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I want to make sure I understand this correctly. If you bought a house a few years ago, Spain will effectively rob you of it now? Or will it only apply to new p

I want to make sure I understand this correctly. If you bought a house a few years ago, Spain will effectively rob you of it now? Or will it only apply to new purchases, so you'll have to pay x2 market value if you want to buy one? If it's the former, than even flaunting such a plan is a complete catastrophe for any foreign investment in Spain from now on. But if it's the latter, it'll just bring to life a whole industry of middle-men, which will use their EU residency to buy property in their name to be used by other people. Both ways, it's yet another attempt to force a market to do something that will lead to either disastrous, or just bad results.

egwor 2y ago
believe it is new purchases
gruez 2y ago
>If it's the former, than even flaunting such a plan is a complete catastrophe for any foreign investment in Spain from now on. There's investments that don't involve real estate. Moreover, property isn't a productive asset, so discouraging investment into that is arguably a good thing. Investing money into a factory means you get more stuff produced. Investing money into property just... sits there.
- WalterBright 2y ago
  > property isn't a productive asset It is when you rent it out.
  - yoyohello13 2y ago
    Literal rent seeking behavior from foreign investors.
  - iforgot22 2y ago
    In theory, the market should push owners to rent when prices stabilize. Eventually. In the meantime, it's possible that some foreign investors don't care too much about the opportunity cost. I think some kind of vacancy tax is the only good way to fix this if it's a real problem.
    - WalterBright 2y ago
      Vacant property is quite a drain on one's pocketbook. Try it some time. When I move and sell the old house, I underprice it to sell it as fast as possible. The other sellers do not seem to understand the time value of money, the maintenance cost, the taxes, the vandalism, and the squatter risk. Oh, and your insurance goes up if the house is vacant. And never mind having $800,000 or so tied up as a millstone around your neck when you could be investing it in stocks.
      - iforgot22 2y ago
        Generally yeah, but idk what it's like in Spain. If the gains are huge or the renters' protections are nuts, it could theoretically make sense to keep vacant. If there isn't high vacancy in Spain, this is moot
PaulDavisThe1st 2y ago
> a complete catastrophe for any foreign investment in Spain from now on No doubt because a) all foreign investment always comes with individuals from the investment source purchasing homes in the investment target country b) Germany is no longer foreign when it comes to Spain, so any money invested by Germany would not count as "foreign investment" Am I right?
alexanderchr 2y ago
What make you think it would apply retroactively? Taxes rarely do, I can’t even think of a single example (but would be happy to learn about one). Putting someone else’s name on the deed is a very bad idea for several reasons. I really can’t imagine anyone doing that, unless it’s a trusted family member or something like that.
- jandrewrogers 2y ago
  California is notorious for implementing retroactive taxes, having done it multiple times. I can't think of an example from another jurisdiction though.
jterrys 2y ago
Housing prices in spain and portugal are booming to astronomical degrees mainly because of china. This bill is specifically targeted to stop that without explicitly calling out china. Middlemen cost money, making it more expensive to buy houses, which serves the purpose to restrict the market outside of non-eu residents. What's going to realistically happen is foreign investors will claim quick citizenship in a relatively poor and more corrupt eu member state and then buy the property.

egwor 2y ago

believe it is new purchases

gruez 2y ago

>If it's the former, than even flaunting such a plan is a complete catastrophe for any foreign investment in Spain from now on. There's investments that don't involve real estate. Moreover, property isn't a productive asset, so discouraging investment into that is arguably a good thing. Investing money into a factory means you get more stuff produced. Investing money into property just... sits there.

WalterBright 2y ago
> property isn't a productive asset It is when you rent it out.
- yoyohello13 2y ago
  Literal rent seeking behavior from foreign investors.
- iforgot22 2y ago
  In theory, the market should push owners to rent when prices stabilize. Eventually. In the meantime, it's possible that some foreign investors don't care too much about the opportunity cost. I think some kind of vacancy tax is the only good way to fix this if it's a real problem.
  - WalterBright 2y ago
    Vacant property is quite a drain on one's pocketbook. Try it some time. When I move and sell the old house, I underprice it to sell it as fast as possible. The other sellers do not seem to understand the time value of money, the maintenance cost, the taxes, the vandalism, and the squatter risk. Oh, and your insurance goes up if the house is vacant. And never mind having $800,000 or so tied up as a millstone around your neck when you could be investing it in stocks.
    - iforgot22 2y ago
      Generally yeah, but idk what it's like in Spain. If the gains are huge or the renters' protections are nuts, it could theoretically make sense to keep vacant. If there isn't high vacancy in Spain, this is moot

PaulDavisThe1st 2y ago

> a complete catastrophe for any foreign investment in Spain from now on No doubt because a) all foreign investment always comes with individuals from the investment source purchasing homes in the investment target country b) Germany is no longer foreign when it comes to Spain, so any money invested by Germany would not count as "foreign investment" Am I right?

alexanderchr 2y ago

What make you think it would apply retroactively? Taxes rarely do, I can’t even think of a single example (but would be happy to learn about one). Putting someone else’s name on the deed is a very bad idea for several reasons. I really can’t imagine anyone doing that, unless it’s a trusted family member or something like that.

jandrewrogers 2y ago
California is notorious for implementing retroactive taxes, having done it multiple times. I can't think of an example from another jurisdiction though.

jterrys 2y ago

Housing prices in spain and portugal are booming to astronomical degrees mainly because of china. This bill is specifically targeted to stop that without explicitly calling out china. Middlemen cost money, making it more expensive to buy houses, which serves the purpose to restrict the market outside of non-eu residents. What's going to realistically happen is foreign investors will claim quick citizenship in a relatively poor and more corrupt eu member state and then buy the property.