcarter 2y ago
        Yeah, they exist. The big difference is that we don't accept their behavior, especially when in positions of power.
      - watwut 2y ago
        Yeah, but you call them "hard-left" and do not pretend they are not communists or Stalinists. Meanwhile, edgelord is consistently supposed to be someone did the nazi salute, but the gesture was supposed to be innocent and totally not a far right thing. You have put joking into quotes. Even in this comment, you are not trying to convince me that they are actually fine, that they are something less then Stalinists.
    - toasteros 2y ago
      > Somehow, there is no such thing as left wing edge lord. Your comment is absolutely correct; Musk and his ilk are just people who "joked around" on 4chan and essentially radicalised themselves doing it. HOWEVER left wing edgelords absolutely exist. Look up (at your peril) the phenomenon of "tankies". They're not your average communist, but rather apologists for Stalin's genocides. Maybe your comment is more about the terminology at play, but it's interesting to see that the left wing mirror image of the average 4chan poster absolutely exists.
      - watwut 2y ago
        > HOWEVER left wing edgelords absolutely exist. Look up (at your peril) the phenomenon of "tankies". They're not your average communist, but rather apologists for Stalin's genocides. But that is my point - tankie is someone who is a communist, hardcore pro-Stalin. There is no assumption that tankie is someone apolitical who is just joking around. There is no "he is just a tankie, doing things for fun, stop accusing him of being a communist". Meanwhile, edgelord is someone who is supposedly just joking. A fine guy who just happen to draw swastika to get a reaction. Someone who you should let say and do movement things, because "deep down they do not mean it". > there's room to discuss if it was genuinely a white nationalism thing or if he was just being an edgelord This is what I reacted to. You cant replace "edgelord" by "takie" and white nationalism by stalinism in that sentence. It wont work. The "there's room to discuss if it was genuinely a stalinist thing or if he was just being a tankie" does not work, because tankie is literally a stalinist . > Musk and his ilk are just people who "joked around" on 4chan and essentially radicalised themselves doing it. Or rather, the were attracted to 4chan because they had the same opinions and values as those people. They did not just joked around, it was what they believed and who they were. And while both center and left pretended they are just playing, they meant it and managed to radicalize other people too.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
romaaeterna 2y ago
[flagged]
- computerthings 2y ago
  > question your motivations/funding sources for the accusation That's the 1930s-1940s German ideological element. You're doing it right now.
  - romaaeterna 2y ago
    Questioning the motivations and funding of a biased source is more generally viewed to be a Journalism 101 thing than a 1930s-1940s German thing. Nor am I Elon Musk, which seems to be the subtext of this "you're doing it now" claim (one I find quite bizarre).
    - computerthings 2y ago
      That's not questioning as in asking, that's accusing someone of something nobody can disprove. And if every single person who doesn't see the Nazi salute acts this way, smearing those who do, that's kind of telling. Basically "because it's not a Nazi salute, you're just a far leftist foreign agent nonperson" -- okay? That really does prove the point, and being confused by that shows having read zero bookshelves about Nazi Germany. It's perfectly on point, that's exactly been the Nazi MO -- projection and the most insane accusations dropped casually, like "questioning the funding that would make someone say it's a Nazi salute". It's also been the MO of Stalinism and Maoism, and lots of cults, and thousands of other things. But he happened to do a Nazi salute, so hey. And in Germany there's mainly two main: people who are appalled by Musk's Nazi salute and Nazis who love it. Not to mention how Elon Musk mingles with Nazis, which he does, and that it happened during the inauguration of a president who said he could shoot people in broad daylight and his supporters wouldn't mind. There's plenty of context. If your goal post is 1920s to 1945 NSDAP then that means having learned nothing.
      - romaaeterna 2y ago
sneak 2y ago
I have no extremely strong pro- or anti- Musk feelings, but the ADL (who seem to me to be the experts on antisemitism) say that’s not what that was. https://x.com/ADL/status/1881474892022919403 https://x.com/ADL/status/1881474892022919403 There also doesn’t seem to be any corroborating data to suggest he’s a nazi. I’m all for calling a spade a spade if he is, but it seems that people are working backwards from the “I hate Musk” position rather than forwards from the facts.
- specproc 2y ago
  I don't think there's any real question as to what he's doing there. The ADL these days mainly exist to shout "antisemite" at anyone criticising Israel. Their giving him a pass was sickening, and undoubtedly related to Republican support of ethnic cleansing in Gaza. Other Jewish organisations have called it as the world has seen it. One organisation does not speak for a very diverse people. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/jan/26/elon-musk-far-right-antisemitism https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/jan/26/elon-musk...
- zwirbl 2y ago
  The 'awkward gesture' take is a fun one. "Sorry officer, I did not flip you off twice, that were both just very awkward gestures" There is tons of data on how Musk became a far right supporter and sympathizer, like his support of UK racists and the German far right. You seem to still use X, you could just scroll through his posts there and try to not ignore the evidence you see with your own eyes
  - try_the_bass 2y ago
    Have you considered that perhaps the increasing levels of vitriol and outright hatred directed at him by the left might have had something to do with his rightward trend? They seem pretty correlated. I struggle to see how doubling down on the hatred is going to convince anyone other than _already hateful_ people of the righteousness of your cause?
    - phillipcarter 2y ago
_DeadFred_ 2y ago
Musk just recently had to go tour Nazi death camps to do a PR tour after promoting Nazy theories on Twitter. The people on the tour with him said touring the camps had zero emotional impact on the guy.
- amelius 2y ago
  The guy is a psychopath, which is probably also why he's so good at doing business. He just doesn't care about other people's feelings. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopathy_in_the_workplace https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopathy_in_the_workplace > Hare further claims that the prevalence of psychopaths is higher in the business world than in the general population.

Overt nazi salutes is one, but another is the intentional tinkering-with and partial dismantling of the US Government's system to dispense appropriated funds, and act that is blatantly illegal.

steveoscaro 2y ago

Edit

krige 2y ago
[flagged]
- steveoscaro 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - archagon 2y ago
    AfD supporting, white supremacist amplifying dude from a deeply racist family being a closet Nazi is the least surprising thing imaginable.
SimianSci 2y ago
When people mistakenly make a gesture, they dont do it once more exactly the same. And when people point out that they made this gesture their answer is usually not to crack jokes about how they made a Nazi salute in response. We can maybe disagree about WHY he did it, there's room to discuss if it was genuinely a white nationalism thing or if he was just being an edgelord. But it WAS a nazi salute and denying this is disingenuous.
- watwut 2y ago
  > it was genuinely a white nationalism thing or if he was just being an edgelord. Can we admit to ourselves that most edgelords are actually people infatuated with exact same movements and value systems? Literally all edgelords get angry and strongly dislike anyone left leaning. For example, you do not see them harassing right wing, but you do see them harassing perceived sjws. Somehow, there is no such thing as left wing edge lord. And that is because when left wing people act badly, they are blamed as bad left wing people. Edgelord is just a way to not blame right wing people and attributing them benefit of the doubt never given to the center or to the left.
  - lewispollard 2y ago
    > Somehow, there is no such thing as left wing edge lord. I mean, I'm a pretty staunch socialist/commie and there are plenty of hard-left edgelords out there "joking" about gulags and executing academics and so on.
    - phillipcarter 2y ago
      Yeah, they exist. The big difference is that we don't accept their behavior, especially when in positions of power.
    - watwut 2y ago
      Yeah, but you call them "hard-left" and do not pretend they are not communists or Stalinists. Meanwhile, edgelord is consistently supposed to be someone did the nazi salute, but the gesture was supposed to be innocent and totally not a far right thing. You have put joking into quotes. Even in this comment, you are not trying to convince me that they are actually fine, that they are something less then Stalinists.
  - toasteros 2y ago
    > Somehow, there is no such thing as left wing edge lord. Your comment is absolutely correct; Musk and his ilk are just people who "joked around" on 4chan and essentially radicalised themselves doing it. HOWEVER left wing edgelords absolutely exist. Look up (at your peril) the phenomenon of "tankies". They're not your average communist, but rather apologists for Stalin's genocides. Maybe your comment is more about the terminology at play, but it's interesting to see that the left wing mirror image of the average 4chan poster absolutely exists.
    - watwut 2y ago
      > HOWEVER left wing edgelords absolutely exist. Look up (at your peril) the phenomenon of "tankies". They're not your average communist, but rather apologists for Stalin's genocides. But that is my point - tankie is someone who is a communist, hardcore pro-Stalin. There is no assumption that tankie is someone apolitical who is just joking around. There is no "he is just a tankie, doing things for fun, stop accusing him of being a communist". Meanwhile, edgelord is someone who is supposedly just joking. A fine guy who just happen to draw swastika to get a reaction. Someone who you should let say and do movement things, because "deep down they do not mean it". > there's room to discuss if it was genuinely a white nationalism thing or if he was just being an edgelord This is what I reacted to. You cant replace "edgelord" by "takie" and white nationalism by stalinism in that sentence. It wont work. The "there's room to discuss if it was genuinely a stalinist thing or if he was just being a tankie" does not work, because tankie is literally a stalinist . > Musk and his ilk are just people who "joked around" on 4chan and essentially radicalised themselves doing it. Or rather, the were attracted to 4chan because they had the same opinions and values as those people. They did not just joked around, it was what they believed and who they were. And while both center and left pretended they are just playing, they meant it and managed to radicalize other people too.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

romaaeterna 2y ago

[flagged]

computerthings 2y ago
> question your motivations/funding sources for the accusation That's the 1930s-1940s German ideological element. You're doing it right now.
- romaaeterna 2y ago
  Questioning the motivations and funding of a biased source is more generally viewed to be a Journalism 101 thing than a 1930s-1940s German thing. Nor am I Elon Musk, which seems to be the subtext of this "you're doing it now" claim (one I find quite bizarre).
  - computerthings 2y ago
    That's not questioning as in asking, that's accusing someone of something nobody can disprove. And if every single person who doesn't see the Nazi salute acts this way, smearing those who do, that's kind of telling. Basically "because it's not a Nazi salute, you're just a far leftist foreign agent nonperson" -- okay? That really does prove the point, and being confused by that shows having read zero bookshelves about Nazi Germany. It's perfectly on point, that's exactly been the Nazi MO -- projection and the most insane accusations dropped casually, like "questioning the funding that would make someone say it's a Nazi salute". It's also been the MO of Stalinism and Maoism, and lots of cults, and thousands of other things. But he happened to do a Nazi salute, so hey. And in Germany there's mainly two main: people who are appalled by Musk's Nazi salute and Nazis who love it. Not to mention how Elon Musk mingles with Nazis, which he does, and that it happened during the inauguration of a president who said he could shoot people in broad daylight and his supporters wouldn't mind. There's plenty of context. If your goal post is 1920s to 1945 NSDAP then that means having learned nothing.
    - romaaeterna 2y ago

sneak 2y ago

I have no extremely strong pro- or anti- Musk feelings, but the ADL (who seem to me to be the experts on antisemitism) say that’s not what that was. https://x.com/ADL/status/1881474892022919403 https://x.com/ADL/status/1881474892022919403 There also doesn’t seem to be any corroborating data to suggest he’s a nazi. I’m all for calling a spade a spade if he is, but it seems that people are working backwards from the “I hate Musk” position rather than forwards from the facts.

specproc 2y ago
I don't think there's any real question as to what he's doing there. The ADL these days mainly exist to shout "antisemite" at anyone criticising Israel. Their giving him a pass was sickening, and undoubtedly related to Republican support of ethnic cleansing in Gaza. Other Jewish organisations have called it as the world has seen it. One organisation does not speak for a very diverse people. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/jan/26/elon-musk-far-right-antisemitism https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/jan/26/elon-musk...
zwirbl 2y ago
The 'awkward gesture' take is a fun one. "Sorry officer, I did not flip you off twice, that were both just very awkward gestures" There is tons of data on how Musk became a far right supporter and sympathizer, like his support of UK racists and the German far right. You seem to still use X, you could just scroll through his posts there and try to not ignore the evidence you see with your own eyes
- try_the_bass 2y ago
  Have you considered that perhaps the increasing levels of vitriol and outright hatred directed at him by the left might have had something to do with his rightward trend? They seem pretty correlated. I struggle to see how doubling down on the hatred is going to convince anyone other than _already hateful_ people of the righteousness of your cause?
  - phillipcarter 2y ago

_DeadFred_ 2y ago

Musk just recently had to go tour Nazi death camps to do a PR tour after promoting Nazy theories on Twitter. The people on the tour with him said touring the camps had zero emotional impact on the guy.

amelius 2y ago
The guy is a psychopath, which is probably also why he's so good at doing business. He just doesn't care about other people's feelings. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopathy_in_the_workplace https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopathy_in_the_workplace > Hare further claims that the prevalence of psychopaths is higher in the business world than in the general population.