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While I agree with patio11's assessment here, if you were to poll the average Ottawan about the trucker protest, you'll largely get back a response of "#&$! tho

While I agree with patio11's assessment here, if you were to poll the average Ottawan about the trucker protest, you'll largely get back a response of "#&$! those people", soley because they were minorly-inconvenienced by them. Canadian politics (not uniquely here) is plagued with petty squabbles. The really meaningful political and social issues don't get any airtime.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> if you were to poll the average Ottawan about the trucker protest, you'll largely get back a response of "#&$! those people", soley because they were minorly-inconvenienced by them This just illustrates why pure/Athenian democracy doesn’t work. Madness of the crowds and all that. Decide most issues by plebescite and you get an emotional outcome.
- ivell 2y ago
  Switzerland has direct democracy and seems to go fine with it.
- sapphicsnail 2y ago
  I can't imagine looking at Republican Rome or any of the tyrants in the ancient world and thinking they're better. The Republic fell because a bunch of senators were too greedy and refused to do basic land reform or anything else to make life better for anyone other than themselves. There's no shortage of absolutely insane tyrants that made people's lives miserable.
- 8note 2y ago
  its a much less severe response than there would gave been, compared to say, ottawabs torching the trucks along with anyone in them
throw10920 2y ago
Is this where the meme about Canadians being very polite comes from - a tendency towards pettiness rather than really nasty political rifts? (I don't know anything about Canadian culture)
- busterarm 2y ago
  Spend 5 minutes in Toronto Union Station during commuter hours and you'll never describe Canadians as polite again.
  - FredPret 2y ago
    That's the very worst point of view you'll ever get of Canadians. Of course people in a busy train station during rush hour aren't in the best mood. Travel the country up and down, big cities and small towns, and I guarantee you will conclude that Canadians are the best people around.
    - busterarm 2y ago
      Yes and no. 1/3 of the country's entire population is in the GTA. That brief moment is the most contact that Canadians will have with each other on any given day. And they treat everyone worse than garbage. I've been in busier commuter zones that have been far more civil than that. Even the drunks going home on the LIRR are better than that. I won't disagree with you that Canadians are great people -- I spent a lot of time living there for a reason -- but you have to judge people by when their hair is down, not their Sunday best.
      - FredPret 2y ago
        Daily traffic at Union is 300k according to a quick google. So the most annoyed 1% of Canadians go through there every day. Not the world’s most rigorous basis for a sweeping statement about an entire culture.
        busterarm 2y ago
        And yet if you go there at commuter times and spend 5 minutes just observing, I'm sure you'll feel the same way. The funniest thing about the responses here to me is that not a single person has disputed the characterization I presented -- what I'm describing seems to be clear enough to everyone.
legitster 2y ago
> soley because they were minorly-inconvenienced by them The trucker protests were right in the middle of the Covid supply chain issues. Not defending the actions taken in particular, but it had the potential to be a much worse issue than a minor inconvenience.
bryanlarsen 2y ago
> minorly-inconvenienced 120dB train horns at 2AM in the morning in a residential area is not a minor inconvenience.
- busterarm 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - bryanlarsen 2y ago
    No they're not, at least not in Ottawa at 2AM. They might do a quick blip at an intersection but generally they run silent. There was a massive difference between the train horns and the sirens. The horns were continuous, sirens are very occasional and short.
    - busterarm 2y ago
      You're completely missing the point. If you live around a million other people, you're going to have to deal with loud noise in the middle of the night at some point. Scale this up or down depending on how many people you're living near. For the entire time that I lived in Manhattan, loud noise at 2am was unavoidable. You get thick windows, leave them closed, buy curtains and run your AC. I'm so sorry that you were inconvenienced.
      - vlovich123 2y ago
        The loud noise is a rare and short event, not a nightly recurring occurrence of a long loud continuous blare. If it was as you say, then the protestors wouldn’t be doing it to gain attention.
        busterarm 2y ago
        Yes, a group of people decided that the only way to get their message across was to be assholes for a while. I would label this as an inconvenience. A bunch of Canadians, including commenters in this thread, believe it to be terrorism. Terrorism to justify removing these peoples rights and not addressing their concerns. I'm so glad for you Canadians that this Trucker Protest was the closest thing that your nation can approximate to Terrorism. I don't consider this a serious perspective though.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago

> if you were to poll the average Ottawan about the trucker protest, you'll largely get back a response of "#&$! those people", soley because they were minorly-inconvenienced by them This just illustrates why pure/Athenian democracy doesn’t work. Madness of the crowds and all that. Decide most issues by plebescite and you get an emotional outcome.

ivell 2y ago
Switzerland has direct democracy and seems to go fine with it.
sapphicsnail 2y ago
I can't imagine looking at Republican Rome or any of the tyrants in the ancient world and thinking they're better. The Republic fell because a bunch of senators were too greedy and refused to do basic land reform or anything else to make life better for anyone other than themselves. There's no shortage of absolutely insane tyrants that made people's lives miserable.
8note 2y ago
its a much less severe response than there would gave been, compared to say, ottawabs torching the trucks along with anyone in them

throw10920 2y ago

Is this where the meme about Canadians being very polite comes from - a tendency towards pettiness rather than really nasty political rifts? (I don't know anything about Canadian culture)

busterarm 2y ago
Spend 5 minutes in Toronto Union Station during commuter hours and you'll never describe Canadians as polite again.
- FredPret 2y ago
  That's the very worst point of view you'll ever get of Canadians. Of course people in a busy train station during rush hour aren't in the best mood. Travel the country up and down, big cities and small towns, and I guarantee you will conclude that Canadians are the best people around.
  - busterarm 2y ago
    Yes and no. 1/3 of the country's entire population is in the GTA. That brief moment is the most contact that Canadians will have with each other on any given day. And they treat everyone worse than garbage. I've been in busier commuter zones that have been far more civil than that. Even the drunks going home on the LIRR are better than that. I won't disagree with you that Canadians are great people -- I spent a lot of time living there for a reason -- but you have to judge people by when their hair is down, not their Sunday best.
    - FredPret 2y ago
      Daily traffic at Union is 300k according to a quick google. So the most annoyed 1% of Canadians go through there every day. Not the world’s most rigorous basis for a sweeping statement about an entire culture.
      - busterarm 2y ago
        And yet if you go there at commuter times and spend 5 minutes just observing, I'm sure you'll feel the same way. The funniest thing about the responses here to me is that not a single person has disputed the characterization I presented -- what I'm describing seems to be clear enough to everyone.

legitster 2y ago

> soley because they were minorly-inconvenienced by them The trucker protests were right in the middle of the Covid supply chain issues. Not defending the actions taken in particular, but it had the potential to be a much worse issue than a minor inconvenience.

bryanlarsen 2y ago

> minorly-inconvenienced 120dB train horns at 2AM in the morning in a residential area is not a minor inconvenience.

busterarm 2y ago
[flagged]
- bryanlarsen 2y ago
  No they're not, at least not in Ottawa at 2AM. They might do a quick blip at an intersection but generally they run silent. There was a massive difference between the train horns and the sirens. The horns were continuous, sirens are very occasional and short.
  - busterarm 2y ago
    You're completely missing the point. If you live around a million other people, you're going to have to deal with loud noise in the middle of the night at some point. Scale this up or down depending on how many people you're living near. For the entire time that I lived in Manhattan, loud noise at 2am was unavoidable. You get thick windows, leave them closed, buy curtains and run your AC. I'm so sorry that you were inconvenienced.
    - vlovich123 2y ago
      The loud noise is a rare and short event, not a nightly recurring occurrence of a long loud continuous blare. If it was as you say, then the protestors wouldn’t be doing it to gain attention.
      - busterarm 2y ago
        Yes, a group of people decided that the only way to get their message across was to be assholes for a while. I would label this as an inconvenience. A bunch of Canadians, including commenters in this thread, believe it to be terrorism. Terrorism to justify removing these peoples rights and not addressing their concerns. I'm so glad for you Canadians that this Trucker Protest was the closest thing that your nation can approximate to Terrorism. I don't consider this a serious perspective though.