6 ms·

The person blaming his parents because they tried to do their job of, well, parenting a child with ADHD. I’ve read that psychotherapy is much more difficult wh

by hkpack 2y ago

The person blaming his parents because they tried to do their job of, well, parenting a child with ADHD. I’ve read that psychotherapy is much more difficult when there is no-one to blame. So it might help for him, until he will have his own kids with ADHD and fail in a completely opposite way. I would not recommend anyone to blame parents of neurodivergent kids, as it is a very difficult job to do right.

redundantly 2y ago
All three of my kids are neurodivergent. If they have suffered from my parenting, they are more than welcome to blame me. Sure, parenting kids with ADHD or Autism or whatever else is hard, but that doesn't make one a Saint and therefore unassailable. If comeuppance is due, it's due.
- hkpack 2y ago
  I agree, I mean that it is almost impossible not to fail at from the child’s perspective. I blame the structure of society for this. When kid wants to spend time with animals, friends and just be in nature - we can only offer more classes and screens.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - floydnoel 2y ago
    there are other options, though. most choose not to take the hard path of choosing them
    - fader 2y ago
      Imagine you're a 10 year old in a typical suburb in the US. There might be a pet dog or cat around if you're lucky, but nothing even at the level of a goat or chicken, let alone something wilder. Your nearest friend is two-three miles away. Not walkable at your age for sure. Maybe bikeable, but your parents watch Fox News and know that sex slavers from the city are on constant patrol for juicy morsels like you, so you stay in the house. (Even if your parents have a basic grasp of statistics, your neighbors don't and will call CPS before you make it a block from your door, if a "block" even existed for you.) Genuinely, what would you do in this situation? This is _normal_ for a depressingly huge number of children in the US. There's school and there's the video games in the basement. Adults can drive. There are no other options for kids.
      - floydnoel 2y ago
        what you are saying has nothing to do at all with my comment. the parents have a choice, but they choose not to take it (or pretend not to see it).
sibeliuss 2y ago
The point is: there isn't a "right" way. That's exactly what the author is trying to say. By failing to recognize the ways in which they were different, they forced a mode upon them and here we are. A whole medicalized generation addicted to stimulants trying to fit in where in past generations you had artists and rebels and seekers and every other kind of misfit that made life interesting and unique and challenging to the status quo.
- StefanBatory 2y ago
  I don't think you meant it but I don't like how you phrased it. That in the past if you were to have ADHD, you'd be an artist or a rebel and so on, implying that it is something cool. And that nowadays it's just addiction to stimulants. I know of quite few colleagues and friends with ADHD who need stimulants to get anything done at all, even to get out from their bed. Who were treated unsuccessfully for anxiety, depression, when all their symptoms vanished after getting on meds. ADHD not to everyone is something quirky, to some people it can be utterly debilitating and devastating condition.
  - icnexbe7 2y ago
    [flagged]
  - sibeliuss 2y ago
    [flagged]
- jader201 2y ago
  > in past generations you had artists and rebels and seekers and every other kind of misfit that made life interesting and unique and challenging to the status quo I get what you’re saying, but parents of ADHD children are looking to help them become adults that can function in society and be independent without the struggles that are often accompanied with ADHD: addiction and self-destructive choices. A lot of the types of people that you mention — rebels, seekers, misfits — I feel are generally less happy individuals, and might chose a different path for themselves if they had the right opportunities and tools. Sure they might make life interesting for others, and maybe “interesting” is a word they might describe for their own life. And what often makes them “interesting”, looking from the outside, is that they are addicted and/or self-destructive. But are they ultimately happy, and is it the life they really wanted for themselves? That’s what parents struggle with. If they know their child will be happy with addiction, self-destruction, and being “interesting”, maybe it would be easier to not worry about or try to help them with their struggles with ADHD. But most parents think their children will want a different life, and so they also want that for them.
fisherjeff 2y ago
I would not recommend anyone to massively oversimplify and pass judgement on someone else’s life situation
fzeroracer 2y ago
From the article: > Instead, they relied on discipline as the only solution: withholding rights, denying privileges, banning books outside the curriculum because they "caused inattention," cutting off the internet, locking TV channels with passwords, and limiting socialization during study time. I'm perfectly inclined here to agree with the author in blaming the parents for putting the child in a borderline abusive environment because they were unable to look outside their own views for the sake of their child.
- baq 2y ago
  if the author really has ADHD, he's blind to half (or more) the things the parents did and especially to why they did them. not his choice, that's how ADHD works, doesn't make it any easier for anyone. you'd want to read parents' rebuttal, or at least commentary before judging them based on this post.
- treis 2y ago
  It really depends on how long study time is. That sounds like proper parenting so long as we're talking like an hour or two.
  - ghssds 2y ago
    Are you sure banning books outside the curriculum is proper parenting because what I'm reading is thought control.
    - TeMPOraL 2y ago
      I bet this wasn't denying access to books outside the curriculum because they're bad influence or something - it was merely about making sure they did also read the books assigned to them by the school. It actually looks like following standard productivity advice - eliminating distraction. The kid could go back to reading whatever after the required job was done.
  - graemep 2y ago
    Limiting socialisation for short time to focus is one thing, but a complete ban on reading outside the curriculum is hugely damaging to a child's education and happiness.
nijuashi 2y ago
[flagged]
bluesounddirect 2y ago
i would recommend two things for adhd . labels diagnosis lables are waste of time . if you are lucky enough to live somewhere where the schools will provide evidence based help amazing. if not and you have the double dose of adhd and dyslexia, do your own research find other people / families with similar issues . it's amazing to watch two kids with adhd realizing they actually like the other kid and they think like me.
- lsecondario 2y ago
  > diagnosis [...] are waste of time > schools will provide evidence based help In many places you need the former to get the latter.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
tremon 2y ago
The text doesn't read as if he's blaming his parents for anything. It seems to be a pretty neutral acknowledgement of past harms so he can move past them. Any "blame" you're reading into it is purely coming from your own perspective. He's pretty explicit about that: > Yet I forgave: I have other things to attend to if I truly want to get over what happened. I'd say his recovery/therapy is going pretty well. His perspective on the situation seems healthier than yours.
julianeon 2y ago
They f you up, your mum and dad. They may not mean to, but they do. They fill you with the faults they had, And add some extra just for you. But they were f'd up in their turn, By fools in old-style hats and coats, Who half the time were soppy-stern, And half at one another’s throats. Man hands on misery to man. It deepens like a coastal shelf. Get out as early as you can, And don’t have any kids yourself. - Philip Larkin, This Be The Verse
mnky9800n 2y ago
Blaming the parents doesn’t matter anyways. The author, and the rest of us, are adults and responsible for ourselves. If those problems we bear are a byproduct of our upbringing we still are the ones responsible for dealing with those problems. Sure it’s unfair but you can complain about it or learn to accept those experiences made you who you are.
notduncansmith 2y ago
I didn’t read the author as blaming, and I can relate to what they’re saying. It’s hard to speak about a childhood full of abuses that thought they had your best interests at heart. I was locked in my room for days on end (sometimes back-to-back stints for weeks), deprived of privileges/books/music, berated, demeaned, and ultimately gaslit, throughout my childhood, because my parents didn’t really understand ADHD (or that I had it). It created a pretty big mismatch between expectations and reality. As a kid, I resented them a lot for this. As an adult (and parent), I realize what it must have looked like to them and I can empathize without condoning their behavior. My performance is heavily bimodal: my adult ADHD assessment included scores in the 98th percentile and the 8th depending on the task. I also have an extremely wandering mind. Taken together, it seemed to my parents that I was a brilliant child who simply “refused to work hard”. This was not only toxic for my relationship with them, it poisoned my self-image and ability to relate to others for the first two decades of my life. Any resentment I might have over that is ultimately misplaced. They were loving and caring parents who missed the mark in a way that just so happened to fundamentally shape my childhood experience. ADHD wasn’t even understood the way it is now, so the most I could have hoped for in childhood was a prescription. Instead, I now make a point to be a parent who understands my own ADHD and my kid’s (which thankfully is pretty identical to mine). I help them use alarm clocks and timers like I do. I give them tools to understand and empathize with other people. I don’t treat dragging their feet on a task as disrespect or disinterest. I don’t get hurt when they lash out at me during a hard time. I’m not baffled or disgusted when their words reveal their underdeveloped empathy, and I try to accelerate that development. I just cannot agree more that it’s a difficult job to get right. All kids need structure and discipline, but the types and amounts can vary widely, even for the same kid across their stages of development. I’m so thankful for the research that has been done and resources that have been created since I was young; without that I would have been a lot more like my parents, and my kid would have barely had a chance. I also appreciate OP for sharing their experience with us. It’s not fun to do but it’s necessary for understanding to grow.
bbwbsb 2y ago
Making excuses for abuse is just as unhealthy as seeing it everywhere. I have been diagnosed both autistic and adhd and I experienced food insecurity despite living in a house with several balconies and a detached garage bigger than my friends' families' houses because my parents thought I would get over it and start going out to eat with them if they didn't bring me any food. I don't think they intended deliberately to harm me - or realize that me not going out to eat with them didn't mean there was enough food - but their authoritarian way of thinking did the harm nonetheless and it's a completely predictable outcome of such a way of thinking; so it's not "I didn't mean it" so much as "I don't want to think differently because I value my attachment to this mode of thinking more than the wellbeing of others; and when I harm them I'll say 'nothing could be done' because changing how I approach the problem isn't on the table". The healthiest thing most autistic/adhd people ever do is moving from 'I am sick' to 'the society I inhabit has an autoimmune disorder'.
pdpi 2y ago
It's a very difficult job to do right, but some of the ways you can get it wrong are pretty damn easy to avoid. Like, it should be obvious that you don't double down on strategies that produce no results other than distressing your kid.
al_borland 2y ago
I tried therapy for a couple years and it seemed like any time I brought up anything, I was being pushed to blame my dad. I felt like it was going to drive a wedge between us and my opinion of who he is today would be colored by who he was 30-40 years ago due to all this blame. He has changed a lot in those decades and I think his heart is in the right place, even if his actions sometimes call that into question. Keyed off by a YouTube video, I thought there is a good chance I have autism and ADHD. I brought this up to the therapist and it was mostly dismissed, while my dad shouldered the blame. I went and got tested anyway, and it turns out I was right, and stopped seeing the therapist. When I told my dad about my diagnosis he almost instantly started to question if he has the same things, and started opening up about how he feels, that he works hard to hide/mask. The more he’s looked into it, the more he believes this to be true. Looking back at where we had friction when I was a kid, they can pretty much all be explained by his own neurodivergence. Even issues today make significantly more sense. While it is easy to say the parents should have done this or that and we need to have empathy for these kids with “bad” parents. I think we also need to have empathy for these undiagnosed parents who were doing the best they could without any tools, support, or even knowledge of what was going on… as the diagnosis criteria was either non-existent or only recognized extreme cases.
PotatoPrime 2y ago
I think it's pretty common to blame your parents for something or other, no matter how you end up no? Of course there will be gaps where they failed you, they're human, expecting YOUR parents to be perfect is just unrealistic expectations. Seeing that failure as something more than just a part of life though is unrealistic. Yes, your parents failed you, in many ways, because they're human, and it would be impossible to not screw something up unless they're omniscient.

by hkpack 2y ago

redundantly 2y ago

All three of my kids are neurodivergent. If they have suffered from my parenting, they are more than welcome to blame me. Sure, parenting kids with ADHD or Autism or whatever else is hard, but that doesn't make one a Saint and therefore unassailable. If comeuppance is due, it's due.

hkpack 2y ago
I agree, I mean that it is almost impossible not to fail at from the child’s perspective. I blame the structure of society for this. When kid wants to spend time with animals, friends and just be in nature - we can only offer more classes and screens.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- floydnoel 2y ago
  there are other options, though. most choose not to take the hard path of choosing them
  - fader 2y ago
    Imagine you're a 10 year old in a typical suburb in the US. There might be a pet dog or cat around if you're lucky, but nothing even at the level of a goat or chicken, let alone something wilder. Your nearest friend is two-three miles away. Not walkable at your age for sure. Maybe bikeable, but your parents watch Fox News and know that sex slavers from the city are on constant patrol for juicy morsels like you, so you stay in the house. (Even if your parents have a basic grasp of statistics, your neighbors don't and will call CPS before you make it a block from your door, if a "block" even existed for you.) Genuinely, what would you do in this situation? This is _normal_ for a depressingly huge number of children in the US. There's school and there's the video games in the basement. Adults can drive. There are no other options for kids.
    - floydnoel 2y ago
      what you are saying has nothing to do at all with my comment. the parents have a choice, but they choose not to take it (or pretend not to see it).

sibeliuss 2y ago

The point is: there isn't a "right" way. That's exactly what the author is trying to say. By failing to recognize the ways in which they were different, they forced a mode upon them and here we are. A whole medicalized generation addicted to stimulants trying to fit in where in past generations you had artists and rebels and seekers and every other kind of misfit that made life interesting and unique and challenging to the status quo.

StefanBatory 2y ago
I don't think you meant it but I don't like how you phrased it. That in the past if you were to have ADHD, you'd be an artist or a rebel and so on, implying that it is something cool. And that nowadays it's just addiction to stimulants. I know of quite few colleagues and friends with ADHD who need stimulants to get anything done at all, even to get out from their bed. Who were treated unsuccessfully for anxiety, depression, when all their symptoms vanished after getting on meds. ADHD not to everyone is something quirky, to some people it can be utterly debilitating and devastating condition.
- icnexbe7 2y ago
  [flagged]
- sibeliuss 2y ago
  [flagged]
jader201 2y ago
> in past generations you had artists and rebels and seekers and every other kind of misfit that made life interesting and unique and challenging to the status quo I get what you’re saying, but parents of ADHD children are looking to help them become adults that can function in society and be independent without the struggles that are often accompanied with ADHD: addiction and self-destructive choices. A lot of the types of people that you mention — rebels, seekers, misfits — I feel are generally less happy individuals, and might chose a different path for themselves if they had the right opportunities and tools. Sure they might make life interesting for others, and maybe “interesting” is a word they might describe for their own life. And what often makes them “interesting”, looking from the outside, is that they are addicted and/or self-destructive. But are they ultimately happy, and is it the life they really wanted for themselves? That’s what parents struggle with. If they know their child will be happy with addiction, self-destruction, and being “interesting”, maybe it would be easier to not worry about or try to help them with their struggles with ADHD. But most parents think their children will want a different life, and so they also want that for them.

fisherjeff 2y ago

I would not recommend anyone to massively oversimplify and pass judgement on someone else’s life situation

fzeroracer 2y ago

From the article: > Instead, they relied on discipline as the only solution: withholding rights, denying privileges, banning books outside the curriculum because they "caused inattention," cutting off the internet, locking TV channels with passwords, and limiting socialization during study time. I'm perfectly inclined here to agree with the author in blaming the parents for putting the child in a borderline abusive environment because they were unable to look outside their own views for the sake of their child.

baq 2y ago
if the author really has ADHD, he's blind to half (or more) the things the parents did and especially to why they did them. not his choice, that's how ADHD works, doesn't make it any easier for anyone. you'd want to read parents' rebuttal, or at least commentary before judging them based on this post.
treis 2y ago
It really depends on how long study time is. That sounds like proper parenting so long as we're talking like an hour or two.
- ghssds 2y ago
  Are you sure banning books outside the curriculum is proper parenting because what I'm reading is thought control.
  - TeMPOraL 2y ago
    I bet this wasn't denying access to books outside the curriculum because they're bad influence or something - it was merely about making sure they did also read the books assigned to them by the school. It actually looks like following standard productivity advice - eliminating distraction. The kid could go back to reading whatever after the required job was done.
- graemep 2y ago
  Limiting socialisation for short time to focus is one thing, but a complete ban on reading outside the curriculum is hugely damaging to a child's education and happiness.

nijuashi 2y ago

[flagged]

bluesounddirect 2y ago

i would recommend two things for adhd . labels diagnosis lables are waste of time . if you are lucky enough to live somewhere where the schools will provide evidence based help amazing. if not and you have the double dose of adhd and dyslexia, do your own research find other people / families with similar issues . it's amazing to watch two kids with adhd realizing they actually like the other kid and they think like me.

lsecondario 2y ago
> diagnosis [...] are waste of time > schools will provide evidence based help In many places you need the former to get the latter.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

tremon 2y ago

The text doesn't read as if he's blaming his parents for anything. It seems to be a pretty neutral acknowledgement of past harms so he can move past them. Any "blame" you're reading into it is purely coming from your own perspective. He's pretty explicit about that: > Yet I forgave: I have other things to attend to if I truly want to get over what happened. I'd say his recovery/therapy is going pretty well. His perspective on the situation seems healthier than yours.

julianeon 2y ago

They f you up, your mum and dad. They may not mean to, but they do. They fill you with the faults they had, And add some extra just for you. But they were f'd up in their turn, By fools in old-style hats and coats, Who half the time were soppy-stern, And half at one another’s throats. Man hands on misery to man. It deepens like a coastal shelf. Get out as early as you can, And don’t have any kids yourself. - Philip Larkin, This Be The Verse

mnky9800n 2y ago

Blaming the parents doesn’t matter anyways. The author, and the rest of us, are adults and responsible for ourselves. If those problems we bear are a byproduct of our upbringing we still are the ones responsible for dealing with those problems. Sure it’s unfair but you can complain about it or learn to accept those experiences made you who you are.

notduncansmith 2y ago

I didn’t read the author as blaming, and I can relate to what they’re saying. It’s hard to speak about a childhood full of abuses that thought they had your best interests at heart. I was locked in my room for days on end (sometimes back-to-back stints for weeks), deprived of privileges/books/music, berated, demeaned, and ultimately gaslit, throughout my childhood, because my parents didn’t really understand ADHD (or that I had it). It created a pretty big mismatch between expectations and reality. As a kid, I resented them a lot for this. As an adult (and parent), I realize what it must have looked like to them and I can empathize without condoning their behavior. My performance is heavily bimodal: my adult ADHD assessment included scores in the 98th percentile and the 8th depending on the task. I also have an extremely wandering mind. Taken together, it seemed to my parents that I was a brilliant child who simply “refused to work hard”. This was not only toxic for my relationship with them, it poisoned my self-image and ability to relate to others for the first two decades of my life. Any resentment I might have over that is ultimately misplaced. They were loving and caring parents who missed the mark in a way that just so happened to fundamentally shape my childhood experience. ADHD wasn’t even understood the way it is now, so the most I could have hoped for in childhood was a prescription. Instead, I now make a point to be a parent who understands my own ADHD and my kid’s (which thankfully is pretty identical to mine). I help them use alarm clocks and timers like I do. I give them tools to understand and empathize with other people. I don’t treat dragging their feet on a task as disrespect or disinterest. I don’t get hurt when they lash out at me during a hard time. I’m not baffled or disgusted when their words reveal their underdeveloped empathy, and I try to accelerate that development. I just cannot agree more that it’s a difficult job to get right. All kids need structure and discipline, but the types and amounts can vary widely, even for the same kid across their stages of development. I’m so thankful for the research that has been done and resources that have been created since I was young; without that I would have been a lot more like my parents, and my kid would have barely had a chance. I also appreciate OP for sharing their experience with us. It’s not fun to do but it’s necessary for understanding to grow.

bbwbsb 2y ago

Making excuses for abuse is just as unhealthy as seeing it everywhere. I have been diagnosed both autistic and adhd and I experienced food insecurity despite living in a house with several balconies and a detached garage bigger than my friends' families' houses because my parents thought I would get over it and start going out to eat with them if they didn't bring me any food. I don't think they intended deliberately to harm me - or realize that me not going out to eat with them didn't mean there was enough food - but their authoritarian way of thinking did the harm nonetheless and it's a completely predictable outcome of such a way of thinking; so it's not "I didn't mean it" so much as "I don't want to think differently because I value my attachment to this mode of thinking more than the wellbeing of others; and when I harm them I'll say 'nothing could be done' because changing how I approach the problem isn't on the table". The healthiest thing most autistic/adhd people ever do is moving from 'I am sick' to 'the society I inhabit has an autoimmune disorder'.

pdpi 2y ago

It's a very difficult job to do right, but some of the ways you can get it wrong are pretty damn easy to avoid. Like, it should be obvious that you don't double down on strategies that produce no results other than distressing your kid.

al_borland 2y ago

I tried therapy for a couple years and it seemed like any time I brought up anything, I was being pushed to blame my dad. I felt like it was going to drive a wedge between us and my opinion of who he is today would be colored by who he was 30-40 years ago due to all this blame. He has changed a lot in those decades and I think his heart is in the right place, even if his actions sometimes call that into question. Keyed off by a YouTube video, I thought there is a good chance I have autism and ADHD. I brought this up to the therapist and it was mostly dismissed, while my dad shouldered the blame. I went and got tested anyway, and it turns out I was right, and stopped seeing the therapist. When I told my dad about my diagnosis he almost instantly started to question if he has the same things, and started opening up about how he feels, that he works hard to hide/mask. The more he’s looked into it, the more he believes this to be true. Looking back at where we had friction when I was a kid, they can pretty much all be explained by his own neurodivergence. Even issues today make significantly more sense. While it is easy to say the parents should have done this or that and we need to have empathy for these kids with “bad” parents. I think we also need to have empathy for these undiagnosed parents who were doing the best they could without any tools, support, or even knowledge of what was going on… as the diagnosis criteria was either non-existent or only recognized extreme cases.

PotatoPrime 2y ago

I think it's pretty common to blame your parents for something or other, no matter how you end up no? Of course there will be gaps where they failed you, they're human, expecting YOUR parents to be perfect is just unrealistic expectations. Seeing that failure as something more than just a part of life though is unrealistic. Yes, your parents failed you, in many ways, because they're human, and it would be impossible to not screw something up unless they're omniscient.