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I know this will probably be an unpopular take on a forum of American software engineers —- but the reason the US even has a tech industry in the first place (a

I know this will probably be an unpopular take on a forum of American software engineers —- but the reason the US even has a tech industry in the first place (and why the top 10 most valuable companies in the world is basically a list of former Silicon Valley startups), is because all the best talent wants to move here. The basic misunderstanding of how value and jobs are created is mind boggling to me. We should fix the H1B program because it will make us all richer and better off, including the American engineers. The import of goods is fundamentally different than the importing of talent. Importing goods boosts the competing countries economy. Importing talent strips competing countries of their best resources. Tech talent can create basically unlimited value due to the zero marginal cost nature of software replication.

munk-a 2y ago
Rather than looking at fixing a broken visa system that's specifically employee tied we should just look at relaxing the requirements for O1 visa qualification and allowing non-employer tied skilled immigration. There's a classic story that used to be told about Cambridge and Silicon Valley - both were good candidates for the tech boom but Silicon Valley won because Massachusetts allowed extremely harsh non-competes that prevented employees from freely switching jobs. The H1B visa vs. O1 visa argument is basically the exact same scenario - forcing workers to stay in specific positions hurts innovation and competitiveness. Once you're accepted into the US you should be free to participate in the labor market like everyone else.
- pkaye 2y ago
  I know plenty of H1B visa friends that move around jobs. They are not stuck at one employer.
  - stackskipton 2y ago
    and I know plenty who won't because while you CAN, if anything goes wrong, you are going home. They prefer to play it safe with known quantity then roll the dice, have a paperwork SNAFU and end up on the plane home.
    - pkaye 2y ago
      There is no "play it safe" in the US since workers can be easily fired. Best solution is to give every worker better job security.
- pembrook 2y ago
  Whether it's "fixing" H1B or expanding O1, it doesn't matter. Having more industrious high skilled people in the economy makes us all richer. The job market is not a zero sum game.
cocothem 2y ago
what works best for the economy as a whole, in the long term can really affect someone negatively on the short term
- pembrook 2y ago
  If you're of working age, you're going to likely be alive for say 30-50+ more years. And your kids for maybe 70-80+ years. Tech adoption is now faster than ever, so there's numerous examples of Silicon Valley companies going from 0 to one of the most valuable companies in the world 5-15 years. Stop thinking about the short term. You're going to be around for the long term, so you're only screwing over yourself.

munk-a 2y ago

Rather than looking at fixing a broken visa system that's specifically employee tied we should just look at relaxing the requirements for O1 visa qualification and allowing non-employer tied skilled immigration. There's a classic story that used to be told about Cambridge and Silicon Valley - both were good candidates for the tech boom but Silicon Valley won because Massachusetts allowed extremely harsh non-competes that prevented employees from freely switching jobs. The H1B visa vs. O1 visa argument is basically the exact same scenario - forcing workers to stay in specific positions hurts innovation and competitiveness. Once you're accepted into the US you should be free to participate in the labor market like everyone else.

pkaye 2y ago
I know plenty of H1B visa friends that move around jobs. They are not stuck at one employer.
- stackskipton 2y ago
  and I know plenty who won't because while you CAN, if anything goes wrong, you are going home. They prefer to play it safe with known quantity then roll the dice, have a paperwork SNAFU and end up on the plane home.
  - pkaye 2y ago
    There is no "play it safe" in the US since workers can be easily fired. Best solution is to give every worker better job security.
pembrook 2y ago
Whether it's "fixing" H1B or expanding O1, it doesn't matter. Having more industrious high skilled people in the economy makes us all richer. The job market is not a zero sum game.

cocothem 2y ago

what works best for the economy as a whole, in the long term can really affect someone negatively on the short term

pembrook 2y ago
If you're of working age, you're going to likely be alive for say 30-50+ more years. And your kids for maybe 70-80+ years. Tech adoption is now faster than ever, so there's numerous examples of Silicon Valley companies going from 0 to one of the most valuable companies in the world 5-15 years. Stop thinking about the short term. You're going to be around for the long term, so you're only screwing over yourself.