4 ms·

This is only an anecdote so I won't assume my situation applies to everyone. As a person in their early 30's who has never dated, I thought about this kind of

This is only an anecdote so I won't assume my situation applies to everyone. As a person in their early 30's who has never dated, I thought about this kind of thing recently and concluded I don't really know what I want out of life. A lot of journaling and therapy led me to believe this may stem from a lack of interest in taking risks. And that may stem from my upbringing. Specifically trauma for at least a portion. I agree that there are a lot of reasons to think pessimistically about the future. However in my case it simply feels good to seek out such pessimism because it already fits into my world view. Which was shaped by mindset/trauma and disconnected logically from the fact that the Earth is melting etc. The people who raised me I was essentially given by chance. And they did not fulfill all my critical needs while excelling in other (material) needs. And that causes pessimism in me to some extent. Not the economy, really. Not AI, really. Those are things I can be pessimistic about by proxy. Because generally my mind rewards pessimism stronger than others, so those topics become abstract punching bags. I can't remember how many times I've opened HN and come across a sentiment of pessimism I largely agree with in the comments. But is that because I seek HN for that? What would it matter if I just stayed ignorant for a week? What difference would it make? Ideally, I think if I were to focus on things important to me it wouldn't be pessimism in general. I recently spoke to a woman in her mid-30s married with children and in talking about finding a partner she discussed how she believed all people are fundamentally good at heart, and the dating market is about finding those who will accept you now for who you are, without needing to change for them. This including an obligation to go to therapy or similar to change some of your beliefs that aren't as productive while still letting your true self on the inside shine outwards. This I believe is where the disconnect lies. Because I've already been in therapy since 3rd grade until today, a period of over 20 years, and the longer I've gone the more I've realized those "true self" components that are left without being reconfigured by therapy are not conducive with "you are a good person at heart" that the fiancee automatically believes. And it might have been that incorrect belief that enabled her to get married, because it enabled her to find a person that wasn't like me. But I don't parse it the same way. For a long time I didn't see an issue with myself. I just thought that's what "be yourself" meant. To believe the world is fundamentally chaotic and absurd. Because there isn't any other way to see it, having experienced first-hand what I did. And also I disagreed that there aren't any "fundamental" qualities so to speak that every single person on Earth would reject you for. If they accepted me for those it would be like accepting that they know someone will take advantage of them and deciding it's in their best interest to interact with them daily. I can only imagine the number of people diagnosable with narcissistic personality disorder that love "being themselves" and never want to change their fundamental nature for anyone. This is better than where I was 5 years ago. I was so busy dissociating with work that there was no reason at all for me to think about marriage or dating. Even in the middle of therapy. And I would say I am not restricted by finances or lack of homeownership (it sounded like a weird American obligation to me not grounded in true desires). This is my personal explanation for "people are better off but don't seem to know it" in the article. My mind reconfigured itself so that such any notion of "success" becomes unrecognizable. How effective is a human whose brain does not process rewards and punishment normally?

jll29 2y ago
> this may stem from a lack of interest in taking risks Curious wording, I've come across many people who say they are afraid of taking risks, but you're the only one that I've read saying "lacks interest" in risk taking. If you read about game theory and search and "explore vs. exploit" it should become pretty obvious that it is highly beneficial to take a balanced amount of risk.
- throw44441 2y ago
  I think earlier in my life it was "afraid of taking risks" nearly 100% of the time. I had a lot of (social) risks I took over many years that didn't work out and the emotional component of it not working hit me much more strongly than I understand other people would. So at some point it transitioned into "doesn't see the point in taking any more risks." I think for me it may be the same with a lot of things. I don't know how unusual it is to say this, but it's the same feeling as thinking about video games for the first time in a while and realizing I don't have the same attachment to them I did when I was a teenager. I likewise didn't feel the attachment towards dating until very recently when I deliberately went down a chain of reasoning related to age.
  - schroeding 2y ago
    I don't think it's a super super rare sentiment. Also fits that there is a rising number of NEETs and (basically, for the lack of a better word) hikikomoris, which is just this feeling taken to the logical extreme (at least IMO, I may be wrong). For the last thing you said, in German, there is even an explicit word for this, "Torschlusspanik", the fear and sense of urgency you get when you feel a (imaginary or real) deadline or "last shot at something" starts to approach. So also a common feeling. Feel hugged. Childhood trauma sucks big time. :/
    - throw44441 2y ago
      I do agree that some aspect of hikkidom applies to me, but I regularly go out and have no real problem running errands in public. I'm not a NEET either since I have plenty of education and employment history. What I believe is that there are a lot of people in the world who believe they are right and certain others are wrong. These people are frequently sighted, I guess because people generally like being listened to. And a lot of amicable disagreements are included in this, as is necessary to exist as an individual in a diverse society. But if you take a person who believes they are mostly wrong and the rest of society is mostly correct, yet there is some complicating factor preventing the two belief systems from aligning closely enough (be it ego, pride, timidity, or something else), then such a person may decide to turn inward on themselves. It doesn't make sense to try to yell out into the world that they are wrong, because it's a "fact" they already understand. To say it out loud only carries a risk of lowering one's status further in the eyes of the public. So I guess a natural inclination is to remain in a safer place where symbols and beliefs are most familiar. But this is why I think such persons don't get as much attention as others, because they're naturally hard to find and might not speak up as often. And if they do, it's a daunting task to attach that belief in wrongness to a stable identity. And I should add that your hug is accepted.

jll29 2y ago

> this may stem from a lack of interest in taking risks Curious wording, I've come across many people who say they are afraid of taking risks, but you're the only one that I've read saying "lacks interest" in risk taking. If you read about game theory and search and "explore vs. exploit" it should become pretty obvious that it is highly beneficial to take a balanced amount of risk.

throw44441 2y ago
I think earlier in my life it was "afraid of taking risks" nearly 100% of the time. I had a lot of (social) risks I took over many years that didn't work out and the emotional component of it not working hit me much more strongly than I understand other people would. So at some point it transitioned into "doesn't see the point in taking any more risks." I think for me it may be the same with a lot of things. I don't know how unusual it is to say this, but it's the same feeling as thinking about video games for the first time in a while and realizing I don't have the same attachment to them I did when I was a teenager. I likewise didn't feel the attachment towards dating until very recently when I deliberately went down a chain of reasoning related to age.
- schroeding 2y ago
  I don't think it's a super super rare sentiment. Also fits that there is a rising number of NEETs and (basically, for the lack of a better word) hikikomoris, which is just this feeling taken to the logical extreme (at least IMO, I may be wrong). For the last thing you said, in German, there is even an explicit word for this, "Torschlusspanik", the fear and sense of urgency you get when you feel a (imaginary or real) deadline or "last shot at something" starts to approach. So also a common feeling. Feel hugged. Childhood trauma sucks big time. :/
  - throw44441 2y ago
    I do agree that some aspect of hikkidom applies to me, but I regularly go out and have no real problem running errands in public. I'm not a NEET either since I have plenty of education and employment history. What I believe is that there are a lot of people in the world who believe they are right and certain others are wrong. These people are frequently sighted, I guess because people generally like being listened to. And a lot of amicable disagreements are included in this, as is necessary to exist as an individual in a diverse society. But if you take a person who believes they are mostly wrong and the rest of society is mostly correct, yet there is some complicating factor preventing the two belief systems from aligning closely enough (be it ego, pride, timidity, or something else), then such a person may decide to turn inward on themselves. It doesn't make sense to try to yell out into the world that they are wrong, because it's a "fact" they already understand. To say it out loud only carries a risk of lowering one's status further in the eyes of the public. So I guess a natural inclination is to remain in a safer place where symbols and beliefs are most familiar. But this is why I think such persons don't get as much attention as others, because they're naturally hard to find and might not speak up as often. And if they do, it's a daunting task to attach that belief in wrongness to a stable identity. And I should add that your hug is accepted.