6 ms·
I wonder if we’d do better in discourse to stop pointing at an “administration.” It is a reflection of what a plurality, often majority, of people want.
by Waterluvian 2y ago
I wonder if we’d do better in discourse to stop pointing at an “administration.” It is a reflection of what a plurality, often majority, of people want.
- TylerE 2y agoLess than 31% of people voted for this administration. So no, it isn't.
- lynndotpy 2y ago[flagged]
- klipt 2y ago> the people have no power now There's always the midterms. Politicians shouldn't get too complacent if their party screws up.
- llamaimperative 2y agoDefinitely, which is why it's important to identify when politicians put the American public at risk like this. The connections between random high-level government actions don't easily map to real world outcomes for most people.
- lynndotpy 2y agoFor sure. What I meant to articulate was that the admin is the only one it makes sense to point to. Saying "the electorate is stupid!" has no utility other than catharsis, though.
- lazyasciiart 2y agoWhat else are you trying to say with “not in a position to clearly anticipate the ramifications”?
- johnnyanmac 2y agoMore accurate to say "people are selfish" if you want slightly less charged language. The common sentiment I hear is "I was doing better in 2020 than I was in 2024" and that was all the impotous to make people vote "not Biden". That mindset makes sense on a surface level. So it's not stupidity. But the lack of introspection on if Biden made things worse or simply stopped things from getting much much worse was definitely not taken into account. I'd personally call it stupidity. But it doesn't mean people are stupid overall.
- lynndotpy 2y agoI think it's incorrect to say "this is what the plurality wanted". I think very few, if any, Trump voters thought "Trump will be worse for public health and tuberculosis is something I want more of in America."
- Dalewyn 2y ago>I think it's fair to say a lot of Trump's apologists and defenders really did not understand the ramifications of his first presidency, and are not in a position to clearly anticipate the ramifications of his second presidency. Speaking as one Trump voter among many others, I knew exactly what he accomplished in his first term and what a hypothetical second term could look like. I also understood what his campaign platform and promises were and by and large I support them, including significantly reducing the federal government overall across the board. What we are seeing now with January 6 and pro-life pardons among other pardons, the new United States DOGE Service, exits from Paris Agreement and WHO, mass deportations of illegal aliens and securing of the southern border, tariffs on imports and especially on countries who aren't amicable, removal of DEI and other equity-based programmes from the federal government with extreme prejudice, among many many other policies and mandates are all things I expected and wanted to see when I voted for Trump. No doubt there are voters who voted Trump simply along party lines or other reasons, but just as much are voters who gave the election some thought and voted Trump. If you don't agree with me then that's unfortunate, but my vote isn't yours.
- dr_kiszonka 2y agoIs there anything Trump is doing that you do not approve of or would prefer was done in a different fashion? (Just curious, not trying to argue.)
- Dalewyn 2y agoI disagree in part with Trump's idea of Palestinians moving out of Gaza to Egypt and Jordan, not the least because it's violence incarnate. It's akin to the Trail of Tears[1] which was one of the most shameful bits of our history. Now, why do I say in part? Because I am also appreciative of the sad reality that peace in the Holy Land simply is not possible with more than one sovereign state in it. It simply isn't, there are so many peoples who would kill and die over that piece of land that any multi-state arrangement is practically impossible. I don't care if it ends up being Israel or Palestine or some other country or entity ultimately in charge of the Holy Land, but it's inevitably going to be one and the path to get there will not be pretty. I also find Trump's executive order on delaying the banning of TikTok legally (IANAL) dubious. His reasoning is that his administration hasn't had enough time to understand it and thus sufficiently execute the law as written, but the law doesn't provide for such an out. The courts can have their say if it comes to that. As a Japanese(-American), Trump's seemingly apathetic position on Japan is somewhat concerning. However, the Japanese government also has its share of blame to take. Consolation is that Trump has been very cordial with the wife of the late Shinzo Abe and also Softbank CEO Masayoshi Son, which means he at least has some level of care for Japan, and it's not like US-Japan relations would go completely sour anyway. By and large though, I am satisfied and happy with what Trump has done and accomplished so far. I voted for this and I still stand by my vote. Let's Make America Great Again, any friends and allies who want to tag along are very welcome. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trail_of_Tears https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trail_of_Tears
- behringer 2y agoThe majority of people don't want this. 36 percent of americans didn't vote. That doesn't mean they don't want services, that means that in addition to 74 million that voted against trump, 90 million more also didn't want him.
- khazhoux 2y agoNope, those people don't count. You may as well point out that 89.7M dogs didn't vote for Trump. The majority of people wanted this.
- behringer 2y agoThey absolutely count. The fact that you don't think so, says more about you than about them.
- khazhoux 2y agoHow can someone who couldn't be bothered to vote possibly count in a discussion of how many people support this administration? Putting aside people who were unable to vote, everyone who chose not to, absolutely 100% gave up their relevance in terms of what the people want. They took themselves out of the equation.
- tbrownaw 2y ago
- Trasmatta 2y agoDemocracy doesn't mean "accept what the current administration does with no criticism, because they were democratically elected"
- dmix 2y agoIt does make ones eyes glaze over when American politics is everywhere you look. In every thread, about every topic. And each comment thread has 50 highly emotional comments that you have to scroll through to find the 5 few thoughtful comments near the bottom discussing the article, without going off the rails.
- Trasmatta 2y agoWhy wouldn't American politics be discussed in a thread about tuberculosis in an American state?
- dmix 2y agoLook at the top thread with 50 comments and count how many are discussing tuberculosis in America. It's just another starting off point for everyone to go in a hundred directions ranting about US politics and ignore the topic
- Dalewyn 2y agoThe thread is about a tuberculosis outbreak in the US. Subsequent comments include conversations about a US federal government department agency publishing (or not) data on that outbreak. This is all taking place on an online forum hosted in the US and managed by US entities. And you (and like minded individuals) expect to not see US politics? I appreciate that the US has an outsized presence on the intertubez, but you also need to realize you're first of all talking in the midst of Americans.
- gonzobonzo 2y agoYou can read the MMWR reports, the OP linked to them: https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/index.html https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/index.html The ones that were published in the weeks prior to the current administration weren't talking about the Kansas tuberculosis outbreak either. So we're not really discussing the "US federal government department agency publishing (or not) data on that outbreak." Someone's implying that's what happened, and then people are spinning off into political discussions without even looking into the link they provided to see if that was actually the case. It's not just going off topic to discuss politics. People are actively spreading misinformation to justify going off topic to discuss politics, and lots of other people are joining in without bothering to check if what was claimed is actually true. Two-thirds of the comments now are using the claims about the MMWR to discuss politics, and it doesn't look like anyone actually looked at the MMWR to see what it actually is.
- SideQuark 2y agoAround 20% of Americans voted Trump, and from polls most don’t like him, but always vote R. Die hard Trumpers are at best 10% of Americans. Trump didn’t even get 50% of the vote. His views most certainly aren’t what a majority of people want, and he doesn’t try to expand by doing things the majority want. If anything he paints those not completely in his camp, which is the vast majority of Americans, as an enemy.
- hilux 2y ago> His views most certainly aren’t what a majority of people want I'm not sure what you gain by telling yourself that. I could just as easily assert, without any evidence (i.e., like you), that every single person who didn't vote loves Trump and supports all his policies. > If anything he paints those not completely in his camp, which is the vast majority of Americans, as an enemy. That has nothing to do with whether people support him. 20 or more (exact number varies on the reporting) women say that he sexually assaulted them, he was convicted of one sexual assault, and yet white women still voted for him.
- lazyasciiart 2y agoExperiments consistently and repeatedly show that when given practical descriptions of policy actions and outcomes, the majority of Americans do not choose the ones that republicans promote. BUT when told that they are Republican policies, then about half of Americans do support those policies.
- hilux 2y agoWell then, liberal politicians aren't doing a very good job, are they? This is like a cliche from the chess world, where the guy who lost the game, then does a postmortem to convince everyone that he was actually winning the whole time. "Except for that one little blunder." The Dems keep losing losing losing, but rather than figure out how to fight better, you instead try to convince yourself that people support you. And then you go back to debating Israel v Palestine or trans pronouns while our own country descends into tyranny. (Literally - many progressives I know.) Meanwhile, Trump owns the White House, both houses of Congress, and the Supreme Court!
- SecretDreams 2y ago> It is a reflection of what a plurality, often majority, of people want. Maybe in countries with multiple parties, proportional representation (or the like), and mechanisms to encourage voting like a holiday for elections. But, everywhere else? It's a crapshoot..low turnout also doesn't help.
- specialist 2y agoHave you read Democracy for Realists? TIL Most voters don't have well defined policy preferences. Nor can they correctly associate political parties with their stated policy positions.