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Fact checkers are the technocratic solution, they're a panel of experts to Community Note's jury of our peers. Fact checkers are a much better product feature t

Fact checkers are the technocratic solution, they're a panel of experts to Community Note's jury of our peers. Fact checkers are a much better product feature than community notes if we want a feature that best serves people who care about facts. That's not our world, though. People don't care about facts, we are humans, our lives are lived based on vibes. The average person would rather listen to their idiot friend's uneducated thoughts about transgender women in sport than listen to a lecture from an expert. Community notes is probably a better feature for the real world, but it's still junk, "effective" is not a label the feature deserves, because the majority of misinformation on X goes un-noted.

mhh__ 2y ago
"People don't care about facts" is such an asinine reactionary way of thinking about macro dynamics in the world. It has no predictive power at all.
- aimazon 2y ago
  We don’t. People are social. We care about what the people in our community think, whether it’s factually accurate or not is inconsequential. Those of us wasting our lives arguing on the internet in the pursuit of truth are a tiny minority of atypical people. People yearn for the warm embrace of affirmation, not the cold hard truth challenging them at every turn.
  - encoderer 2y ago
    You have too many abstractions between you and understanding other people. Most people in your country are actually not that different from you.
- cryptonector 2y ago
  It resembles Objectivism. "The facts are the facts and you should see them the same way I do or else!!"
  - kergonath 2y ago
    More like “the facts are the facts and reality does not care if you don’t believe in it”. It’s a special kind of nihilism to want to stick it to the universe and insist on one’s own alternative reality like an overgrown angry teenager edgelord.
    - cryptonector 2y ago
      Ayn Rand was pretty insistent that we should be able to objectively ascertain the facts. Objectivism failed precisely because we're not really all that rational, and because apart from the irrational part of us there's also the fact that we can manipulate perception and gaslight others. If you're a newcomer to a pair of groups that vehemently disagree as to the facts you might soon find that you have to make a choice yourself as to which group to join, and suddenly you have to deal with social pressures not just facts. Do you want to be in the in-group or in the out-group? Can you deal with the shaming that goes with being in the out-group? Etc. It's all so tedious, but this is what we humans are like.
      - freshpots 2y ago
        https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/column-this-is-what-happens-when-you-take-ayn-rand-seriously https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/column-this-is-what-hap...
- HappMacDonald 2y ago
  Well first you've got to define what is meant by "facts". Most people presume the word refers to some kind of community consensus, and then they immediately gatekeep what counts as the "community" among which the consensus is shared. However the basis for fact is precisely predictive power, so it's actually more like the battle between science and superstition. Information that can directly empower a person is not necessarily information that will help them to feel more comfortable or confirm their biases.
- intended 2y ago
  It’s true. Fact checking was found to scarcely impact misinfo. I’m in the field and I am thinking of how to work without focusing on truth, because that’s how most humans work!
- aredox 2y ago
  Americans don't care about facts. There's a reason why you have Creationists at the highest levels of government.
  - _DeadFred_ 2y ago
    Unnecessary attacks like this don't help your cause and part of what has driven the other side to the point they are at.
    - mindslight 2y ago
      Do you mean that OP is incorrect, or just impertinent? Just because you have to use a light touch does not mean your friend does not have a Problem. (And I'm speaking as an American)
    - aredox 2y ago
      "Look at what you made me do" No, you never had any moral backbone and you are just looking at the first excuse to behave like the psycho you have always been. The only other possible explanation is that you are stuck at the psychological maturity of a small child, throwing a destructive tantrum any time anyone opposes you.
  - mhh__ 2y ago
    Europeans are just as silly but mistake failure for sincerity. As a sad fantasist I'm immensely fond of Anglo culture but many brits are totally misaligned and insane.
jimbokun 2y ago
Do you have some kind of analysis demonstrating Facebook fact checkers are more accurate than X’s Community Notes?
- voskresenie 2y ago
  Breaking: Leading Fact Checkers Investigate, Find Leading Fact Checkers More Accurate Than Community Notes.
- gitaarik 2y ago
  Indeed, how to fact check the fact checkers? If we could have legitimate fact checking that really works, then I guess we wouldn't need any politics at all.
  - ad_hockey 2y ago
    > Indeed, how to fact check the fact checkers? Like any other work, it can be reviewed by supervisors within the company and/or the client (Meta). If a sample of an employee's work shows that they often hide content that isn't factually false, they are performing their job poorly. If Meta doesn't like the job the company is doing, the contract can be cancelled. > If we could have legitimate fact checking that really works, then I guess we wouldn't need any politics at all. You absolutely need both. Politics is about which decisions to make within the context of shared facts. The amount of the US national debt, the number of people caught crossing the border illegally in 2024, or the number of people sleeping on the streets in San Francisco are all matters of fact. What to do about them is politics.
    - gitaarik 2y ago
      Hey, some news came out that might give you an insight to why the fact checking might not always work: https://www.cnbc.com/2025/01/10/mark-zuckerberg-says-biden-pushed-meta-to-remove-posts-on-vaccines.html https://www.cnbc.com/2025/01/10/mark-zuckerberg-says-biden-p...
      - 2y ago

mhh__ 2y ago

"People don't care about facts" is such an asinine reactionary way of thinking about macro dynamics in the world. It has no predictive power at all.

aimazon 2y ago
We don’t. People are social. We care about what the people in our community think, whether it’s factually accurate or not is inconsequential. Those of us wasting our lives arguing on the internet in the pursuit of truth are a tiny minority of atypical people. People yearn for the warm embrace of affirmation, not the cold hard truth challenging them at every turn.
- encoderer 2y ago
  You have too many abstractions between you and understanding other people. Most people in your country are actually not that different from you.
cryptonector 2y ago
It resembles Objectivism. "The facts are the facts and you should see them the same way I do or else!!"
- kergonath 2y ago
  More like “the facts are the facts and reality does not care if you don’t believe in it”. It’s a special kind of nihilism to want to stick it to the universe and insist on one’s own alternative reality like an overgrown angry teenager edgelord.
  - cryptonector 2y ago
    Ayn Rand was pretty insistent that we should be able to objectively ascertain the facts. Objectivism failed precisely because we're not really all that rational, and because apart from the irrational part of us there's also the fact that we can manipulate perception and gaslight others. If you're a newcomer to a pair of groups that vehemently disagree as to the facts you might soon find that you have to make a choice yourself as to which group to join, and suddenly you have to deal with social pressures not just facts. Do you want to be in the in-group or in the out-group? Can you deal with the shaming that goes with being in the out-group? Etc. It's all so tedious, but this is what we humans are like.
    - freshpots 2y ago
      https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/column-this-is-what-happens-when-you-take-ayn-rand-seriously https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/column-this-is-what-hap...
HappMacDonald 2y ago
Well first you've got to define what is meant by "facts". Most people presume the word refers to some kind of community consensus, and then they immediately gatekeep what counts as the "community" among which the consensus is shared. However the basis for fact is precisely predictive power, so it's actually more like the battle between science and superstition. Information that can directly empower a person is not necessarily information that will help them to feel more comfortable or confirm their biases.
intended 2y ago
It’s true. Fact checking was found to scarcely impact misinfo. I’m in the field and I am thinking of how to work without focusing on truth, because that’s how most humans work!
aredox 2y ago
Americans don't care about facts. There's a reason why you have Creationists at the highest levels of government.
- _DeadFred_ 2y ago
  Unnecessary attacks like this don't help your cause and part of what has driven the other side to the point they are at.
  - mindslight 2y ago
    Do you mean that OP is incorrect, or just impertinent? Just because you have to use a light touch does not mean your friend does not have a Problem. (And I'm speaking as an American)
  - aredox 2y ago
    "Look at what you made me do" No, you never had any moral backbone and you are just looking at the first excuse to behave like the psycho you have always been. The only other possible explanation is that you are stuck at the psychological maturity of a small child, throwing a destructive tantrum any time anyone opposes you.
- mhh__ 2y ago
  Europeans are just as silly but mistake failure for sincerity. As a sad fantasist I'm immensely fond of Anglo culture but many brits are totally misaligned and insane.

jimbokun 2y ago

Do you have some kind of analysis demonstrating Facebook fact checkers are more accurate than X’s Community Notes?

voskresenie 2y ago
Breaking: Leading Fact Checkers Investigate, Find Leading Fact Checkers More Accurate Than Community Notes.
gitaarik 2y ago
Indeed, how to fact check the fact checkers? If we could have legitimate fact checking that really works, then I guess we wouldn't need any politics at all.
- ad_hockey 2y ago
  > Indeed, how to fact check the fact checkers? Like any other work, it can be reviewed by supervisors within the company and/or the client (Meta). If a sample of an employee's work shows that they often hide content that isn't factually false, they are performing their job poorly. If Meta doesn't like the job the company is doing, the contract can be cancelled. > If we could have legitimate fact checking that really works, then I guess we wouldn't need any politics at all. You absolutely need both. Politics is about which decisions to make within the context of shared facts. The amount of the US national debt, the number of people caught crossing the border illegally in 2024, or the number of people sleeping on the streets in San Francisco are all matters of fact. What to do about them is politics.
  - gitaarik 2y ago
    Hey, some news came out that might give you an insight to why the fact checking might not always work: https://www.cnbc.com/2025/01/10/mark-zuckerberg-says-biden-pushed-meta-to-remove-posts-on-vaccines.html https://www.cnbc.com/2025/01/10/mark-zuckerberg-says-biden-p...
    - 2y ago