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I wouldn't say I didn't like Disco Elysium, in fact I really enjoyed it in the beginning, when it was more about the case and less about politics. In theory it

by lz400 2y ago

I wouldn't say I didn't like Disco Elysium, in fact I really enjoyed it in the beginning, when it was more about the case and less about politics. In theory it was really my thing: focus on story, mature, a sense of humour... Planescape: Torment is probably still my favorite game of all time and this looked up that alley. Alas, once the game gets going I found Disco Elysium way too preachy and it completely lost me. Then I saw that it was scripted in part by the guys in el chapo trap house, which I find insufferable and it all made sense. I really really wish they had done away with all the political stuff, it could have been so good.

miunau 2y ago
You think Planescape: Torment is non-political? LOL
- PetitPrince 2y ago
  Agreed: Planescape's faction represents ideologies, philosophies and world (... multiverse?)view and societal view that's political by nature. Their label are just not a 1:1 match with our world. And in Disco Elysium (in least in my playthrough and my impression) everyone gets criticized equally at some point, even though the writers are nostalgic communist. But it doesn't feel to me like blatant propaganda.
- lz400 2y ago
  It's "political" in quotes. In the sense that there are factions, and they represent mostly evergreen moral and civic ideas either real or fantasy (the religious fanatics, the militaristic autocrats, the death obsessed). Disconnecting them from reality, from the early 21st century political obsessions and framing allows for a much more long lasting approach and, frankly, a lot less preachy.
  - Apocryphon 2y ago
    Since DE takes place in a world that’s meant to very much mirror ours, how would you deemphasis the political content? Would you just replace it with fictional ideologies? The difference with Planescape: Torment is that the latter takes place in Dungeons and Dragons where everything from history to economics to the rules of physics are completely different. Disco Elysium takes place in a much less fantastical world that’s reminiscent of our own; you’re going to end up with familiar conflicts unless you were to inject a lot more fantasy-sci-fi gimmicks to change how life operates there.
    - lz400 2y ago
      I would have not given the scriptwriting to terminally online, politics obsessed people. For DE it looks easy to fix, just don't have so many characters pontificating about communism or whatever, and not so much internal dialog about it. Cut it by 50-70%, be it a minor theme, focus more on the case, done.
randomcarbloke 2y ago
I agree, if it wasn't so unbearably and unashamedly explicit in its support of one particular ideology I'd have probably really enjoyed it.
- npteljes 2y ago
  What ideology do you think it explicitly supports? I really liked the game, but I thought that it showed character stories, and not particularly an overarching ideology, and now I wonder if I also support something that I don't even know of.
  - JansjoFromIkea 2y ago
    I'd say it's fairly explicit that it was written by people with leftist sympathies and I assume that's what they meant. I don't get how anyone could find their portrayal of leftists very flattering; unless your notion of "leftist" is Biden/Macron/Starmer, I guess. Not sure how someone could create a world like the one in Disco Elysium without having some kind of political ideology or why anyone would want them to be fixated on moderating themselves to the point of killing any sense of individuality in the work. It'd be like checking out the new Mel Gibson film and being annoyed that it comes across as having a conservative Catholic ideology.
    - randomcarbloke 2y ago
      It might have an appropriate pessimism but it absolutely endorses fully fledged communism in an uninformed college-bro way (as the other commenter noted, akin to chapo trap house). >It'd be like checking out the new Mel Gibson film and being annoyed that it comes across as having a conservative Catholic ideology Yes, but I know Mel is a catholic, I knew nothing of ZA/UM beforehand, I wonder if all of its spiritual successors will be tainted in the same way, if so I'll know for the future that their games aren't for me.
      - yoyohello13 2y ago
        You can't engage with media that doesn't fit your political ideology?
Levitz 2y ago
>Alas, once the game gets going I found Disco Elysium way too preachy and it completely lost me. Then I saw that it was scripted in part by the guys in el chapo trap house, which I find insufferable and it all made sense. I really really wish they had done away with all the political stuff, it could have been so good. The union workers are depicted as useful idiots for corrupt scumbags at best and parasites at worst, communists as delusional losers, the moralintern as ultimately functional, yet brutally oppressive. The script does very clearly come from a left-wing side of things, but I feel it shows the most when it comes to leftist ideologies which are brutally criticized. Funny enough, one of the most liked characters is the unfettered capitalist,which is depicted as far more humane than the general ideologue in the game. I must assume that you disagree with some or all of this?
- me_me_me 2y ago
  It feels to me that people who don't like it are allergic to political opinions. They want to exist in world where people have no opinions and disagreements, Disco's world is an amazing melting pot of ideologies, history and clashes of those.
- lz400 2y ago
  It's not about agreeing or disagreeing, it's about the shoving it in your face. It's also done in fairly "modern" ways (modern = juvenile, twitter brain-rot, millennial, culture war-coded, whatever you want to call it).
  - Apocryphon 2y ago
    Can you actually provide solid examples of this. How can a game that is explicitly about political themes and intrigue not shove it in your face.
    - lz400 2y ago
      Honestly there aren't that many games about politics, at least the way I understand "being about politics" so I can't say, and I don't miss that there are more to be honest. Also, I don't think Disco Elysium needed to be about politics, it's technically a murder mystery and in fact for quite a while I was quite happy with the mystery and general world building but at some point the amount of politics increased to an amount it made it not fun anymore.

by lz400 2y ago

miunau 2y ago

You think Planescape: Torment is non-political? LOL

PetitPrince 2y ago
Agreed: Planescape's faction represents ideologies, philosophies and world (... multiverse?)view and societal view that's political by nature. Their label are just not a 1:1 match with our world. And in Disco Elysium (in least in my playthrough and my impression) everyone gets criticized equally at some point, even though the writers are nostalgic communist. But it doesn't feel to me like blatant propaganda.
lz400 2y ago
It's "political" in quotes. In the sense that there are factions, and they represent mostly evergreen moral and civic ideas either real or fantasy (the religious fanatics, the militaristic autocrats, the death obsessed). Disconnecting them from reality, from the early 21st century political obsessions and framing allows for a much more long lasting approach and, frankly, a lot less preachy.
- Apocryphon 2y ago
  Since DE takes place in a world that’s meant to very much mirror ours, how would you deemphasis the political content? Would you just replace it with fictional ideologies? The difference with Planescape: Torment is that the latter takes place in Dungeons and Dragons where everything from history to economics to the rules of physics are completely different. Disco Elysium takes place in a much less fantastical world that’s reminiscent of our own; you’re going to end up with familiar conflicts unless you were to inject a lot more fantasy-sci-fi gimmicks to change how life operates there.
  - lz400 2y ago
    I would have not given the scriptwriting to terminally online, politics obsessed people. For DE it looks easy to fix, just don't have so many characters pontificating about communism or whatever, and not so much internal dialog about it. Cut it by 50-70%, be it a minor theme, focus more on the case, done.

randomcarbloke 2y ago

I agree, if it wasn't so unbearably and unashamedly explicit in its support of one particular ideology I'd have probably really enjoyed it.

npteljes 2y ago
What ideology do you think it explicitly supports? I really liked the game, but I thought that it showed character stories, and not particularly an overarching ideology, and now I wonder if I also support something that I don't even know of.
- JansjoFromIkea 2y ago
  I'd say it's fairly explicit that it was written by people with leftist sympathies and I assume that's what they meant. I don't get how anyone could find their portrayal of leftists very flattering; unless your notion of "leftist" is Biden/Macron/Starmer, I guess. Not sure how someone could create a world like the one in Disco Elysium without having some kind of political ideology or why anyone would want them to be fixated on moderating themselves to the point of killing any sense of individuality in the work. It'd be like checking out the new Mel Gibson film and being annoyed that it comes across as having a conservative Catholic ideology.
  - randomcarbloke 2y ago
    It might have an appropriate pessimism but it absolutely endorses fully fledged communism in an uninformed college-bro way (as the other commenter noted, akin to chapo trap house). >It'd be like checking out the new Mel Gibson film and being annoyed that it comes across as having a conservative Catholic ideology Yes, but I know Mel is a catholic, I knew nothing of ZA/UM beforehand, I wonder if all of its spiritual successors will be tainted in the same way, if so I'll know for the future that their games aren't for me.
    - yoyohello13 2y ago
      You can't engage with media that doesn't fit your political ideology?

Levitz 2y ago

>Alas, once the game gets going I found Disco Elysium way too preachy and it completely lost me. Then I saw that it was scripted in part by the guys in el chapo trap house, which I find insufferable and it all made sense. I really really wish they had done away with all the political stuff, it could have been so good. The union workers are depicted as useful idiots for corrupt scumbags at best and parasites at worst, communists as delusional losers, the moralintern as ultimately functional, yet brutally oppressive. The script does very clearly come from a left-wing side of things, but I feel it shows the most when it comes to leftist ideologies which are brutally criticized. Funny enough, one of the most liked characters is the unfettered capitalist,which is depicted as far more humane than the general ideologue in the game. I must assume that you disagree with some or all of this?

me_me_me 2y ago
It feels to me that people who don't like it are allergic to political opinions. They want to exist in world where people have no opinions and disagreements, Disco's world is an amazing melting pot of ideologies, history and clashes of those.
lz400 2y ago
It's not about agreeing or disagreeing, it's about the shoving it in your face. It's also done in fairly "modern" ways (modern = juvenile, twitter brain-rot, millennial, culture war-coded, whatever you want to call it).
- Apocryphon 2y ago
  Can you actually provide solid examples of this. How can a game that is explicitly about political themes and intrigue not shove it in your face.
  - lz400 2y ago
    Honestly there aren't that many games about politics, at least the way I understand "being about politics" so I can't say, and I don't miss that there are more to be honest. Also, I don't think Disco Elysium needed to be about politics, it's technically a murder mystery and in fact for quite a while I was quite happy with the mystery and general world building but at some point the amount of politics increased to an amount it made it not fun anymore.