9 ms·

Wishing Everyone a Happy Solsthelion

69 points by ColinWright 2y ago

graemep 2y ago
Amusing, but the entire point of a greeting at this time of year is based on a particular culture and history. Its not purely astronomical, and its significance is reversed in northern and southern hemispheres and is not all that relevant in the tropics.
- roebk 2y ago
  Happy Solsthelion!
- saghm 2y ago
  FWIW the page specifically describes it as the "December Solstice" and has a footnote for that mentioning the specific seasons for each hemisphere. I imagine the author is well aware of how the event varies by geography. As for what the "entire point" of a greeting is, I'd argue that the "entire point" is a bit of a philosophical question that depends on what you think it means for something to be "the point". Maybe a few thousand years from now, instead of seemingly ignoring the culture and history you refer to, Solsthelion will just be seen as another chapter in the history of the greetings used during this time of year, just like the cultural reference in one common greeting you might encounter this time of year might have seemed transgressive back when it debuted to people fond of previous cultural traditions during the same part of the year.
  - graemep 2y ago
    > has a footnote for that mentioning the specific seasons for each hemisphere. It mentions winter and summer, seasons that do not exist for a lot of the world. For example, in South Asia the main seasonal variation is the monsoon rains.
    - lentil_soup 2y ago
      In terms of weather you're right, but those areas will still have the shortest/longest day on the solstice even if the change is relatively small.
      - graemep 2y ago
        If you are right on the equator, then you would not have any chance. Close to the equator a hardly noticeable change. I have lived near the equator (7° north, mostly) and the change in day length (about half an hour between longest and shortest days) is not noticeable.
- adrian_b 2y ago
  While what you say is true now, in the distant past in all the cultures that had celebrations or holidays around this time of the year their origin had been purely astronomical, in celebrations of the Winter Solstice. The reinterpretations of the Solstice celebrations to fit in various religions and the shift in the calendar from the true astronomical event have occurred much later. By the time of Julius Cesar, after his calendar reform, the Winter Solstice occurred on the 25th of December, which is the reason for having Christmas on this day. The reason why Christmas is now shifted by 3 days from the solstice is that the Gregorian calendar reform has not restored the calendar of the time corresponding to the start of the Christian era, but the calendar of the 4th century (when the procedure for selecting the date for Easter has been established), and the calendar of the 4th century was shifted by these 3 days. Before Julius Cesar, the Roman calendar shifted a lot from year to year in comparison with the astronomical calendar. It is likely that when first established, the 1st of March (their New Year) of the Roman calendar occurred on the Spring Equinox, but then it has drifted a lot. After the Julian calendar reform, the solstices and equinoxes occurred around the 25th of their months, then they have drifted away until the Gregorian reform has set them around the 22th of their months.
  - cies 2y ago
    > all the cultures that had celebrations or holidays around this time of the year I expect this not to be true... Cultures with only a moon calendar (ancient Arabs) do not even have the means to express the date!
    - adrian_b 2y ago
      That is why I have qualified "cultures" with "that had ...", a condition that can be true only for the cultures with solar calendars or mixed solar-lunar calendars.
    - kadoban 2y ago
      You don't need a calendar to have seasonal celebrations. I doubt there was ~ever any society that couldn't tell you approximately where they were in the year anyway. All it takes is making marks on literally anything, one per day, or having a decent memory. What society doesn't have at least one person doing that?
369548684892826 2y ago
Happy Solsthelion! It's not the best portmanteau though as it's taken the 'sun' part of both its donor words. Happy Peristice!
- psychoslave 2y ago
  Came here with the same reflection. Also the article doesn’t mention how Solsthelion is supposed to be pronounced, and I guess most English speaker meeting the word in the wild would more likely pronounce th as /ð/. Happy Peristice is also close to apéritif, which is great for a celebration solicitation.
  - corobo 2y ago
    "Sols, the lion" is all I'm getting out of my mind meat :(
    - hnuser123456 2y ago
      Solst-Helion is what the author was going for, I think, but I saw what you did too, lol.
- robertlagrant 2y ago
  Peristice is much, much better. And helps me learn which one peri- is.
  - adrian_b 2y ago
    Unfortunately, perihelion is not a good name for the point on the orbit that is closest to the Sun, which also makes "peristice" mostly meaningless, even if much better than "solsthelion". Peri- means "around" (like in "perimeter" or "periphery", where the Latin translation of "periphery" is "circumference", or in "periscope", which means "look around"), which does not suggest much in terms of distance. For instance, both the Earth and Neptune move "around" the Sun, but at vastly different distances. Apohelion for the most distant point on the orbit is a better name, because apo- means "away", but it still not the best, because "away" refers to direction of movement towards exterior, and not to the distance from the center. A body can be moving away, but still be very close to the center. The Greek prefixes meaning "close" and "distant" are "anchi-" and "tele-" (first "e" is long). Therefore much more appropriate names would have been "anchihelion" and "telehelion", for the closest and for the most distant points on the orbit. The prefixes "anchi-" and "tele-" have already been used in the "Iliad" and "Odyssey" of Homer, e.g. for "close combat" (like with swords) and "distant combat" (like with arrows). "Solstice" is a better name, because "-stice" is cognate with "stay" (and with "stand"), and it refers to the fact that during a solstice the apparent movement of the Sun on the sky has a minimum speed, it almost stays in one place. So, for the time interval when the Sun both has a minimum speed of the apparent motion on the sky and is at a minimum distance from us, a term more correct etymologically would have been "anchistice", which is still not optimal, because it combines a Greek prefix with a Latin suffix. Translating "anchi-" into Latin would result in "propistice" (approximately meaning "staying close").
perihelions 2y ago
Happy solstices and merry perihelions to all! If anyone's celebrations urgently need very precise planetary orbital state vectors, for some reason, you can look up current and future ones here: https://ssd.jpl.nasa.gov/horizons/ https://ssd.jpl.nasa.gov/horizons/
jamieplex 2y ago
Merry Crispness, and Happy Gnu Ears
digging 2y ago
> So if it's after the middle of December, start wishing people a "Happy Solsthelion" > ... it's a great way to form the ice. The best part - although perhaps untrue in a room full of HN commenters :)
- valiant55 2y ago
  Depending on my company I like the classic ice former: "So how do you sell your labor?"
red_admiral 2y ago
Happy Solsthelion! There's a ritual for it: https://thingofthings.substack.com/p/bay-area-secular-solstice-2024-script https://thingofthings.substack.com/p/bay-area-secular-solsti...
ubittibu 2y ago
Due to precession the period is shorter every year. In 2884 solstice and perhelion will be on the same day.
hollerith 2y ago
It'd be wrong for me to flag this for wasting my time (so I'm not going to).
jamietanna 2y ago
Aside if the author is reading: on mobile only 1/3 of the page width is the article, the rest is the sidebar, which makes it hard to read
- ColinWright 2y ago
  Thanks for the feedback ... regrettably, I have no control over the template. Also, it reads really well on my mobile. I'm not a web programmer, I use what's available, and sadly, sometimes it's crap. If I had another lifetime to spare I might take up front end programming, but I turn 65 next year, I have a very full diary, and it's just not going to happen. 8-(

69 points by ColinWright 2y ago

Amusing, but the entire point of a greeting at this time of year is based on a particular culture and history. Its not purely astronomical, and its significance is reversed in northern and southern hemispheres and is not all that relevant in the tropics.

roebk 2y ago
Happy Solsthelion!
saghm 2y ago
FWIW the page specifically describes it as the "December Solstice" and has a footnote for that mentioning the specific seasons for each hemisphere. I imagine the author is well aware of how the event varies by geography. As for what the "entire point" of a greeting is, I'd argue that the "entire point" is a bit of a philosophical question that depends on what you think it means for something to be "the point". Maybe a few thousand years from now, instead of seemingly ignoring the culture and history you refer to, Solsthelion will just be seen as another chapter in the history of the greetings used during this time of year, just like the cultural reference in one common greeting you might encounter this time of year might have seemed transgressive back when it debuted to people fond of previous cultural traditions during the same part of the year.
- graemep 2y ago
  > has a footnote for that mentioning the specific seasons for each hemisphere. It mentions winter and summer, seasons that do not exist for a lot of the world. For example, in South Asia the main seasonal variation is the monsoon rains.
  - lentil_soup 2y ago
    In terms of weather you're right, but those areas will still have the shortest/longest day on the solstice even if the change is relatively small.
    - graemep 2y ago
      If you are right on the equator, then you would not have any chance. Close to the equator a hardly noticeable change. I have lived near the equator (7° north, mostly) and the change in day length (about half an hour between longest and shortest days) is not noticeable.
adrian_b 2y ago
While what you say is true now, in the distant past in all the cultures that had celebrations or holidays around this time of the year their origin had been purely astronomical, in celebrations of the Winter Solstice. The reinterpretations of the Solstice celebrations to fit in various religions and the shift in the calendar from the true astronomical event have occurred much later. By the time of Julius Cesar, after his calendar reform, the Winter Solstice occurred on the 25th of December, which is the reason for having Christmas on this day. The reason why Christmas is now shifted by 3 days from the solstice is that the Gregorian calendar reform has not restored the calendar of the time corresponding to the start of the Christian era, but the calendar of the 4th century (when the procedure for selecting the date for Easter has been established), and the calendar of the 4th century was shifted by these 3 days. Before Julius Cesar, the Roman calendar shifted a lot from year to year in comparison with the astronomical calendar. It is likely that when first established, the 1st of March (their New Year) of the Roman calendar occurred on the Spring Equinox, but then it has drifted a lot. After the Julian calendar reform, the solstices and equinoxes occurred around the 25th of their months, then they have drifted away until the Gregorian reform has set them around the 22th of their months.
- cies 2y ago
  > all the cultures that had celebrations or holidays around this time of the year I expect this not to be true... Cultures with only a moon calendar (ancient Arabs) do not even have the means to express the date!
  - adrian_b 2y ago
    That is why I have qualified "cultures" with "that had ...", a condition that can be true only for the cultures with solar calendars or mixed solar-lunar calendars.
  - kadoban 2y ago
    You don't need a calendar to have seasonal celebrations. I doubt there was ~ever any society that couldn't tell you approximately where they were in the year anyway. All it takes is making marks on literally anything, one per day, or having a decent memory. What society doesn't have at least one person doing that?

369548684892826 2y ago

Happy Solsthelion! It's not the best portmanteau though as it's taken the 'sun' part of both its donor words. Happy Peristice!

psychoslave 2y ago
Came here with the same reflection. Also the article doesn’t mention how Solsthelion is supposed to be pronounced, and I guess most English speaker meeting the word in the wild would more likely pronounce th as /ð/. Happy Peristice is also close to apéritif, which is great for a celebration solicitation.
- corobo 2y ago
  "Sols, the lion" is all I'm getting out of my mind meat :(
  - hnuser123456 2y ago
    Solst-Helion is what the author was going for, I think, but I saw what you did too, lol.
robertlagrant 2y ago
Peristice is much, much better. And helps me learn which one peri- is.
- adrian_b 2y ago
  Unfortunately, perihelion is not a good name for the point on the orbit that is closest to the Sun, which also makes "peristice" mostly meaningless, even if much better than "solsthelion". Peri- means "around" (like in "perimeter" or "periphery", where the Latin translation of "periphery" is "circumference", or in "periscope", which means "look around"), which does not suggest much in terms of distance. For instance, both the Earth and Neptune move "around" the Sun, but at vastly different distances. Apohelion for the most distant point on the orbit is a better name, because apo- means "away", but it still not the best, because "away" refers to direction of movement towards exterior, and not to the distance from the center. A body can be moving away, but still be very close to the center. The Greek prefixes meaning "close" and "distant" are "anchi-" and "tele-" (first "e" is long). Therefore much more appropriate names would have been "anchihelion" and "telehelion", for the closest and for the most distant points on the orbit. The prefixes "anchi-" and "tele-" have already been used in the "Iliad" and "Odyssey" of Homer, e.g. for "close combat" (like with swords) and "distant combat" (like with arrows). "Solstice" is a better name, because "-stice" is cognate with "stay" (and with "stand"), and it refers to the fact that during a solstice the apparent movement of the Sun on the sky has a minimum speed, it almost stays in one place. So, for the time interval when the Sun both has a minimum speed of the apparent motion on the sky and is at a minimum distance from us, a term more correct etymologically would have been "anchistice", which is still not optimal, because it combines a Greek prefix with a Latin suffix. Translating "anchi-" into Latin would result in "propistice" (approximately meaning "staying close").

perihelions 2y ago

Happy solstices and merry perihelions to all! If anyone's celebrations urgently need very precise planetary orbital state vectors, for some reason, you can look up current and future ones here: https://ssd.jpl.nasa.gov/horizons/ https://ssd.jpl.nasa.gov/horizons/

jamieplex 2y ago

Merry Crispness, and Happy Gnu Ears

digging 2y ago

> So if it's after the middle of December, start wishing people a "Happy Solsthelion" > ... it's a great way to form the ice. The best part - although perhaps untrue in a room full of HN commenters :)

valiant55 2y ago
Depending on my company I like the classic ice former: "So how do you sell your labor?"

red_admiral 2y ago

Happy Solsthelion! There's a ritual for it: https://thingofthings.substack.com/p/bay-area-secular-solstice-2024-script https://thingofthings.substack.com/p/bay-area-secular-solsti...

ubittibu 2y ago

Due to precession the period is shorter every year. In 2884 solstice and perhelion will be on the same day.

hollerith 2y ago

It'd be wrong for me to flag this for wasting my time (so I'm not going to).

jamietanna 2y ago

Aside if the author is reading: on mobile only 1/3 of the page width is the article, the rest is the sidebar, which makes it hard to read

ColinWright 2y ago
Thanks for the feedback ... regrettably, I have no control over the template. Also, it reads really well on my mobile. I'm not a web programmer, I use what's available, and sadly, sometimes it's crap. If I had another lifetime to spare I might take up front end programming, but I turn 65 next year, I have a very full diary, and it's just not going to happen. 8-(