5 ms·

Her dad, the 10k records he left behind and a viral lesson in grief

148 points by pseudolus 2y ago

johnneville 2y ago
https://archive.ph/5sJTY https://archive.ph/5sJTY
agotterer 2y ago
This a neat project and an impressive collection. I’m curious, if shes hosting streaming listening party shows is she obligated to pay royalties?
- jakedata 2y ago
  I had some music playing in the background while testing a Youtube livestream for the first time. Nobody was connected, I was working on camera settings. Google shut it down within a few minutes and bitched at me about a copyright violation. That was the last time I used Youtube.
  - jolmg 2y ago
    > That was the last time I used Youtube. Problem's bigger than Youtube.
    - BlueTemplar 2y ago
      Yes, the main issue is platforms : avoid them : https://framablog.org/2023/12/26/give-the-gift-of-free-software-with-framalibre/ https://framablog.org/2023/12/26/give-the-gift-of-free-softw...
      - jabroni_salad 2y ago
        I'm pretty sure the main problem is getting sued for tens of thousands of dollars per infringment for distributing intellectual property that isn't yours. It's hardly a platform issue. There are law firms that monitor public torrents and threaten anyone sharing from a naked IP address. Every service with UGC is gonna have a frank of exchange of views with the RIAA or MPAA once they get big enough.
        john2x 2y ago
        Just say it’s AI generated
        BlueTemplar 2y ago
        You're forgetting the issue of platforms creating paralegal environments. A lot of the issues come from IP claims that would not have been made if they actually had to do the work and try to sue you (especially in another jurisdiction to boot). And you can make services without UGC too.
- miunau 2y ago
  The platform or the venue pays a more or less flat fee to one or more local copyright associations for music to be played. If you host it yourself, you can get flat-rate streaming licenses (ie. non-seeking linear programming only) for not a lot of money- from a few dozen to some hundreds a year $ depending on location. The DJs should send set lists to their copyright association so that they can remit to the correct people. On e.g. Twitch, the platform should technically handle everything for you via content ID, but they can't catch everything. In any case, the DJ doesn't pay unless they own the performing or broadcasting venue. Streaming service rules on what is allowed also vary depending on the agreements they have set up with the associations.
- jabroni_salad 2y ago
  Instagram has a deal with the record industry. How the renumeration works isn't disclosed but instagram users are allowed to use copyrighted songs as long as they dont use the entire song and the main purpose of the video is to be a video (as opposed to a video that is just a song).
- pjc50 2y ago
  You need to be careful with these; the rules platforms seem to have settled on is that livestreaming is sort of OK but anything which may be archived or replayed isn't. So you get "DJ" and "karaoke" livestreams, but only live. During lockdown there were things like https://timstwitterlisteningparty.com/ https://timstwitterlisteningparty.com/ , where the audience comments along but is all synchronously listening to their own copy. I'm still in a group which does this weekly with films.
shermantanktop 2y ago
I inherited 600+ jazz CDs and a couple of hundreds of LPs from my dad, who died 10 years ago - and like TFA, music is what we often connected over. Most (but not all!) of that music is available online. But I listen to them now and then, in part for the linear experience that they offer, but also because they were his and meant a lot to him. And they were physical items - if he had left me his Spotify account, I'd get no value out of it. Time to go put on some Grant Green..
- 0_____0 2y ago
  I think people assume that because the actual contents of the media are basically identical, that the physical and digital/streamed media are functionally equivalent, but they offer very different experiences. You have a really awesome relationship with the physical media your dad left you. I imagine you play the vinyls on some kind of stereo and not in airpods or whatever? The medium asks you to use it to create an experience, an environment. Streaming doesn't care, so long as you're Consuming Content. With the enshittification of Spotify (really? Ads for AI generated bullshit on my PAID account???) I really want to retreat back into the domain of Local Copy. Sony BMG can't enshittify a CD you already own. Random House can't take back a book I bought in the 90s. I hope that we have a renaissance of physical media as people realize that streaming companies don't respect our desires about how we listen/watch/read things.
  - lilhenry 2y ago
    You say that, but maybe you don’t remember the rootkits Sony BMG put on their cd’s in the 90’s ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_roo... ) Instead of playing you an ad, they disabled a function of your computer.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - waldothedog 2y ago
    > The medium asks you to use it to create an experience, an environment. Streaming doesn't care, so long as you're Consuming Content. I think you’re being a bit too charitable with the record industry IMHO. Buying records is “Consuming Content”, the experience is of your own creation.
brailsafe 2y ago
In some sense, I'd love to be able to hang onto my dad's record collection, and bike collection, not so much his magazine collection, when he goes, but even though it's comparatively small, I know I'll have to pick a subset of favorites and find a way to get rid of the rest, and thankfully he's still got a few decades. Collecting stuff feels like a remnant of gen x, but in my family probably comes from my dad's greatest gen parents, and the idea of having even a modest amount of extra storage space for my own crap (like an extra coat) is becoming more and more distant, at least in my city where it seems the current cost of living space is $1k/sq ft (CAD). I'd choose the location over the stuff any day, but it seems a bit silly how dramatically cost escalates, as in a hundred thousand more just to have some space for full-size sofa and a bedroom in some cases. Won't even get any land for that price, just imaginary land in the sky; for a townhouse or something I'd need to increase my hypothetical budget by $500k, which are some expensive records!
- mb7733 2y ago
  > at least in my city where it seems the current cost of living space is $1k/sq ft (CAD). Even in Canada I don't think rent is this high :) ... Curious what you meant, or was this just hyperbole?
  - nik_0_0 2y ago
    Likey buying - 800k for a 800sqft - sounds about right for major Canadian metros like Toronto/Vancouver
    - brailsafe 2y ago
      Yep, that's right. Translates to rent one way or another.
  - brailsafe 2y ago
    Ya I was just kind of ruminating on future prospects and should have specified to buy, but no part was hyperbole. Translated to rent (which is apparently decreasing slightly as of late) it works out to about $3-5/sq ft per month, or like $1700-2200 for a studio and $2.7k-3500 for a 2 bed, probably looking at upwards of $4k for anything with land, all depending on factors much like buying. In smaller isolated cities, and far flung suburbs, it's less but not by as much as you'd think, they're all catching up. It feels insane that in our next place, we'll likely be spending around $24k a year for a space with no bedroom, probably in someone's basement again, which is around what my dad currently earns after taxes, but it's a bit up to luck. I almost don't want to think about it, so much anxiety. Sad state of things really, along with the economy. Unless you already make great money, inherented it, locked something in ages ago, or just prefer to live in the deep boonies, you're kind of screwed.
poirori 2y ago
> In a noisy era of streaming libraries, trendy headphones and smart shuffles, music listening and discovery have become solitary practices. Shameless plug: this is why I created digs.fm. I missed the days where you would just sit there with an album, and take it all in. And then you would go on to tell your friends about it.
gizajob 2y ago
I’ve seen this girls posts a few times and something came up for me once. At the start I’m sure she said something like “I just spent a couple of weeks alphabetising my dad’s record collection” and I remember that stressed me out at the time. Alphabetisation is like something that a non-collector does when confronted with a collection. I’m a dad who collects vinyl and know that my shelves have formed themselves into sense, slowly over time, and that there is a deep ordering – formed by shifting one record at a time after playing it – based on my taste and likes and preferences. So I can’t critique but it did make me a little sad at the time that the first thing she did was to wipe out the order her dad had left it in, which probably looked like chaos to her. What’s done is done though, I just know that once she gets to the end she might realise that there was a sense and logic to how it had been left.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- mellosouls 2y ago
  Alphabetisation is like something that a non-collector does when confronted with a collection. Each to their own, it's certainly something I've done in the past as a (former) collector - the stress you felt may be more of a projection reaction, though your observations about meaning in the madness are valid.
- dcminter 2y ago
  The novel High Fidelity has an opening scene with the protagonist deciding exactly how he's going to re-order his collection in a particular personal way.
  - SECProto 2y ago
    The movie does as well. https://youtu.be/2msCS8dvSok?t=43 https://youtu.be/2msCS8dvSok?t=43
- EncomLab 2y ago
  This may be the most vinylphillic response to someone's expression of grief ever written. "I get that she lost her dad, but what she should really feel bad about is re-ordering his record collection!"

148 points by pseudolus 2y ago

https://archive.ph/5sJTY https://archive.ph/5sJTY

This a neat project and an impressive collection. I’m curious, if shes hosting streaming listening party shows is she obligated to pay royalties?

jakedata 2y ago
I had some music playing in the background while testing a Youtube livestream for the first time. Nobody was connected, I was working on camera settings. Google shut it down within a few minutes and bitched at me about a copyright violation. That was the last time I used Youtube.
- jolmg 2y ago
  > That was the last time I used Youtube. Problem's bigger than Youtube.
  - BlueTemplar 2y ago
    Yes, the main issue is platforms : avoid them : https://framablog.org/2023/12/26/give-the-gift-of-free-software-with-framalibre/ https://framablog.org/2023/12/26/give-the-gift-of-free-softw...
    - jabroni_salad 2y ago
      I'm pretty sure the main problem is getting sued for tens of thousands of dollars per infringment for distributing intellectual property that isn't yours. It's hardly a platform issue. There are law firms that monitor public torrents and threaten anyone sharing from a naked IP address. Every service with UGC is gonna have a frank of exchange of views with the RIAA or MPAA once they get big enough.
      - john2x 2y ago
        Just say it’s AI generated
      - BlueTemplar 2y ago
        You're forgetting the issue of platforms creating paralegal environments. A lot of the issues come from IP claims that would not have been made if they actually had to do the work and try to sue you (especially in another jurisdiction to boot). And you can make services without UGC too.
miunau 2y ago
The platform or the venue pays a more or less flat fee to one or more local copyright associations for music to be played. If you host it yourself, you can get flat-rate streaming licenses (ie. non-seeking linear programming only) for not a lot of money- from a few dozen to some hundreds a year $ depending on location. The DJs should send set lists to their copyright association so that they can remit to the correct people. On e.g. Twitch, the platform should technically handle everything for you via content ID, but they can't catch everything. In any case, the DJ doesn't pay unless they own the performing or broadcasting venue. Streaming service rules on what is allowed also vary depending on the agreements they have set up with the associations.
jabroni_salad 2y ago
Instagram has a deal with the record industry. How the renumeration works isn't disclosed but instagram users are allowed to use copyrighted songs as long as they dont use the entire song and the main purpose of the video is to be a video (as opposed to a video that is just a song).
pjc50 2y ago
You need to be careful with these; the rules platforms seem to have settled on is that livestreaming is sort of OK but anything which may be archived or replayed isn't. So you get "DJ" and "karaoke" livestreams, but only live. During lockdown there were things like https://timstwitterlisteningparty.com/ https://timstwitterlisteningparty.com/ , where the audience comments along but is all synchronously listening to their own copy. I'm still in a group which does this weekly with films.

shermantanktop 2y ago

I inherited 600+ jazz CDs and a couple of hundreds of LPs from my dad, who died 10 years ago - and like TFA, music is what we often connected over. Most (but not all!) of that music is available online. But I listen to them now and then, in part for the linear experience that they offer, but also because they were his and meant a lot to him. And they were physical items - if he had left me his Spotify account, I'd get no value out of it. Time to go put on some Grant Green..

0_____0 2y ago
I think people assume that because the actual contents of the media are basically identical, that the physical and digital/streamed media are functionally equivalent, but they offer very different experiences. You have a really awesome relationship with the physical media your dad left you. I imagine you play the vinyls on some kind of stereo and not in airpods or whatever? The medium asks you to use it to create an experience, an environment. Streaming doesn't care, so long as you're Consuming Content. With the enshittification of Spotify (really? Ads for AI generated bullshit on my PAID account???) I really want to retreat back into the domain of Local Copy. Sony BMG can't enshittify a CD you already own. Random House can't take back a book I bought in the 90s. I hope that we have a renaissance of physical media as people realize that streaming companies don't respect our desires about how we listen/watch/read things.
- lilhenry 2y ago
  You say that, but maybe you don’t remember the rootkits Sony BMG put on their cd’s in the 90’s ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_rootkit_scandal https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_roo... ) Instead of playing you an ad, they disabled a function of your computer.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- waldothedog 2y ago
  > The medium asks you to use it to create an experience, an environment. Streaming doesn't care, so long as you're Consuming Content. I think you’re being a bit too charitable with the record industry IMHO. Buying records is “Consuming Content”, the experience is of your own creation.

brailsafe 2y ago

In some sense, I'd love to be able to hang onto my dad's record collection, and bike collection, not so much his magazine collection, when he goes, but even though it's comparatively small, I know I'll have to pick a subset of favorites and find a way to get rid of the rest, and thankfully he's still got a few decades. Collecting stuff feels like a remnant of gen x, but in my family probably comes from my dad's greatest gen parents, and the idea of having even a modest amount of extra storage space for my own crap (like an extra coat) is becoming more and more distant, at least in my city where it seems the current cost of living space is $1k/sq ft (CAD). I'd choose the location over the stuff any day, but it seems a bit silly how dramatically cost escalates, as in a hundred thousand more just to have some space for full-size sofa and a bedroom in some cases. Won't even get any land for that price, just imaginary land in the sky; for a townhouse or something I'd need to increase my hypothetical budget by $500k, which are some expensive records!

mb7733 2y ago
> at least in my city where it seems the current cost of living space is $1k/sq ft (CAD). Even in Canada I don't think rent is this high :) ... Curious what you meant, or was this just hyperbole?
- nik_0_0 2y ago
  Likey buying - 800k for a 800sqft - sounds about right for major Canadian metros like Toronto/Vancouver
  - brailsafe 2y ago
    Yep, that's right. Translates to rent one way or another.
- brailsafe 2y ago
  Ya I was just kind of ruminating on future prospects and should have specified to buy, but no part was hyperbole. Translated to rent (which is apparently decreasing slightly as of late) it works out to about $3-5/sq ft per month, or like $1700-2200 for a studio and $2.7k-3500 for a 2 bed, probably looking at upwards of $4k for anything with land, all depending on factors much like buying. In smaller isolated cities, and far flung suburbs, it's less but not by as much as you'd think, they're all catching up. It feels insane that in our next place, we'll likely be spending around $24k a year for a space with no bedroom, probably in someone's basement again, which is around what my dad currently earns after taxes, but it's a bit up to luck. I almost don't want to think about it, so much anxiety. Sad state of things really, along with the economy. Unless you already make great money, inherented it, locked something in ages ago, or just prefer to live in the deep boonies, you're kind of screwed.

poirori 2y ago

> In a noisy era of streaming libraries, trendy headphones and smart shuffles, music listening and discovery have become solitary practices. Shameless plug: this is why I created digs.fm. I missed the days where you would just sit there with an album, and take it all in. And then you would go on to tell your friends about it.

gizajob 2y ago

I’ve seen this girls posts a few times and something came up for me once. At the start I’m sure she said something like “I just spent a couple of weeks alphabetising my dad’s record collection” and I remember that stressed me out at the time. Alphabetisation is like something that a non-collector does when confronted with a collection. I’m a dad who collects vinyl and know that my shelves have formed themselves into sense, slowly over time, and that there is a deep ordering – formed by shifting one record at a time after playing it – based on my taste and likes and preferences. So I can’t critique but it did make me a little sad at the time that the first thing she did was to wipe out the order her dad had left it in, which probably looked like chaos to her. What’s done is done though, I just know that once she gets to the end she might realise that there was a sense and logic to how it had been left.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
mellosouls 2y ago
Alphabetisation is like something that a non-collector does when confronted with a collection. Each to their own, it's certainly something I've done in the past as a (former) collector - the stress you felt may be more of a projection reaction, though your observations about meaning in the madness are valid.
dcminter 2y ago
The novel High Fidelity has an opening scene with the protagonist deciding exactly how he's going to re-order his collection in a particular personal way.
- SECProto 2y ago
  The movie does as well. https://youtu.be/2msCS8dvSok?t=43 https://youtu.be/2msCS8dvSok?t=43
EncomLab 2y ago
This may be the most vinylphillic response to someone's expression of grief ever written. "I get that she lost her dad, but what she should really feel bad about is re-ordering his record collection!"