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> So yeah, please get an ex-US NATO off the ground so we can focus on China. If the US does not care about its European allies, it no longer has the economic p

> So yeah, please get an ex-US NATO off the ground so we can focus on China. If the US does not care about its European allies, it no longer has the economic power to "focus on China". From an European perspective, China is far away and not particularly threatening. If there are no specific reasons to support the US, it's better to not take sides and trade with both sides. BRICS is already a serious challenge to the Western hegemony. If the US thinks that "the West" has no longer a reason to exist, it will be seriously outnumbered by those who don't share its ambitions.

nradov 2y ago
BRICS is a total joke. Some of the member countries have taken limited unilateral actions to challenge Western hegemony but BRICS as a group has never taken any meaningful coordinated action and never will. India won't go along with anything that benefits China. South Africa is a failed state. Brazil has no global ambitions. And the Russian Empire is bleeding to death in Ukraine; even if they eventually "win" their ability to challenge us has disintegrated.
- jltsiren 2y ago
  BRICS is not supposed to be a coordinated power. It's a tool for creating the multipolar world order Putin has been dreaming of for decades. A world where the US is just one power among many and the dollar just one currency among many. And the best way to achieve that is creating a wedge between the US and its allies.
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > It's a tool for creating the multipolar world order Putin has been dreaming of for decades India and China just barely wrapped up hostilities, and maintain geopolitical contest with each other. India is increasing defence ties with America. Egypt and the UAE host American armed forces. BRICS is a propaganda tool for leaders who want to blame their failures on a foreign boogeyman. About the best thing for American (and dollar) hegemony would be BRICS continuing to exist. (Versus e.g. China internationalising the renmimbi.)
- oneshtein 2y ago
  > And the Russian Empire is bleeding to death in Ukraine; even if they eventually "win" their ability to challenge us has disintegrated. LOL. USSR had plan how to win war with NATO called «icebreaker» («ледокол»): influence elections or bribe politics in enemy countries to put puppets into powerful seats, then use puppets to start internal conflicts between members of NATO, then support a single side or both sides in the proxy war.
  - ben_w 2y ago
    Sowing dissent is relatively easy, so I hope we defend against it. However, on a military level, Russia is being held off by the Ukrainian people (and 37% of the Ukrainian economy) supported by foreign donations equivalent to the current military spending of any one of the United Kingdom (2.33% of the UK's GDP), Germany (2.12% of German GDP), or France (2.06% of French GDP). If Poland was both threatened and totally isolated from allies, they could triple their military spend to equal the current Ukrainian forces plus all donations, and do so with only half the percentage of their GDP as compared to Ukraine. Everyone would rather that this war goes away and they can return to spending money on things that are directly valuable, rather than the necessary but un-productive task of defending all the things we value. But from a purely military perspective, ignoring how they may sow dissent, my only worry about Russia is that the nukes might not have had all their critical elements sold off in separate black market deals since the end of the cold war.
    - oneshtein 2y ago
      How you will defend NATO against Merkel, Orban, Fico, Trump? How you defended NATO against Covid-19? Russia currently is marching forward in Eastern Ukraine, while Ukrainian partners are recommend to use Ukrainian children instead of promised shells. Poland is ready to 2022 style of war, but not ready to 2023, 2024, or 2025 style of war. With each passing year, nukes are easier to manufacture. 1GHz switches are not a n advanced tech anymore. WiFi is working on 6GHz. Nuclear isotopes can be separated at home. Gas turbines are outdated. Nuclear reactions inside nuke can be modeled on gaming notebook. No need for testing. More and more nuclear reactors lowers barrier to tech and radioactive elements. Small 2 kWt reactor with size of washing machine can be built to breed highly radioactive elements. At some point, everybody will be able to produce nukes or dirty bombs using off the shelf items. We are running out of time anyway. Hiroshima and Nagasaki are forgotten.
throw0101a 2y ago
> BRICS is already a serious challenge to the Western hegemony. A semi-joke-y observation: > Pretty straightforward really. You combine Brazil's history of monetary stability, with Russia's respect for property rights, India's domestic tranquility, China's financial transparency, and South Africa's investment opportunities - and hey presto, you've got a new global money. * https://twitter.com/davidfrum/status/1665053372402081792 https://twitter.com/davidfrum/status/1665053372402081792 If the 'BRICS currency' is made up of only a small group, then it's not going to be useful, especially the restrictive countries that are in the name. But if you expand it, sure it could become more useful, but then you've got competing interests and desires and a coördination problem on policy and such. Further: I've yet to see an explanation of how this thing will actually work. Does each country given up their own currency, Euro-style? Is there a 'theoretical currency' that everyone pegs their own to? What are the consequences for de-pegging (if any)? Are bonds issued in BRICS or the country's own currency?
salesynerd 2y ago
This European perspective is one of the reasons that many developing countries outside of Europe didn't condemn Russia's invasion of Ukraine. As India's External Affairs Minister had remarked, "Europe has to grow out of the mindset that Europe's problems are the world's problems, but the world's problems are not Europe's problems."

nradov 2y ago

BRICS is a total joke. Some of the member countries have taken limited unilateral actions to challenge Western hegemony but BRICS as a group has never taken any meaningful coordinated action and never will. India won't go along with anything that benefits China. South Africa is a failed state. Brazil has no global ambitions. And the Russian Empire is bleeding to death in Ukraine; even if they eventually "win" their ability to challenge us has disintegrated.

jltsiren 2y ago
BRICS is not supposed to be a coordinated power. It's a tool for creating the multipolar world order Putin has been dreaming of for decades. A world where the US is just one power among many and the dollar just one currency among many. And the best way to achieve that is creating a wedge between the US and its allies.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > It's a tool for creating the multipolar world order Putin has been dreaming of for decades India and China just barely wrapped up hostilities, and maintain geopolitical contest with each other. India is increasing defence ties with America. Egypt and the UAE host American armed forces. BRICS is a propaganda tool for leaders who want to blame their failures on a foreign boogeyman. About the best thing for American (and dollar) hegemony would be BRICS continuing to exist. (Versus e.g. China internationalising the renmimbi.)
oneshtein 2y ago
> And the Russian Empire is bleeding to death in Ukraine; even if they eventually "win" their ability to challenge us has disintegrated. LOL. USSR had plan how to win war with NATO called «icebreaker» («ледокол»): influence elections or bribe politics in enemy countries to put puppets into powerful seats, then use puppets to start internal conflicts between members of NATO, then support a single side or both sides in the proxy war.
- ben_w 2y ago
  Sowing dissent is relatively easy, so I hope we defend against it. However, on a military level, Russia is being held off by the Ukrainian people (and 37% of the Ukrainian economy) supported by foreign donations equivalent to the current military spending of any one of the United Kingdom (2.33% of the UK's GDP), Germany (2.12% of German GDP), or France (2.06% of French GDP). If Poland was both threatened and totally isolated from allies, they could triple their military spend to equal the current Ukrainian forces plus all donations, and do so with only half the percentage of their GDP as compared to Ukraine. Everyone would rather that this war goes away and they can return to spending money on things that are directly valuable, rather than the necessary but un-productive task of defending all the things we value. But from a purely military perspective, ignoring how they may sow dissent, my only worry about Russia is that the nukes might not have had all their critical elements sold off in separate black market deals since the end of the cold war.
  - oneshtein 2y ago
    How you will defend NATO against Merkel, Orban, Fico, Trump? How you defended NATO against Covid-19? Russia currently is marching forward in Eastern Ukraine, while Ukrainian partners are recommend to use Ukrainian children instead of promised shells. Poland is ready to 2022 style of war, but not ready to 2023, 2024, or 2025 style of war. With each passing year, nukes are easier to manufacture. 1GHz switches are not a n advanced tech anymore. WiFi is working on 6GHz. Nuclear isotopes can be separated at home. Gas turbines are outdated. Nuclear reactions inside nuke can be modeled on gaming notebook. No need for testing. More and more nuclear reactors lowers barrier to tech and radioactive elements. Small 2 kWt reactor with size of washing machine can be built to breed highly radioactive elements. At some point, everybody will be able to produce nukes or dirty bombs using off the shelf items. We are running out of time anyway. Hiroshima and Nagasaki are forgotten.

throw0101a 2y ago

> BRICS is already a serious challenge to the Western hegemony. A semi-joke-y observation: > Pretty straightforward really. You combine Brazil's history of monetary stability, with Russia's respect for property rights, India's domestic tranquility, China's financial transparency, and South Africa's investment opportunities - and hey presto, you've got a new global money. * https://twitter.com/davidfrum/status/1665053372402081792 https://twitter.com/davidfrum/status/1665053372402081792 If the 'BRICS currency' is made up of only a small group, then it's not going to be useful, especially the restrictive countries that are in the name. But if you expand it, sure it could become more useful, but then you've got competing interests and desires and a coördination problem on policy and such. Further: I've yet to see an explanation of how this thing will actually work. Does each country given up their own currency, Euro-style? Is there a 'theoretical currency' that everyone pegs their own to? What are the consequences for de-pegging (if any)? Are bonds issued in BRICS or the country's own currency?

salesynerd 2y ago

This European perspective is one of the reasons that many developing countries outside of Europe didn't condemn Russia's invasion of Ukraine. As India's External Affairs Minister had remarked, "Europe has to grow out of the mindset that Europe's problems are the world's problems, but the world's problems are not Europe's problems."