5 ms·

Oh yes, "simply" obey a law that would not respect the privacy of people, and given the current religious zealousness in the US, may expose customers to future

by tensor 2y ago

Oh yes, "simply" obey a law that would not respect the privacy of people, and given the current religious zealousness in the US, may expose customers to future danger. Good for Pornhub. They made the right call.

LewisVerstappen 2y ago
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- marxisttemp 2y ago
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  - LewisVerstappen 2y ago
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  - deleted 2y ago
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- proxynoproxy 2y ago
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- lofenfew 2y ago
  a. the vast majority of people are neither addicted to porn nor lacking in ability to form relationships. if that has happened to some people they are a minority b. pornhub has no monopoly over the internet porn industry. insofar as those men did get so addicted, that would have happened regardless of pornhub existing.
  - bhouston 2y ago
    "a. the vast majority of people are neither addicted to porn nor lacking in ability to form relationships. if that has happened to some people they are a minority" Hmm... something is going on though: https://www.psychologytoday.com/ca/blog/sexual-intelligence/202208/why-todays-teens-are-having-so-much-less-sex https://www.psychologytoday.com/ca/blog/sexual-intelligence/... Which in turn is going to likely lead to even further reductions in birth rate. I think we need to be careful about all the things that factor into our sub-replacement birthrates.
    - suzzer99 2y ago
      I agree that porn addiction can be destructive. But the idea that you can somehow block porn is ludicrous. Work on the problem from some other angle. This is just puritanical politicians throwing their weight around.
      - bhouston 2y ago
        > Work on the problem from some other angle. This is just puritanical politicians throwing their weight around. Sure. But if I look at this objectively, I am not sure it is going to be solved from another angle by liberal societies any time soon. And religious societies, or at least those that are puritanical in this regards will get a significant and likely sustainable demographic advantage as a result. I think this speaks to the larger issues of why religion has persisted and why atheism has yet to be a sustainable endeavour, rather than a demographic sink. Truth doesn't actually matter, viability via demographic sustainability is how things are actually judged.
        alpaca128 2y ago
        Birth rates tend to be higher in less wealthy societies with high child mortality, yes. I don't think that means what you think it means.
        bhouston 2y ago
        > Birth rates tend to be higher in less wealthy societies with high child mortality, yes. You are correct that this is the case. > I don't think that means what you think it means. I am not sure I follow you logically. You are making a completely separate argument. Many things influence birth rates: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fertility_factor_(demography) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fertility_factor_(demography)
    - wkat4242 2y ago
      Dropping birth rates are just because kids are a burden these days. With both parents needing to work to pay for a house it's a huge hassle. I'm glad I never had any. My life is much freer now. And we're not going to go extinct. Plenty of people want kids and have them. Maybe we'll reduce the population a bit which would be great. Less pollution, less pressure on the overloaded housing situation.
- voxl 2y ago
  Porn addiction does not exist in anything other than a possible symptom of some other mental health issue, but puritanical people like yourself and religious lobbyists like to pretend the degradation of society revolves around sexual liberty.
- suzzer99 2y ago
  Pornhub is pretty tame compared to a lot of the stuff out there, which won't be blocked because it's hosted in Russia or wherever and won't comply. I don't think limiting access to mainstream porn sites is going to do anything positive wrt porn addiction, and it could drive people to much darker stuff.
- wkat4242 2y ago
  Almost everyone watches porn and almost everyone has relationships. And if they don't it's not because they don't need sex. In fact sex is a less important part of relationships IMO. Being in an open relationship we both enjoy that with others too but we're not less special to each other. Those other people come and go and sex is a nice pleasure, but she's the one keeping me warm at night and comforting me when I'm sad. That matters a lot more to me.
- inetknght 2y ago
  > Good on them for addicting millions of young men to pornography Can you explain further? > and destroying their ability to form relationships? There are many reasons young men today have trouble forming relationships, with pornography among the least concerning in my opinion.
nateshelley 2y ago
> would not respect the privacy of the people How does age verification break privacy? I have to show ID to get into an adult "bookstore," to enter a bar, or purchase alcohol. I have to show ID to check into my hotel, get through airport security, drive my car, buy Pseudo. Are you saying there is absolutely no way to perform this action online in a way that respects privacy just the same as all of those operations? No way at all to do a verification that's immediately tossed in a privacy preserving way? If so, then it sounds like maybe things that require age verification shouldn't be allowed to operate on the internet.
- some_furry 2y ago
  There are cryptographic tools (zero-knowledge proofs, for example) that can provide anonymous attestations for a user's age. The problem is that the infrastructure to support it isn't provided by the same government that's requiring it to exist. And even if the private sector innovated here, there's no approval from the government to accept math nerd solutions as legally valid. Which means you basically have to scan and upload your photo ID to these websites, or use a payment card, or something else that will stand up in court.
  - nateshelley 2y ago
    Which makes sense, and also sounds like applying monetary pressure, say losing access to multiple states in the US, would incentivize prioritizing some engineers into solving this. The reason it doesn't exist yet, is because we've collectively decided through indifference and inaction that an "I swear bro" button is fine in the virtual world, but not the physical, and have now learned that it's not enough.
    - bdangubic 2y ago
      there is a HUGE difference between presenting ID in the physical world and digital world. In the digital world, once I provide an ID it is there forever. and it will be used for who knows what by who knows who. the only way to compare the two would be if in the physical world we provided an ID and whoever requested it gets to keep it and of course no place like that exists, you flash the ID (not that much unlike “I am 18 I swear” button in a lot of places) and you move on
RajT88 2y ago
I think some folks absolutely want to know what folks are watching what kind of porn. Especially in rural areas, some of those wingnuts would like to go back to the days where you can lynch people you do not like. Other than the wingnut faction pushing this legislation, I think some hope for a deterrent effect for minors as well as adults. They are wrong to expect any kind of deterrent effect of course.

by tensor 2y ago

LewisVerstappen 2y ago

[deleted]

marxisttemp 2y ago
[flagged]
- LewisVerstappen 2y ago
  [flagged]
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
proxynoproxy 2y ago
[flagged]
lofenfew 2y ago
a. the vast majority of people are neither addicted to porn nor lacking in ability to form relationships. if that has happened to some people they are a minority b. pornhub has no monopoly over the internet porn industry. insofar as those men did get so addicted, that would have happened regardless of pornhub existing.
- bhouston 2y ago
  "a. the vast majority of people are neither addicted to porn nor lacking in ability to form relationships. if that has happened to some people they are a minority" Hmm... something is going on though: https://www.psychologytoday.com/ca/blog/sexual-intelligence/202208/why-todays-teens-are-having-so-much-less-sex https://www.psychologytoday.com/ca/blog/sexual-intelligence/... Which in turn is going to likely lead to even further reductions in birth rate. I think we need to be careful about all the things that factor into our sub-replacement birthrates.
  - suzzer99 2y ago
    I agree that porn addiction can be destructive. But the idea that you can somehow block porn is ludicrous. Work on the problem from some other angle. This is just puritanical politicians throwing their weight around.
    - bhouston 2y ago
      > Work on the problem from some other angle. This is just puritanical politicians throwing their weight around. Sure. But if I look at this objectively, I am not sure it is going to be solved from another angle by liberal societies any time soon. And religious societies, or at least those that are puritanical in this regards will get a significant and likely sustainable demographic advantage as a result. I think this speaks to the larger issues of why religion has persisted and why atheism has yet to be a sustainable endeavour, rather than a demographic sink. Truth doesn't actually matter, viability via demographic sustainability is how things are actually judged.
      - alpaca128 2y ago
        Birth rates tend to be higher in less wealthy societies with high child mortality, yes. I don't think that means what you think it means.
        bhouston 2y ago
        > Birth rates tend to be higher in less wealthy societies with high child mortality, yes. You are correct that this is the case. > I don't think that means what you think it means. I am not sure I follow you logically. You are making a completely separate argument. Many things influence birth rates: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fertility_factor_(demography) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fertility_factor_(demography)
  - wkat4242 2y ago
    Dropping birth rates are just because kids are a burden these days. With both parents needing to work to pay for a house it's a huge hassle. I'm glad I never had any. My life is much freer now. And we're not going to go extinct. Plenty of people want kids and have them. Maybe we'll reduce the population a bit which would be great. Less pollution, less pressure on the overloaded housing situation.
voxl 2y ago
Porn addiction does not exist in anything other than a possible symptom of some other mental health issue, but puritanical people like yourself and religious lobbyists like to pretend the degradation of society revolves around sexual liberty.
suzzer99 2y ago
Pornhub is pretty tame compared to a lot of the stuff out there, which won't be blocked because it's hosted in Russia or wherever and won't comply. I don't think limiting access to mainstream porn sites is going to do anything positive wrt porn addiction, and it could drive people to much darker stuff.
wkat4242 2y ago
Almost everyone watches porn and almost everyone has relationships. And if they don't it's not because they don't need sex. In fact sex is a less important part of relationships IMO. Being in an open relationship we both enjoy that with others too but we're not less special to each other. Those other people come and go and sex is a nice pleasure, but she's the one keeping me warm at night and comforting me when I'm sad. That matters a lot more to me.
inetknght 2y ago
> Good on them for addicting millions of young men to pornography Can you explain further? > and destroying their ability to form relationships? There are many reasons young men today have trouble forming relationships, with pornography among the least concerning in my opinion.

nateshelley 2y ago

> would not respect the privacy of the people How does age verification break privacy? I have to show ID to get into an adult "bookstore," to enter a bar, or purchase alcohol. I have to show ID to check into my hotel, get through airport security, drive my car, buy Pseudo. Are you saying there is absolutely no way to perform this action online in a way that respects privacy just the same as all of those operations? No way at all to do a verification that's immediately tossed in a privacy preserving way? If so, then it sounds like maybe things that require age verification shouldn't be allowed to operate on the internet.

some_furry 2y ago
There are cryptographic tools (zero-knowledge proofs, for example) that can provide anonymous attestations for a user's age. The problem is that the infrastructure to support it isn't provided by the same government that's requiring it to exist. And even if the private sector innovated here, there's no approval from the government to accept math nerd solutions as legally valid. Which means you basically have to scan and upload your photo ID to these websites, or use a payment card, or something else that will stand up in court.
- nateshelley 2y ago
  Which makes sense, and also sounds like applying monetary pressure, say losing access to multiple states in the US, would incentivize prioritizing some engineers into solving this. The reason it doesn't exist yet, is because we've collectively decided through indifference and inaction that an "I swear bro" button is fine in the virtual world, but not the physical, and have now learned that it's not enough.
  - bdangubic 2y ago
    there is a HUGE difference between presenting ID in the physical world and digital world. In the digital world, once I provide an ID it is there forever. and it will be used for who knows what by who knows who. the only way to compare the two would be if in the physical world we provided an ID and whoever requested it gets to keep it and of course no place like that exists, you flash the ID (not that much unlike “I am 18 I swear” button in a lot of places) and you move on

RajT88 2y ago

I think some folks absolutely want to know what folks are watching what kind of porn. Especially in rural areas, some of those wingnuts would like to go back to the days where you can lynch people you do not like. Other than the wingnut faction pushing this legislation, I think some hope for a deterrent effect for minors as well as adults. They are wrong to expect any kind of deterrent effect of course.